T Nation

If You Like Your Internet, You Can Keep It


#1

Just as with Obamacare, it seems like the people that are most for a government take over of the internet know the least about it.


#2

As far as the Tumblr CEO goes it is a win for them. They can continue to provide services at a x cost with the providers eating the infrastructure cost. It is absolutely a win for the Netflix’s, Facebooks, etc…

I’m torn on the issue and really don’t want to argue about it again…


#3

[quote]Alrightmiami19c wrote:

Just as with Obamacare, it seems like the people that are most for a government take over of ANYTHING know the least about EVERYTHING.[/quote]

Fixed that for you.


#4

BY SETH G. MACYUPDATE: The FCC has passed the Net Neutrality rules to treat internet providers as “common carriers” under Title II of the Telecommunications Act.


#5

Infrastructure will soon be paid for via tax dollars…


#6

Yes, government regulation of the internet. I’m sure they wont fuck that up.


#7

Well, phones work…


#8

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Well, phones work…[/quote]

Ever notice how telephone poles and lines are still pretty much the same they were decades ago, and everyone uses these fancy things brought to us by the free market? Cell Phones?

Hmmm…


#9

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Well, phones work…[/quote]

Ever notice how telephone poles and lines are still pretty much the same they were decades ago, and everyone uses these fancy things brought to us by the free market? Cell Phones?

Hmmm… [/quote]

Lets not undersell the fact that cell phones made land lines almost obsolete so I’m not sure it makes sense to put a bunch of money into land line R&D. I’m not sure how much R&D is really needed for land lines anyway.

We’ll see what happens though.

I’m curious what a company like Google will do now in regards to their high speed network experiment. There’s obviously still money to be made.


#10

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Well, phones work…[/quote]

Ever notice how telephone poles and lines are still pretty much the same they were decades ago, and everyone uses these fancy things brought to us by the free market? Cell Phones?

Hmmm… [/quote]

Lets not undersell the fact that cell phones made land lines almost obsolete so I’m not sure it makes sense to put a bunch of money into land line R&D. I’m not sure how much R&D is really needed for land lines anyway. [/quote]

You’re kind of missing the point here.

They didn’t do any “R&D”, at all. They had no reason to, the government regulated away any hope of competition.

And then along came cell phones… Which were taken above and beyond because of the market.


#11

There would be no reason for a company to invest billions in infrastructure, if they cannot recoup their investment.


#12

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
Well, phones work…[/quote]

Ever notice how telephone poles and lines are still pretty much the same they were decades ago, and everyone uses these fancy things brought to us by the free market? Cell Phones?

Hmmm… [/quote]

Lets not undersell the fact that cell phones made land lines almost obsolete so I’m not sure it makes sense to put a bunch of money into land line R&D. I’m not sure how much R&D is really needed for land lines anyway. [/quote]

You’re kind of missing the point here.

They didn’t do any “R&D”, at all. They had no reason to, the government regulated away any hope of competition.

And then along came cell phones… Which were taken above and beyond because of the market.
[/quote]

There is no reason to innovate for a number of reasons including because of government intervention. No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

That would be like me getting upset that no money has been spent on telegraph R&D.

You’re right though, I’m missing something because there is land line competition. Companies still compete over subscribers. Land lines aren’t free as far as I know (I don’t have one).


#13

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
There would be no reason for a company to invest billions in infrastructure, if they cannot recoup their investment.

[/quote]

True, but there are a lot of untapped customers especially in rural areas without broadband. I don’t know the numbers so I’ve no idea if it’s cost effective now or if it ever will be.


#14

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

[/quote]

Sigh… I’m doing a shit job trying to make my point.

What year did the cell phone become cheap enough to be widely used enough to truly replace a land line? Late 90’s early 2000’s at best?

Fucking telephone poles have looked the same since the dawn of mankind.

That’s my point. they weren’t doing shit once they got off the switch board. The most “telephone” innovation we had prior to the cell was a head set and cordless.


#15

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

[/quote]

Sigh… I’m doing a shit job trying to make my point.

What year did the cell phone become cheap enough to be widely used enough to truly replace a land line? Late 90’s early 2000’s at best?

Fucking telephone poles have looked the same since the dawn of mankind.

That’s my point. they weren’t doing shit once they got off the switch board. The most “telephone” innovation we had prior to the cell was a head set and cordless. [/quote]

I understand what you’re saying.

My perspective would be (1) how much better can land lines actually get (I’ve no idea), (2) do we actually know companies didn’t invest in R&D for land lines, and (3) don’t things like cordless phones count as innovation? Perhaps that’s just hardware innovation so no, but at this point isn’t the land line infrastructure pretty much tapped out? Is there any place in America where a land line can’t be connected (I don’t know)?

That is not the case for broadband internet and my guess is innovation will still occur especially in the area of wireless broadband. Plus, look at Google Fiber, if they continue doing what they’re doing they could claim the entire market. The speed of their test network is insane.


#16

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

[/quote]

Sigh… I’m doing a shit job trying to make my point.

What year did the cell phone become cheap enough to be widely used enough to truly replace a land line? Late 90’s early 2000’s at best?

Fucking telephone poles have looked the same since the dawn of mankind.

That’s my point. they weren’t doing shit once they got off the switch board. The most “telephone” innovation we had prior to the cell was a head set and cordless. [/quote]

I understand what you’re saying.

My perspective would be (1) how much better can land lines actually get (I’ve no idea), (2) do we actually know companies didn’t invest in R&D for land lines, and (3) don’t things like cordless phones count as innovation? Perhaps that’s just hardware innovation so no, but at this point isn’t the land line infrastructure pretty much tapped out? Is there any place in America where a land line can’t be connected (I don’t know)?

That is not the case for broadband internet and my guess is innovation will still occur especially in the area of wireless broadband. Plus, look at Google Fiber, if they continue doing what they’re doing they could claim the entire market. The speed of their test network is insane. [/quote]

Wasn’t Tesla already working on plans to power the entire world wirelessly?

Don’t fucking poles still go down in storms leaving thousands without power for weeks at a time?

We’ve landed on the moon, and are planning on Mars. Does a wooden pole with a wire hanging off it really strike you as the apex of technological advances for a species capable of the nuclear bomb?

If telephones won wars we’d be laughing so hard at the suckers that had “poles” 60 years ago.


#17

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

[/quote]

Sigh… I’m doing a shit job trying to make my point.

What year did the cell phone become cheap enough to be widely used enough to truly replace a land line? Late 90’s early 2000’s at best?

Fucking telephone poles have looked the same since the dawn of mankind.

That’s my point. they weren’t doing shit once they got off the switch board. The most “telephone” innovation we had prior to the cell was a head set and cordless. [/quote]

I understand what you’re saying.

My perspective would be (1) how much better can land lines actually get (I’ve no idea), (2) do we actually know companies didn’t invest in R&D for land lines, and (3) don’t things like cordless phones count as innovation? Perhaps that’s just hardware innovation so no, but at this point isn’t the land line infrastructure pretty much tapped out? Is there any place in America where a land line can’t be connected (I don’t know)?

That is not the case for broadband internet and my guess is innovation will still occur especially in the area of wireless broadband. Plus, look at Google Fiber, if they continue doing what they’re doing they could claim the entire market. The speed of their test network is insane. [/quote]

Wasn’t Tesla already working on plans to power the entire world wirelessly?

Don’t fucking poles still go down in storms leaving thousands without power for weeks at a time?

We’ve landed on the moon, and are planning on Mars. Does a wooden pole with a wire hanging off it really strike you as the apex of technological advances for a species capable of the nuclear bomb?

If telephones won wars we’d be laughing so hard at the suckers that had “poles” 60 years ago. [/quote]

I thought Telephone lines were now connected to internet/cable lines?

My parents live in an area that was developed in the early 2000s there isn’t a telephone pole or above ground line, insight.


#18

[quote]Phoenix44e wrote:

My parents live in an area that was developed in the early 2000s there isn’t a telephone pole or above ground line, insight.
[/quote]

I mean, I get you guys are young, but there was life in the world prior to the advent of the cheap enough for everyone cell phone plan.


#19

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]Phoenix44e wrote:

My parents live in an area that was developed in the early 2000s there isn’t a telephone pole or above ground line, insight.
[/quote]

I mean, I get you guys are young, but there was life in the world prior to the advent of the cheap enough for everyone cell phone plan. [/quote]

I understand that. You were talking about how you felt that telephone companies hadn’t advanced in x amount of years.
My only point was that taking them from telephone poles and putting them underground would be a sign of advancement.


#20

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

No argument there, but you can’t just ignore the fact that the cell phone innovation basically made the land line phone obsolete.

[/quote]

Sigh… I’m doing a shit job trying to make my point.

What year did the cell phone become cheap enough to be widely used enough to truly replace a land line? Late 90’s early 2000’s at best?

Fucking telephone poles have looked the same since the dawn of mankind.

That’s my point. they weren’t doing shit once they got off the switch board. The most “telephone” innovation we had prior to the cell was a head set and cordless. [/quote]

I understand what you’re saying.

My perspective would be (1) how much better can land lines actually get (I’ve no idea), (2) do we actually know companies didn’t invest in R&D for land lines, and (3) don’t things like cordless phones count as innovation? Perhaps that’s just hardware innovation so no, but at this point isn’t the land line infrastructure pretty much tapped out? Is there any place in America where a land line can’t be connected (I don’t know)?

That is not the case for broadband internet and my guess is innovation will still occur especially in the area of wireless broadband. Plus, look at Google Fiber, if they continue doing what they’re doing they could claim the entire market. The speed of their test network is insane. [/quote]

Wasn’t Tesla already working on plans to power the entire world wirelessly?
[/quote]

Not sure.

[quote]
Don’t fucking poles still go down in storms leaving thousands without power for weeks at a time? [/quote]

Yes. Doesn’t the internet still go out in storms leaving thousands without internet access? Doesn’t cable / satellite go out in storms leaving thousands without internet access? Why hasn’t the free market fix that?

[quote]
We’ve landed on the moon, and are planning on Mars. [/quote]
Govenment project that gave us a lot of pretty sweet tech, right? The door swings both ways sometimes.

[quote]
Does a wooden pole with a wire hanging off it really strike you as the apex of technological advances for a species capable of the nuclear bomb? [/quote]
The apex for an obsolete technology, sure. The only people I know that use land lines are old people and businesses and the old are dying and businesses are switching to VOIP.

[quote]
If telephones won wars we’d be laughing so hard at the suckers that had “poles” 60 years ago. [/quote]

Sure, but the technology that won war II is obsolete today just like land lines.