T Nation

Increasing Raw Total?


#1

Im currently 16 years old, been training for 1.5 years now. My current raw total is 865. Im in the 275 weight class. Anybody got any advice on how to increase it???

355 Squat

275 Deadlift

235 Bench

I take in about 3000 calories a day. 250-300 grams of protein, about 175 grams carbs. Train hard 5 times a week.


#2

How is your deadlift so off from your squat, post videos of your lifts if you can. The biggest for you right now is figuring out how to lift


#3

Not to sound rude but these numbers can’t be correct. My guess is that you squat REALLY high. I can’t imagine your squat to be that much better than your deadlift at that level.


#4

how tall are you?

how have you calculated your calories? 3,000kcals per days for a 16 yr old in the 275 class doesnt sound right.

post up your daily diet.

regarding your training: you’ve given zero information on how you train so it is going to be difficult to see where you can improve.

post up detailed workouts and the weights you’re using for each exercise.


#5

Are these numbers pounds? If so you need to get on a basic linear progression program and milk it for all it’s worth - 3 days per week - 5 days is not needed at your stage in training. Look at starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. I would up your carbs and calories too.

I am a beginner really so you don’t need to listen to me but just my 2 cents - my progress on starting strength is as follows:

Bench - 198x5x3 to 290x5x3
Squat - 150x5x3 to 300x5x3
Deadlift - 350x5 to 485x5

All in 3 months focus on increasing weight every workout and recovery 3 days is plenty for natural trainees.


#6

[quote]Big Al 1983 wrote:
Are these numbers pounds? If so you need to get on a basic linear progression program and milk it for all it’s worth - 3 days per week - 5 days is not needed at your stage in training. Look at starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. I would up your carbs and calories too.

I am a beginner really so you don’t need to listen to me but just my 2 cents - my progress on starting strength is as follows:

Bench - 198x5x3 to 290x5x3
Squat - 150x5x3 to 300x5x3
Deadlift - 350x5 to 485x5

All in 3 months focus on increasing weight every workout and recovery 3 days is plenty for natural trainees.[/quote]

Holy crap! How’s your bench so close to your squat?


#7

A lot of people laugh at me for this!

I tore a hip flexor in December so only just started squatting again! I’m repping what I thought would be good one rep maxes by the end of the year when I started the program - cant believe how effective SS is! Only problem is I am really fat…


#8

16 years old and 275lbs, I can see his mass helping him squat while hindering his deadlift, especially since he hasnt learned to use his leverages yet.

Post some videos, let the experienced guys on here help you.


#9

[quote]Jonas King wrote:
Im currently 16 years old, been training for 1.5 years now. My current raw total is 865. Im in the 275 weight class. Anybody got any advice on how to increase it???

355 Squat

275 Deadlift

235 Bench

I take in about 3000 calories a day. 250-300 grams of protein, about 175 grams carbs. Train hard 5 times a week.[/quote]

At your age and you in the infancy of your lifting you need to get into a basic progression program and let time take its course and get stronger.
3-4 Sets of 6 reps, I wouldn’t worry about 3x3 yet.

You are in the 275lb class at 16, how tall are you?

Do you squat narrow or wide?
Do you deadlift sumo or conventional?
Do you bench with a wide or more shoulder width grip?

These are three things, you have probably not even really thought about.
You will definitely like one more than the other and as you progress you might play with one or the other multiple times until you find one that works best for you.

One last thing, training five days a week, is that five days in a row and the weekend off? Personally if you are training hard, you need to do two days on, one day off and then two days on.

This is just my opinion from reading what you mentioned+.

Power4ull
SQ - 970
BP - 740
DL - 848


#10

[quote]Big Al 1983 wrote:
A lot of people laugh at me for this!

I tore a hip flexor in December so only just started squatting again! I’m repping what I thought would be good one rep maxes by the end of the year when I started the program - cant believe how effective SS is! Only problem is I am really fat…[/quote]

how fat? I have been running 5/3/1 BBB for 3 months and my totals are very similar to yours. (i bench significantly less but my squat and Dl is a little more.

What are your plans as to how to attack being fat? I didn’t want to try to loose weight because i know that noob gainz are crazy awesome and didnt want to miss out on having fun with them. Just don’t know what to do about being a little chubby.


#11

[quote]Koestrizer wrote:
Not to sound rude but these numbers can’t be correct. My guess is that you squat REALLY high. I can’t imagine your squat to be that much better than your deadlift at that level. [/quote]

Of course those numbers can be correct. What an asinine thing to say. The kid is 16. What if his grip strength sucks? What if he has poor leverages for deadlifting but great ones for deadlift? What if he’s been squatting for awhile but just started deadlifting? At his age/ training age, any ratios are possible. You really shouldn’t be spouting off like this if you lack the ability to come up with these very plausible scenarios on your own.


#12

[quote]Benanything wrote:

[quote]Big Al 1983 wrote:
Are these numbers pounds? If so you need to get on a basic linear progression program and milk it for all it’s worth - 3 days per week - 5 days is not needed at your stage in training. Look at starting strength or stronglifts 5x5. I would up your carbs and calories too.

I am a beginner really so you don’t need to listen to me but just my 2 cents - my progress on starting strength is as follows:

Bench - 198x5x3 to 290x5x3
Squat - 150x5x3 to 300x5x3
Deadlift - 350x5 to 485x5

All in 3 months focus on increasing weight every workout and recovery 3 days is plenty for natural trainees.[/quote]

Holy crap! How’s your bench so close to your squat?
[/quote]

Plenty of guys can bench more than they squat. I know a guy who basically benches, deadlifts, and squats right at 500. Spoto benches more than he squats. The highest ranked bench pressers in the world often bench weight that rivals and/or exceeds their squat.

For myself, I hit a 300 bench well before I hit a 300 squat. Not everyone gives a shit about legs when they start training. But EVERYBODY benches. (these days I squat about 150+ more than I bench.)


#13

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Koestrizer wrote:
Not to sound rude but these numbers can’t be correct. My guess is that you squat REALLY high. I can’t imagine your squat to be that much better than your deadlift at that level. [/quote]

Of course those numbers can be correct. What an asinine thing to say. The kid is 16. What if his grip strength sucks? What if he has poor leverages for deadlifting but great ones for deadlift? What if he’s been squatting for awhile but just started deadlifting? At his age/ training age, any ratios are possible. You really shouldn’t be spouting off like this if you lack the ability to come up with these very plausible scenarios on your own.[/quote]

I might have been quick to judge but my guess was especially directed to his young age. A lot of people who start out have either a hard time squatting deep enough or think they squat deeper than they actually do. It is just a thing I see very often in the gym. That is why I am often sceptical when I hear ratios like that. A deadlift is easier measurable than a squat if you have no further information provided. Of course youre scenarios might be true but we would need a video of OP lifting to be sure.


#14

[quote]Joey_Capicola wrote:

[quote]Big Al 1983 wrote:
A lot of people laugh at me for this!

I tore a hip flexor in December so only just started squatting again! I’m repping what I thought would be good one rep maxes by the end of the year when I started the program - cant believe how effective SS is! Only problem is I am really fat…[/quote]

how fat? I have been running 5/3/1 BBB for 3 months and my totals are very similar to yours. (i bench significantly less but my squat and Dl is a little more.

What are your plans as to how to attack being fat? I didn’t want to try to loose weight because i know that noob gainz are crazy awesome and didnt want to miss out on having fun with them. Just don’t know what to do about being a little chubby.
[/quote]

Pretty fat mate - 280 pounds I just ate like a pig when I started linear progression just to make sure I milked it as much as possible. I started weight loss a month ago just by cutting carbs initially. I am down 16 pounds so far and haven’t lost strength but the increases have started to slow significantly. In the long run getting the fat off is probably more important for me as I need to lose another 40 pounds just to be healthy. I wouldn’t worry about being a little chubby while your still smashing the newbie gains.


#15

[quote]Jonas King wrote:
Im currently 16 years old, been training for 1.5 years now. My current raw total is 865. Im in the 275 weight class. Anybody got any advice on how to increase it???

355 Squat

275 Deadlift

235 Bench

I take in about 3000 calories a day. 250-300 grams of protein, about 175 grams carbs. Train hard 5 times a week.[/quote]

531 will help. 5x/wk too much right now. Get the most out of the least. Only add volume if you have to.


#16

Well you can do it 4 ways total.

  1. Increase your squat number.
  2. Increase your bench.
  3. Increase your Deadlift.
  4. Do all the and be a bad ass.

I guess one could also argue drop to lower weight classes while maintaining the same lifts. Not exactly a total increase but a Wilkd Score increase which is arguably more important than over all total.

Also just on a side note. Flip I love you and you know it but I am also very sceptical of the depth of the squat. I have never met a raw lifter at least at the basic begginer level which he is to squat that much more than his Deadlift unless in wraps. Have met many including me whose are very close almost identical at one time but never the unwrapped squat be heavier. UNLESS of an injury. If that the case OP should have mentioned it.


#17

There were 2 main things that made me think that the squat/deadlift thing was reasonable.

One was that he said this was his raw total. I assumed (and now that I think about it, maybe wrongly) that he meant he had a recorded total from a meet. You’re absolutely right that if these are just gym numbers, it could just be a high squat. And probably is if that’s the case. I put 315 on my back and moved it up and down looooong before I actually squatted it…

The other thing though was the fact that this kid is clearly huge. If he’s weighing in at 275 he’s pretty fucking big. I see squat numbers bigger than deadlift numbers in young big guys fairly often, even as beginners.

All that being said though, it’s not particularly pertinent to what the OP should do moving forward, which in my opinion would be 1. lose a large amount of excess fat. That shit is not healthy, and it’s not exactly helping him put up monster numbers. 2. Lift with consistency and intensity. That, at the end of the day, is how one becomes strong.


#18

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
There were 2 main things that made me think that the squat/deadlift thing was reasonable.

One was that he said this was his raw total. I assumed (and now that I think about it, maybe wrongly) that he meant he had a recorded total from a meet. You’re absolutely right that if these are just gym numbers, it could just be a high squat. And probably is if that’s the case. I put 315 on my back and moved it up and down looooong before I actually squatted it…

The other thing though was the fact that this kid is clearly huge. If he’s weighing in at 275 he’s pretty fucking big. I see squat numbers bigger than deadlift numbers in young big guys fairly often, even as beginners.

All that being said though, it’s not particularly pertinent to what the OP should do moving forward, which in my opinion would be 1. lose a large amount of excess fat. That shit is not healthy, and it’s not exactly helping him put up monster numbers. 2. Lift with consistency and intensity. That, at the end of the day, is how one becomes strong.[/quote]

I won’t dispute any of that. Only one point I want to point out is I often see big guys with huge squats over there Deadlift ad well lol they are usually just as high as the begginer who weighs less. But I agree weight loss, strength gain, learn form compete that’s what needs focused on