Wouldn’t these increase the hypertrophy of your heart if you are also taking anabolics? Would lower intensity cardio training be more beneficial to your cardio and not necessarily “increase” LVH or other non preferential cardiac changes? I am curious about this as well. I would “think” that lower intensity training would be preferential if you have a higher anabolic environment, as to not hypertrophy the heart, but to still get benefits of cardio training. Maybe someone more educated can chime in?
But i believe that NFL superstars and Crossfiters drop dead much less than bodybuilders do. And the drug use is simmilar for sure. Look at some of those Crossfit chicks.
Now I am going to need a long bathroom break at work. Thanks a lot @hankthetank89
I do think cardio is important. While using AAS, I probably wouldn’t over do it though. Also, I think a lot of cardio is needed to get athlete’s heart, so most could probably do a lot more than they are currently doing.
Conditioning and GPP is really important to some people here, I follow their logs.
You’ve made me realize they aren’t the ones doing the AAS.
I wasn’t doing cardio for heart health, I was doing it to increase work capacity.
yea, just check out Dani Speegle and Josie Hamming…
i also believe that the heart hypertrophy that comes from exercise is not the same as the bad kind… i read somewhere that “exercise enduced LVH” is considered normal.
Read it. Then you’ll at least have some idea where that potential diastolic dysfunction / hypertrophy came from and whether it’s physiologic CH (athlete’s heart - hard cardio) or pathologic (e.g., fibrosis related - AAS).
Light or Hard cardio ain’t going to ameliorate AAS-induced interstitial collagen.
I know diastolic dysfunction grade 1 (aka HFpEF) is a boring foreign concept till you read it on your Echo after noticing a falling off in your workout power and wondering what gives and seeing a cardiologist:
My own little dose of reality.
Is it the end of the world? Maybe not. For you invincible youngsters…Is it something you want to deal with down the line? One way to find out.
When you sup with the devil make sure you have a long spoon or however that saying goes.
Well worth the read. Multiple times to let it sink in.
Bad luck for you… My echocardiogram is perfect …
How long did you ‘experiment’ for prior to a-fib episode?
I have been thinking of doing this one myself but i dont think i would want to know if its bad… i mean, i wouldnt really change shit even if its bad, so its maybe better not knowing… i really enjoy the idea of a sudden heart attack instead of living in fear or sickness for years.
I’d change one lifestyle parameter if it was bad.
A lifestyle parameter I don’t intend to keep with me long term regardless.
My LVEF is 60-65% for reference (I’ve had a few over the years) Cardiac parameters aren’t even close to being enlarged/dysfunctional.
I believe that the only change that could help if something is a bit off is exactly the one thing i am not willing to change for the next 10-15 years.
So its probably smarter for me to just live and hope i can wake up at 45, say that im done, do the echo and get the results that say i am at least somewhat “ok”…
Other than that i would rather die all of a sudden in a set of burpies and be done with it, instead of living in a way i was not planning to.
I already have changed my views on gear dosages, as my current new blast is 200mg test and 100mg tren. Im not willing to change even more lol
a lot of what @readalot has said. AAS causes physiological changes with the CVS that cardio alone cannot ameliorate. Cardio is certainly necessary, and doing it is better than not doing it, but you need to understand that running cycles is changing the heart and blood vessels as it is the pecs and biceps you look at in the mirror. Risk goes with the game.
I wonder what the affect on patients just using TRT doses?
if it changes the heart at the same rate, then im fine, lol… maybe going by how much you gain from steroids you can also know how much it fucks your heart, haha… my pecs dont get anything from steroids, so maybe my heart is ok also
Dude you are 21 (22?) YO. Congrats though. Mine looked great at 25. Come see me in a couple/few decades and I hope it’s still perfect.
2 years. It will be informative to watch my own numbers play out over time.
I’m actually 200 years old
You live a healthy lifestyle and to my knowledge you don’t drink, smoke or use recreational drugs known to elicit a cardiotoxic effect. I don’t know how long you took steroids for, but somehow I can’t forsee you developing CHF anytime soon.
Your echo is borderline, you exercise a ton and I’m assuming you’re the type to take various risk mitigation strategies.
The amount of physical activity I partake in on a daily basis can’t be good for my heart… I work a physical job around seven to eight hours per day, I tracked my steps and aside from frequently lifting awkward objects I’m walking like 15-20 kilometres during that timeframe. Then there’s lifting weights and combat sports, this is all typically in the same day.
The amount of pain and discomfort I’m in most days is absolutely unbelievable. This isn’t permenant though, only until I leave the country, at which point I’ll have saved up a nice amount of money and I can give my body a break… Just gym + a bit (instead of a lot) of combat sports then, no physical labour
I shared the value…2 years on and off very modest ND and oxandrolone use (38 weeks total for ND with average of 80-100 mg/week and about 10 weeks of oxandrolone cumulative at maybe 15 mg/day). I think the relatively modest TRT dosing isn’t helping either (I gave the example of a 400 ng/dl dude at baseline running 1200 ng/dl peak and 500 ng/dl trough).
I shared my data not to indicate that I am CHF’ing tomorrow but just to show that you can do EVERYTHING right except play with Rx AAS and still do some damage if your genes aren’t compatible. The EXCESS exercise may also present an issue. That’s why I was such a pain in the ass a couple of weeks ago on “safer” methods and risk reduction rather than “safe” methods.
Cheers and what the hell is going on in Australia my dude? My true condolences.
Really excellent point. AAS risk/reward was historically presented as androgen/anabolic ratio. But another risk/reward ratio is the anabolic ratio of an internal muscle (heart) vs skeletal muscle. Some of us may get all the GAINZ on the ole ticker! They sure don’t show up very much on the delts and pecs.
It’s really… REALLY bad
That’s why I’m leaving for a long time… If I can find a sustainable way to live overseas and things don’t return to normal I don’t think I’ll come back
At this point in time I’m very angry over the way Australians have advocated for this, how we have cheered on as the government stranded their own citizens overseas for two years (tip of the iceberg my friend). I don’t want to come back, though I know when I’m gone I’ll miss the hell out of my family, my dog… That’s about it, I don’t have much keeping me here.
Even as we’ve “opened up” a few days ago substantial restrictions are still in place. The police state mentality is very much omnipresent. Look up the pandemic legislature being tabled in Victoria… It’s unbelievably authoritarian, arguably allows the premier to rule by decree. Western Australia is still locked out from the rest of Aus, so Paris before Perth has become a reality… And western Australia has zero covid…
Two words Brother…Ron DeSantis. You may want to check out a state in the US that starts with an F and ends with an A.