Surprisingly this hasn’t happened to me at all. I try to be friendly in the gym, so no one really talks to me with disrespect even though I’m only 220. It doesn’t seem like many people my age are interested in lifting weights so I don’t get many questions about it. Anyone that does lift weights seriously will just ask what my numbers are or what supps I use ect.
its tough, i just don’t often have the time or inclination to try and share my education on this stuff.
whether it my dad with, “you’re eating too much these days”. or a girl i was seeing spotting a tub of protein and asking, “so is that stuff like steroids?” she just laughed at my explanation of a diet with enough protein for growth and repair.
just brush it off and try to help those who matter to you.
[quote]josh86 wrote:
Sick Rick wrote:
Rev1911 wrote:
No offense to the dudes who run their back days like the kid in the story below, but I order my back exercises so I hit the top first and work my way down.
I start w/ wide grip pull-ups and lat pull-downs, go to seated cable rows mixed with face pulls (look weird, but give a good pump), then DB rows or bent over BB rows (or both), then I finish with deadlifts.
Anyway, this kid tells me I should deadlift first because that’s when my muscles are fresh and I’ll be able to move more weight. I counter this with an explanation of how I want to work my upper back first and save my LOWER back for the ultimate destruction at the end. He looks at me like I’m crazy and insists I’m doing it wrong.
For the record, he’s about 5’7" ~160lbs. I’m not huge by any means, but at 5’10" and between 205-208lbs, it irks me that the kid wants to ‘teach me how to build my back’ and is very adamant about my being wrong.
He is actually right.
Just saying…
Actually this is very subjective…I prefer to do my heaviest lift last. Because I like knowing that I can put every ounce of my energy, focus, intensity into it and then when I’m done I get to collapse for a few minutes before limping out of the gym.
[/quote]
x2
I try to go through life thinking I don’t know shit, but I try to maintain an open mind to new info, new ways of doing things.
Spend less time running yer mouth and more time listening…
[quote]onwards wrote:
its tough, i just don’t often have the time or inclination to try and share my education on this stuff.
whether it my dad with, “you’re eating too much these days”. or a girl i was seeing spotting a tub of protein and asking, “so is that stuff like steroids?” she just laughed at my explanation of a diet with enough protein for growth and repair.
just brush it off and try to help those who matter to you.[/quote]
so true, this kid once asked what supp to take to get bigger, so I told him to take creatine. he looked at me like i told him to start juicing, shook my head and walk away.
that guy who told me that to have real big gunz you have to train 6hours a day and that his friend was training for that.
I’m with the “stays to themselves” crowd. If someone asks me a question, I offer an opinion and move on from there. I like to watch people’s actions more than their words because it’s easy to say something that is of good quality and well thought, but it is something entirely different to actually practice good techniques and solid dietary practices.
And now a story 
Five high school kids are taking turns doing deadlift. I happen to be in the area next to them finishing my deadlifting when I notice the strong, experienced one (aka the fat kid that can lift the most because he weighs the most) criticizing my form because I am not cranking my neck to the ceiling and my butt is “too low” to complete the lift properly. I then saw him do an RDL (or his version of a deadlift) with a rounded back. I hate uninformed people…especially when they create other uniformed people…this will teach me not to leave my MP3 player at home charging!
[quote]Rev1911 wrote:
Vires Eternus wrote:
To: Rev1911
That’s always happening at my gym cause there are two crowds - the older bigger guys who have been doing it the same and with success for years, and the up and comers who THINK they’ve got it all figured out. Personally if I’m scratchin my head as to why someone’s doing something that looks ‘wrong’ to me I ask em why they are doing it that way. You learn a lot about staging excercises, tempo the whole nine yards. Even if I walk away thinking it’s not for me at least I’ve got something to pull out when what I’m doing stops working or gets stale.
It’s just a matter of affording someone the dignity that they probably know what they’re doing and why, you just haven’t figured it out yet.
Of course then there’s just the douche bags who insist on working their upper backs first, who we all know are crazy. 
I’m glad we can agree on this.
I put together my routine from the guys I used to lift with in college. That routine got me to where I am today and while I might change things around here and there, I stick to it for the most part. Where did they get the idea to DL last? I don’t know, but it works for me.
On the other hand, I’m a big advocate of switching things up and shocking your system. T-Nation has been invaluable to my training with tips and new exercises to try. Plus, TC and I have the exact same thought process. I wish I could live my life the way he writes his articles.
I don’t want to be a dick to the little dudes. I used to be a little dude. I’m still a little dude when compared to some guys on this board.
Vires Eternus, you wanna do my back day with me today? We can start with wide grip pull-ups and lat pull-downs, and then go make Muscle Milk brownies.
P.S. I think doing DLs last in conjunction with my shoulder workouts (heavy shrugs FTW) has really brought my traps out. Fatigue the upper back first then hit the lower back w/ DLs and force the traps to do some holding at the top. I get comments on my traps and how they’re gonna ‘eat my ears’ soon. Big traps make me happy.
[/quote]
I’m gonna take a page from your book and give that order a try.
Honestly I almost always DL first but not because I think it’s better to go bottom to top on the back. If I pull up to 5 bills, all of a sudden rowing with the 120 lb. dumbbells seems so much lighter, and weoghted pull-ups etc. seem so much easier. I use heavy DLing as a psychological/physiological trick. Some of the ‘experts’ say this is stimulating your CNS and priming you to do more… I don’t know that I perform that much better but it doesn’t seem to beat me down as bad.
That’s why no matter what ANYBODY tells you, you should always do what works for you. If you’re making progress, FTW.
The brownies sound awesome…
Hee hee, funny timing… I was squatting at the gym yesterday and a guy approached and told me that he got a herniated disc from squatting, and how it was the worst thing for your back. I politely listened, and then proceeded to do more sets.
[quote]patricio2626 wrote:
Hee hee, funny timing… I was squatting at the gym yesterday and a guy approached and told me that he got a herniated disc from squatting, and how it was the worst thing for your back. I politely listened, and then proceeded to do more sets.[/quote]
This is the key right here. There’s no need to get bent out of shape about things.
If you’re right and they’re wrong, that should be satisfaction enough.
You might try printing out a few relevant articles on healthy fats, etc., and giving them to your dad – maybe to mom, too. If she’s scared of butter, maybe you can at least get her to use something like Smart Balance. I understand that you care about your folks and don’t want Dad to eat himself into a heart attack, but you’ll likely have to be both calm and persistent to change deeply ingrained habits/beliefs w/your folks. You’ll also have to take your folks’ perspective into account when you talk to them. Odds are they’re not interested in muscle building, but they should be in their continued health.
Might be good to know what your dad’s doc says, too.
[quote]Vires Eternus wrote:
My own mother refuses to believe that trans fat laden margarine is in fact NOT better for you than butter. She cooks it into meals, puts it on my dads toast, on baked potatoes…
Dad just had a splint put in his main veign to fix a 90% blockage about a year ago.
She tells me I’m to muscular and that I’m too obsessive about health and nutrition.
She has my dad eating oatmeal and toast for breakfast. No protien or healthy fats.
I love my dad so I told him to start eating eggs in the morning now that his cholesterol is decent. Told him to get some fish oil to and gave him some other recommendations. Unfortunately he takes my Mom’s advice over mine. She’s following nutritional advice from ‘Lady’s Home Journal’ circa 1983.
Sheesh![/quote]
[quote]Vires Eternus wrote:
I’m gonna take a page from your book and give that order a try.
Honestly I almost always DL first but not because I think it’s better to go bottom to top on the back. If I pull up to 5 bills, all of a sudden rowing with the 120 lb. dumbbells seems so much lighter, and weoghted pull-ups etc. seem so much easier. I use heavy DLing as a psychological/physiological trick. Some of the ‘experts’ say this is stimulating your CNS and priming you to do more… I don’t know that I perform that much better but it doesn’t seem to beat me down as bad.
That’s why no matter what ANYBODY tells you, you should always do what works for you. If you’re making progress, FTW.
The brownies sound awesome…[/quote]
And there you have it… While you’re pulling 5 hundo, I’m happy with a strapless, beltless 405x6 or 455x2 (at least for now…). I’d like to hit numbers like yours in the next 1-1.5 years. And I’d LOVE to weigh 240lbs. Why do you have to go flattering me with pulling a page from my book and then turn out to be a bigger dude moving more weight? Dammit…
Haha.
Anyway, DL is the most taxing workout on my back days. I think someone said something about leaving everything in the gym and using up all you’ve got at the end so as to stumble out to the car and collapse on the seat in a satisfied heap of “I gave it all I had”.
On the flipside, I’ve done static holds on squat and bench press where you set the pins of a power rack just below your lockout position and try and push aprox. 1.5x your max to lockout and just hold it to get a sensation of the heaviness. Then go into your sets and blast through the weight 'cuz it feels THAT much lighter. I know what you mean about maxing out your CNS first and then making everything else seem easier. It’s just that when my lower back is shot, I can’t do much weight on anything else 'cuz that main support structure is fatigued.
[quote]bpeloquin wrote:
This is the key right here. There’s no need to get bent out of shape about things.
If you’re right and they’re wrong, that should be satisfaction enough.
[/quote]
Absolutely correct. Also, if you’re slamming mad f-ing weight (Dave Tate style) and pushing it in the gym, when naysayer/little dude/older dude with bad back/etc comes to talk, you’ll be so outta breath all you can muster is, “huh? oh yeah… huhhhhhhh… huhhhhhhh…”. Kinda like the Twix commercials, except with highly enthusiastic exhaling.
[quote]bpeloquin wrote:
patricio2626 wrote:
Hee hee, funny timing… I was squatting at the gym yesterday and a guy approached and told me that he got a herniated disc from squatting, and how it was the worst thing for your back. I politely listened, and then proceeded to do more sets.
This is the key right here. There’s no need to get bent out of shape about things.
If you’re right and they’re wrong, that should be satisfaction enough. [/quote]
Agreed, life’s too short to get one’s BP up about it. The guy was just being nice and thought he was helping; he wasn’t obnoxious about it, so I just shrugged it off and giggled inside.
One guy tried to tell me that deadlifts do not work your back at all.
I actually had a guy ask me the other day why I lifted so heavy, sad.
A coworker caught me eating my natty PB out of the jar I keep in my desk at work. I told her I had been craving for peanut butter lately. She told me it was because my body needed more protein.
I saw no reason to waste my breath explaining that the protein in PB is just a trace of what I take in each day.
She was just trying to be helpful. No point in getting bent out of shape over it. Seems like there are some uptight dudes around here. Chill.
[quote]eric_lacrosse wrote:
A coworker caught me eating my natty PB out of the jar I keep in my desk at work. I told her I had been craving for peanut butter lately. She told me it was because my body needed more protein.
I saw no reason to waste my breath explaining that the protein in PB is just a trace of what I take in each day.
She was just trying to be helpful. No point in getting bent out of shape over it. Seems like there are some uptight dudes around here. Chill.[/quote]
On the bright side of her comment, at least she understands the importance of protein; better than saying “ewww, isn’t that stuff full of fat?!” like most of the women i know do.
[quote]Feist wrote:
You might try printing out a few relevant articles on healthy fats, etc., and giving them to your dad – maybe to mom, too. If she’s scared of butter, maybe you can at least get her to use something like Smart Balance. I understand that you care about your folks and don’t want Dad to eat himself into a heart attack, but you’ll likely have to be both calm and persistent to change deeply ingrained habits/beliefs w/your folks. You’ll also have to take your folks’ perspective into account when you talk to them. Odds are they’re not interested in muscle building, but they should be in their continued health.
Might be good to know what your dad’s doc says, too.
Vires Eternus wrote:
My own mother refuses to believe that trans fat laden margarine is in fact NOT better for you than butter. She cooks it into meals, puts it on my dads toast, on baked potatoes…
Dad just had a splint put in his main veign to fix a 90% blockage about a year ago.
She tells me I’m to muscular and that I’m too obsessive about health and nutrition.
She has my dad eating oatmeal and toast for breakfast. No protien or healthy fats.
I love my dad so I told him to start eating eggs in the morning now that his cholesterol is decent. Told him to get some fish oil to and gave him some other recommendations. Unfortunately he takes my Mom’s advice over mine. She’s following nutritional advice from ‘Lady’s Home Journal’ circa 1983.
Sheesh!
[/quote]
Good suggestions, thanks for the reply.
[quote]bpeloquin wrote:
patricio2626 wrote:
Hee hee, funny timing… I was squatting at the gym yesterday and a guy approached and told me that he got a herniated disc from squatting, and how it was the worst thing for your back. I politely listened, and then proceeded to do more sets.
This is the key right here. There’s no need to get bent out of shape about things.
If you’re right and they’re wrong, that should be satisfaction enough. [/quote]
Your avatar is ruining my productivity dammit.
Being bigger or having more experience under the bar doesn’t necessarily mean you know more than the next guy. One guy I work with has been lifting for 20+ years. He outweighs me by 50lbs. Doesn’t squat or deadlift, and only benches 40lbs more than I do.
His benching technique is horrendous. Wide grip, elbows flared, and still insists on touching the bar to his sternum (I’m guessing that some big guy told him wide grip worked better, another told him elbows flared was better, and another told him he should touch the bar to his sternum, so he figured if he combined it all…).
At first I tried to help, but I got the whole ‘I’m bigger than you, just shut the hell up’ vibe, so I left him alone. Then came rotator cuff surgery #1. After his recovery, he gets back to it. I try to help him again and get the same vibe, so I give up on him. He tweaked his other shoulder the other day, so he stopped benching.
Worst thing is, he’s coaching someone else who’s bigger and stronger than he is!