T Nation

In Search of Tried and True Advice/Educational Resources

I’m 33, been lifting for years. Im strictly a powerbuilder (I fancy myself a powerlifter but never compete). I’m ready to give my first cycle a go. Goals are to add strength, look a little more like I lift (I get aggravated at the dudes in the gyms who look great but can’t lift for shit), and trim up a bit. Couldn’t give a damn about being peeled, 10% is perfectly fine. When I was a lot younger I did a cycle of dbol and I loved it. I can’t remember any details, was basically a bag from a dude and I took what he said. I’d rather be a bit more educated than that. I don’t mind reading for information so I am open to cycle suggestions and/or resources that I can look for myself. There’s is too much information floating around the internet. I’d rather just skip the bullshit and get it straight. Thanks fellas for any guidance you can give me.

2 Likes

That’s because the guys that look great are training for hypertrophy. I’d recommend doing that if you want that look more. There’s a reason bodybuilders look bigger then power lifters even tho the power lifters are generally stronger

Thanks for the input

1 Like

I’d say hypertrophy and strength are inversely correlated with one another (to varying degrees)… The powerlifter may be far stronger at a smaller size (CNS adaptation, efficient use f fine motor recruitment units etc) but it isn’t to say the bodybuilder is “weak”

I think you’d be pressed to find a guy with a gigantic chest, huge triceps and massive shoulders who can’t bench 225… You’d also be hard pressed to find a guy with no muscle tone whatsoever, 12 inch biceps etc pressing the same weight

You say you’re a power builder, so I assume you implement bodybuilding style training into you’re routine… the truth is, most powerlifters do too… it’s not all just about compound lifts, low volume and heavy weights. accessory work is very important

2 Likes

Ofcourse the body builder isn’t weak. Wasn’t saying that. But as far as one rep maxes go a power lifter in the same level of a body builder( as in not an amateur power lifter vs a pro body builder) will be able to lift more

1 Like

I completely agree. My 1RM for bench is 155KG. Twice a week I train bench. Often around sets of 5 at 120ish. Yet here I stand, no barrel chest or massive arms (triceps are definitely decent though)

1 Like

This is another thing. Power lifters bench differently then body builders. My IFBB trainer tells me to grow a chest you need to “chest press” . Meaning u need to retract your shoulders, lower the weight, and really get that mind muscle connection. A lot of big powerlifters don’t even have massive chests because of the way powerlifters bench, a lot more tricep use. Back use etc. just depends on your priorities. Like my trainer said when he was a powerlifters (before he got into bodybuilding) he was crushing 500 pounds on bench and had zero chest.

1 Like

That’s true… tbh I don’t even think bench press is required to build a massive chest… EMG’s (which gives an estimate of muscular activation… so not the best… but anyhow) indicate DB chest presses give off superior activation regarding the pectoralis major compared to barbell BP

I think a fantastic chest could be built off dips, flies and one pressing variation alone

I don’t disagree with you at all. That’s why I’m posting in the pharma forum, not a training one. I’m looking for advice on how to use drugs in order to give me an edge I otherwise wouldn’t have.

1 Like

Yeah my bad sorry lol I kind of side tracked your post

1 Like

No worries bro, a good discussion is always worth it.

2 Likes

Drug advice… I can dispense advice (that some will agree or disagree with) regarding the risks involved… but I can’t dispense advice regarding what to use, what dosages are “safe” because there is no “safe” dosage in terms of cycling

However this is probably not territory that I should be providing advice within… I’ve been copping some flack for some of my posts recently both in this Pharma section and on other sections of this website, so I’ll let others do the talking here

1 Like

Personal experience is valuable regardless of people’s opinion.

Give us some stats please, height / weight, possibly starting photos, more in depth goals etc? Have you run labs yet? I highly advise getting your baseline before taking TRT or cycling. Tell your doc you have low T symptoms and ask him to test TT, FT, E2, FSH, LH, and SHBG. That way you know where you started and hell you may even be a TRT candidate. Keep in mind you may not recover your prior levels and end up on TRT. You may ‘pay to play’. Do you have kids already or plans to conceive in the near future?

33 years old, 5’9" 190lb @approx 15-17% bf.
Goals:
long term strength goals
600lb Deadlift (current 525)
500lb squat (current 415)
400lb bench (current 340)
Physique goals (I consider as secondary)
I’d like to be a lean (10%) 190-200lbs

I did get labs done last year. But only for test. I’ll dig up the results and post them here. I am a TRT candidate.

I have 4 kids. We are definitely not planning on more.

SHBG: 26.22
Total T: 377
Free T: 8.41 / 2.2%
Bioavailable T: 207 / 55%

Lab ranges:
SHBG: 18.3 - 54.1
TOTAL: 249 - 836
FREE: 5.71 - 17.48 / 1.53 - 2.88
BIO: 125 - 412 / 35 - 66.3%

Awesome, great info. If your end goal is TRT I would start that and get dialed in. I made the majority of my gains on TRT alone and not much more from cycling. If not typical first cycles are long ester test (Cyp or Enth) 300-500mg/wk total divided into two pins. Typical lengths are 10-12 weeks followed by a 4 week off period and then a PCT of Nolvadex 40/40/20/20 for four weeks. Some choose to add in an oral of say dbol or anavar as a finisher. If you are on TRT you don’t need PCT obviously. I don’t like dispensing advice as in ‘here is what you should do’ but rather explain the ‘typical’ route and let the user choose their own fate / risk tolerance.

A cycle won’t make you drop 5% in BF. That’s all diet my friend. IMO you get to your desired BF first then cycle.

1 Like

Where did you end up on your TRT dosage? That’s not necessarily a goal but if that’s what works then I’m good with it. The idea behind a anabolic cycle for me was a jump start to add some decent size, then cut with minimal risk of losing anything.

Thanks for the reply.

Will a good TRT dose assist here? I have a very hard time cutting weight. I usually hit a very hard wall at around maybe 12%bf. I get super depressed, completely unmotivated for pretty much anything (including sex), strength absolutely plummets. For a guy who values strength training very highly, I find it difficult to push beyond that particular point.

Not to say my chest is all that impressive, however it’s decently built… and I almost never BB press. Dumbbells allow for far more range of motion and stretch, flies and dips and a DB press has been plenty for me.

On the topic of power lifting vs body building. It’s definitely dependent on the individual.

At 145lbs I was benching 275 and Romanian dead lifting 405. I’m now 191lbs and doubt I could bench 275. My dumbbells only go up to 110lbs. I RDL 405 still but typically reps of 5 at most.

I DID NOT grow while lifting that heavy at 145lbs. Focusing on slow eccentric motion and making lighter weights feel heavier AND doing reps of 8-12 have dramatically helped my size.

Everyone is different.