T Nation

Increases and Recovey

hey guys,

when determining whether you are getting enough recovery is it as simple as saying if from session to session im getting more reps of the same weight or able to increase the weight each workout that the routine isnt to taxing on my body and i am growing due to the icnrease in strength esepcially when working the 8-10 rep range…?

only reason i ask is because although ive made gains looking at past photos of my chest to present it doesnt seem like ive made superb gains compared to the ability to lift alot heavier…currenrtly hitting each muscle one every 5th day considering at the moment once every 6th instead…

would love some oppinions

thanks Anthony

It all depends on your goals. If you want to increase strength, then recovery is based on increase of strength. I prefer to use bio-feedback, not basing my recovery on numbers (though there is nothing wrong with that) but how i feel and how motivated i am.

Results take time based on your workout, and your genetics. If your workout isnt producing results, change it up.

i train mostly for aesthetics i do love the strength gains aswell but primarily train to look good…i thought though if my number were increasing each session then surely to be getting stronger i must be getting bigger :S

That seems to be the general consensus that increase in lbs = increase muscle mass. It worked for me years ago. After I returned to working out seriously, i stopped focusing on numbers, and focused on tension on the muscle. I focus on the mind/muscle connection, proper form, accelerated concentric, high volume, and this had me pass the size i was before without a drop of a supplement except protein shakes that i keep forgetting to take (when before i took a shit-load of supplements).

I would focus on compound for size- its more bang for your buck, though i would never avoid isolation unless you want to switch things temporarily. And i wouldnt worry about over-training until it happens, then learn and adjust (over-training from frequency, not constant heavy loads). 8 months ago i couldnt do 12 sets without collapsing, and i would panic if i passed the 60 min mark that books say might start the catabolic process, now i am flirting with 30+ sets and i can go on for an hr and a half.

I notice i cant do more than 3 days straight of working out, this was trial and error for me. I dont care about strength, besides, strength means many things. I know strong guys with crazy 1 set maximums, yet cant last 10 minutes moving light furniture, strength can mean a lot of things, like strength+speed in acceleration, or strength endurance, etc.

But, to get big, you need to eat big. You dont get magical calories coming from the weights.

Definitely makers sense ill keep at it over the next 3-4months and continue to record what i eat lift and my weight every morning and see what happens…i concentrate on the big compound lifts and dedicate the most sets to these…my longest workout probly hits the hour and 10 mark and this is only on back/trap/bi day as i have had lower back injury in the past and really try to focus 10-15mins warming up my back before doing deadlifts

i honestly have never given one a week frequency a honest go mayb its worth giving it a crack and seeing what it does for me…i just feel so lazy as by the time i get to traing that muscle group again i feel like i havent trained it in ages…even during recovery i feel like i could lift 4 days after so why wait the 7 but mayb to grow i need to allow longer…

what are your thoughts on protein synthesis only last 3-4 days ie muscle will be recovered within 3-4 days as thats aslong as protein sysnthesis will last if kept natural??

just one other piece of advice guys, on non training days do you cut back your calories if so by how much also…

Thanks Anthony

I dont use any supplements. I have a tub of protein in my kitchen that i forget to take, or dont because i sometimes dont want to use up the milk (i cant drink these shakes with just water). I will start buying up supplements when i hopefully land a job this week, and when i do, i will stock up on protein only to get my 200lbs of protein per day number. I might take up creatin maybe, though for some reason that shit freaks me out. But, for the past 9 months since i started training again, i havent needed anything. I actually use coffee as a energy-booster for training- but thats just me.

But, i would never take it as far to keep track of protien synthesis. I just bust ass with the weights.

I also dont cut back on calories on any day. I dont track anything, i just eat big and avoid as much dumb shit as possible. If i wanted to get shredded for some reason, or get that six pack poking out better, i would give a shit, but genetically, i can get away with the damage.

[quote]anthvi88 wrote:
hey guys,

when determining whether you are getting enough recovery is it as simple as saying if from session to session im getting more reps of the same weight or able to increase the weight each workout that the routine isnt to taxing on my body and i am growing due to the icnrease in strength esepcially when working the 8-10 rep range…?

only reason i ask is because although ive made gains looking at past photos of my chest to present it doesnt seem like ive made superb gains compared to the ability to lift alot heavier…currenrtly hitting each muscle one every 5th day considering at the moment once every 6th instead…

would love some oppinions

thanks Anthony[/quote]
Post your diet.

48-72hrs

[quote]RePz wrote:
I might take up creatin maybe, though for some reason that shit freaks me out.[/quote]
Haha. Why?

OP what is your height/weight and what are your lifts?

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

[quote]RePz wrote:
I might take up creatin maybe, though for some reason that shit freaks me out.[/quote]
Haha. Why?
[/quote]

Some people i know swear they got kidney stones from it. My dad gets that naturally, and if its a myth or not, i would still just rather avoid it as possible.

As much as I love the iPhone I’ll post my diet tonight when I’m home lol I’m also toying with the idea of putting a direct arm day in at the moment im training chest/tris back/bis

Thinking
chest(one heavy tri)
Back(heavy dumbell curls)
Legs
Shoulders/arms (3exetcisrs for each)

Only thing I don’t like is my frequency will be 2on 1 off 2pn 1off n I’m moving from 5dayagreement between muscles to a 6 n I have been making great progress at a 5 day…ATM my arms measure 16.5inchs tenses n I’m 195lb…guess just toying to see whether it will be beneficial in my arm training or not

If you’re not growing you are probably not recovering well enough…

A few things could be wrong.

You either need to eat more or better quality foods.

Your training lacks intensity.

You may need extra rest days.

Sometimes however you may be training not frequently enough. If I want to increase certain lifts like presses, I respond best to training them at least two times per week. Typically one heavy session, one lighter session.

[quote]RePz wrote:

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

[quote]RePz wrote:
I might take up creatin maybe, though for some reason that shit freaks me out.[/quote]
Haha. Why?
[/quote]

Some people i know swear they got kidney stones from it. My dad gets that naturally, and if its a myth or not, i would still just rather avoid it as possible. [/quote]

There are plenty of studies proving the effectiveness of creatine as well as its safety. I don’t mean to be harsh, but I would avoid the advice of mom/dad/girlfriend/wife/grandma, because their obtained information typically comes from unreliable sources, not published medical literature.

[quote]zonaguy10 wrote:

[quote]RePz wrote:

[quote]Maiden3.16 wrote:

[quote]RePz wrote:
I might take up creatin maybe, though for some reason that shit freaks me out.[/quote]
Haha. Why?
[/quote]

Some people i know swear they got kidney stones from it. My dad gets that naturally, and if its a myth or not, i would still just rather avoid it as possible. [/quote]

There are plenty of studies proving the effectiveness of creatine as well as its safety. I don’t mean to be harsh, but I would avoid the advice of mom/dad/girlfriend/wife/grandma, because their obtained information typically comes from unreliable sources, not published medical literature. [/quote]

Honestly, companies have deep pockets. Just because studies show this and that doesnt mean i will follow blindly. I am sure there are many things that were considered good, that are now considered bad. I have read about how creatine is the supplement with the most studies, but it doesnt mean years from now some new research will come out of the woodwork. Plus, you have to question this research, creatine is “natural”, they study that, then its a natural source they are tapping into, if they study a supplement industries creatine, its a whole new study- and i realize fda isnt too involved in the supplement industry since its not considered a drug (and even then, fda makes a looooot of mistakes).

So, no, i dont listen to my grandma as you put it. I listen to lifters, and they have had those side effects that is “rumored” to be tied to creatine, yet they never read about the rumors.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/creatine/NS_patient-creatine/DSECTION=safety

been bit busy with the usual eating traing and sleeping but as far as diet goes…

6.00am
1 cup oats
1 wegiht gainer
2 cups skim milk (875cals)

9.30am
100g Pasta
Can Tuna
1 Piece Fruit (530cals)

1.00pm
250g Chicken Tenderloins
150g Brown Rice
20g Avocado (625Cals)

4.30pm
200g Chicken Tenderloins
100g Rice
Peanut Butter Sandwich (580Cals)

6.00pm-6.30
Prework Out SHake Then Training)

PWO
Protein/Creatine
1 Raw Egg
Bannana (420Cals)

7.45pm
250g Chicken Breast or 200-300g Lean Red Meat
150g Brown Rice
Brocoli (500 Cals)

10.15pm
Shake
1 Cup Skim Milk (340cals)

Total Cals - 3870
Protein 395g
Carbs 396g
Fats 90g

These are rough very close but wouldnt be absolutely exact…I currently weigh bout 196LB and as i work as a carpenter and have some lazy days and some active days depedning i also snack on about 50gs Raw Almosds and some dried fruit during work days…Drinking about 5-6Litres water per day.

My weight has been increasing and bodyfat would be around 14%…

My Training is 2 days on 1 day off 1 day on 1 day off
Currently Back/Bis, Chest/Tri, Off, Legs/Shoulders, Off, Repeat
Training Traps on back Day

All my workouts are around the hour to 75minutes max…

At the moment i feel mostly with my bis that after a heavy session on back they’re pretty shot and i dont feel im lifting less then i could be…

Im currently toying with the idea of mayb traing 4 straight days and 1 day off and adding possibly shoulder/arm day in between chest and legs… or possibly just keeping the rest days and adding a day at the end of the week…Each session my lifts are progressing especially my Deadlift, Squat and DB Bench Press…

what are some of your thoughts on adding the extra day…i must admit i really like the every 5 day frequency (or twice a week) as i find the volume of work and frequencyis responisble for my fast increses and progress…

i appreicate your guys experience and knowlege and if their is any oppinion on diet let me know

thanks again