T Nation

I Know, Another Rotator Cuff Post

OK so heres the deal… before i decided to post on here i’ve spent the past two weeks reading just about rotator cuff article on T-Nation and anything else i can find in medical journals and just googling. All that taught me that rotator cuff issues and shoulder issues in general are very unique to each person who has them. Theres so many different things it could actually be, and different parts of the shoulder too.

I’m super poor and I have no health insurance so I’m trying to get a good idea what the problem is before I go to the doctor. If its obvious what it is to some of you out there who maybe are in the medical field or have had what i have before, and whatever it is doesnt require me to go to the doctor it would be a big help in saving money. If after this post no one has a clue then i’ll just have to take the big hit and go pay someone to tell me “oh ice it and dont lift”…

So First off heres where it is. Its in the front of the shoulder, where the shoulder and pec muscle meet. I have full range of motion, and there is no swelling, and there never was any swelling either.

Its not the shoulder muscle, and its not the pec muscle. Its something inside (pretty sure its the tendon) heres where its kinda strange. I can military press just fine… infact it does not affect me or give me any pain whatsoever to push straight up or push up at an angle (incline press). I can pull straight to my body with any pulling exercises.

Heres where it does hurt and i have no strength. Pushing straight away from my body (bench/push up) and I’m weaker but still pretty strong. Any pushing in the downward motion (decline press/dips) and I cant do it… like I’m dead. Any pulling straight down like a pull up and im dead. I just cant do it.

Heres how i injured it. I was doing weighted dips, which i normally do. 4 sets of 10 with 90 lbs chained to me. I can easily do this and have been doing it for a couple of months now. What happened was on the last set i got sloppy and wasnt thinking and went past 90 degrees in my arm and it was too much for the shoulder joint. I didnt realize i was injured for a few days actually. I felt like “wow i got a good work out in my shoulder/pec” Then five days later when i went to bench my bench went down by like 60 lbs. Thats when i knew it wasnt a good sore.

Since then I ice it every night and pop Ibuprofen, downing like 12 fish pills a day, massaging it, not doing any push or pull work outs…the whole nine yards of what I’ve read online to do. its three weeks later and I tried to just grab onto the pull up bar last night and do a pull up and i couldnt do one! Normally i do sets of 10 with 50 lbs chained to me so if i cant do one thats really really bad.

So is this Tendinitis, tendinosis, is my tendon torn?
Keep in mind theres no swelling or topical signs theres anything wrong. And I am 100 percent pressing up or pull straight in… but i am 0 percent pushing down, pulling across my body, or pulling straight down.

Anyone?s opinion?s are welcomed, but i know theres a few docs on here so if you can possibly save me hundreds of dollars then thanks! Or any old timers and veterans who im sure have gone thru this.

You seriously need to get to a physiotherapist for treatment. I suffered a ‘crunch’ in my left delt after a “spotter” snatched the barbell back after I’d completed a set of incline chest presses. I tried the RICE method and actually never resorted to clinical treatment until NINE MONTHS later (stopped training aferwards). The phsysio warned me the lapse may result in chronic rotator cuff problems. To my relief, the shoulder responded after about 2-3 sessions of ultrasound. However, I’ve had to be careful ever since and avoid certain movements while always incorporating rotator cuff exercises and stretches.

Bottom line: drop the pain killers - and the gym (unless you can train legs, etc, with zero affect on the shoulder) and get professional help. Chances are you’ve suffered no more than a pinching/stretching of the tendon and it will respond to treatment very quickly.

You don’t want an E-diagnosis, that’s for sure.

Not sure if it would help or not, but I’ve had rotator cuff issues the last two years or so. I’ve been doing these:

And have had great results. I’d look up the actual guidelines that Dante has set for it, though.

sounds almost identical to my own current shoulder injury. tried all the things you have and even tried not training for a while (which seemed to make it worse). have just started having remedial massage and a session of ultrasound. the therapist said after the first session my front delt was like massaging a block of wood, but it has lossened up significantly since and my bench numbers are starting to creep back up again, but still with a little pain. i also introduced the turkish get up as a rehab excercise twice a week which also seems to be helping.i do some shoulder mobility drills most days to make sure the joint is fully warmed up to.

my advice don’t leave it. you may have a micro tear in the muscle somewhere and that “dead” spot will just stop flexing and what happens is the body will compensate, meaning you get mscle imbalances cropping up all over the place, which again will need sorting out at some point.

good luck.

You must see a sports physio. Either ultrasound or electro-acupuncture usually do good stuff. most of the rest of it is horse shit.

Too bad you all dont have a health care system.

-chris

[quote]SSC wrote:
You don’t want an E-diagnosis, that’s for sure.

Not sure if it would help or not, but I’ve had rotator cuff issues the last two years or so. I’ve been doing these:

And have had great results. I’d look up the actual guidelines that Dante has set for it, though.[/quote]

I do those too before every workout and my shoulder never gets hurt anymore.

Also I do what Waterbury does and start out with a pulling exercise to warm my shoulder up for a pushing exercise.

Seems to help.

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:

Thw pain was a dull throb originally. After a while it becuase a very sharp pain. Here’s what I would do if I were you.

-two weeks off of pressing.
-Ice shoulder every day before bed
-ibuprofen 3x a day for the next few weeks
-FISH OIL
-the first week off pressing, don’t do any upper back work add that in during the second week.
-at the start of the second week start doing dumbell pro/retractions


-Bring up your DB row and chin (if painless) strength. I realize you train for bench/squat/dead but you won’t be going very far on the bench unless you prioritize your upper body pulling at this point.

I recomend:
-dumbell rows
-facepulls
-everything in that video
-shrugs

http://www.boxingscene.com/exercise/39385.php
http://www.uptodateonline.com/patients/content/topic.do;jsessionid=50F4ED106A2CD5679C4349929BC93702.0503?topicKey=~G2o..Sw6LW_v63G&view=print
http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/93095-overview
I have one more with a list of recomended lifts for upper back, but I’m off to bed.

good luck.
[/quote]

Nearly everyone I’ve seen on these forums with rotator problems were significantly stronger in their presses then their pulls, and they pressed too frequently.

I suffered the same problem and tried to deal with it for roughly nine months, much like the poster above me. It only got worse.

Whoever said to “get off the painkillers” NSAIDS are crucial to getting the fastest recovery here.

here’s what i would do:

Take time off from anything that hurts
start doing some rotater cuff external rotations, i like the standing varition, use a rep range between 15-30, i started with a 5 lb dumbell for 30 when i was first recovering from my injury and just the other day i manged a 15 lb dumbell for 30. coincidently things are starting to feel much better better now.

if it is your rotater cuff this will help, and if its not, it will still be good

for the rest of your life keep your veritcal pressing, veritcal pulling and horizontal pressing and horizontal pulling evenly balanced.

the not being able to do one pullup thing is really throwing me off though

most times when ive hurt my shoulder my pull strength wasnt really affected.

keep taking NSAIDS and all when you shower put the water as hot as possible on the hurt area.

maybe some more info will help, or atleast help rule stuff out. My pull has actually always been stronger than my push. The pull up is because any pulling straight down movement uses the same spot in the front of my shoulder as if i was pushing down.

Pretty much anything pull my arm across my body, or anything where i have to force my arm Down hurts/ is weak and dead. Whats ultra sound do? how much is it generally?

Your shoulders look grossly under-balanced from the rest of your body (small, nonexistant, wtf bbq). Looks like you’ve been working on a few choice exercises for choice body parts.

You set yourself up for this, respect your injury : like others have said do not perform exercises that exacerbate the injury. If you are experiencing injury pain performing the lift you should remove it from your exercise list until you have properly addressed your injury.

Be it surgery, required rest and the rehab that ensues with or without surgery. Which could and generally does mean entirely eliminating anything that could aggravate your injury for a prolonged period of time.

From my experience which seems to coincide with some medical rehab papers I’ve read 3-6 months at least of rehab religiously and then rebuilding strength and adding on a lot more muscle to all parts of the deltoid. So it took me roughly 6 to rehab and another 6 to get it up to speed and move forward. (both rotators + AC joint + and I believe a tear)

Hi mavrcksurfer69.

Im also suffering from a similar shoulder injury I am not able to do push ups or and chest exc without pain, I have not tried any shoulder exc. The pain is under my deep under my collar bone and it extends to my upper arm. So I have decided to lay of upper body workouts for some time.
This article might be useful to work around your pain
http://www.T-Nation.com/article/performance_training/creating_a_training_effect_when_youre_injured&cr

I will keep you posted.