T Nation

Hyperthyroid Issues and Test E


#1

I keep reading up on thyroid-posts but all is centered around low thyroid function and not hyper.
Is a hyper thyroid of no consern when starting trt? I have found one guy online who said he ran test e with a hyper thyroid and had no problems what so ever,his thyroid even calmed down after it.
But i want to get an answer of those of you who have knowledge on this. I want to start my trt-protocol but need some advise first regarding high levels of free t4 and high antibody production,and not just a link to thyroid-sticky’s.
Do i have high amounts of free t4 because of my system has a hard time converting t4 to t3?

I also read that some add t3 and t4 to their test cycles to boost metabolism… Is my excess free t4 just an advantage for me when starting trt or how should i look at this? As i said most thyroid-posts is about low thyroid function so it seems like that is an issue and not overactive thyroid? Please help me out,this is basically what is holding me back from starting trt.
I also have some bloodwork i posted here but it seemed to be of no interest to help me read them,is it the referanse values which is hard to understand? For an example latest bloodtest done 15.5-17:

Free test (2,3-9,9) is at 4,7.
Total test (6,0-35) is at 18,9.
P-free T4(8-21) is at 22.
P-Free T3 (3,1-6,2) is at 4,6.
P-TPO Antibodies (maximum 6) is at 428.
P-SHBG (8-60) is at 40,1.
B-Hemoglobin (13,4-17) is at 15,7.

Bloodtest done 7.12-16:

P-PSA (0-2,5) is at 1,1.
P-LH (maximum 12) is at 1,7.
P-FSH (maximum 12) is at 1,77.
P-Estradiol (maximum 0,20) is at 0,09.
P-TSH (0,5-3,6) is at 1,84.

What do you guys think of these numbers?


#2

The active hormone is fT3.
T4 is a reservoir for fT4–>fT3 conversion.
So high fT4 is not in itself a major problem.

Low ferritin can impede T4–>T3 conversion.
Low ferritin in males often involves a GI blood loss and CBC might show traces of that. RBC? Hematocrit?

E2=0.09 nmol//L - 90 pmol/L ?
This is OK. But TRT target is 80 pmol/L and an AI will be required with TRT.

TSH is elevated but low VS hyper.
I do not think that you are hyper.

fT3 at 4.6 is mid-range, not hyper

Cannot get deeper without your oral body temperatures.
I asked for those July 9th in your other thread.

You have Hashimoto’s, possibly from long term iodine deficiency and a lack of selenium that is mission critical to avoid free radical damage to the thyroid that can trigger thyroid autoimmune disease.

Your iodine intake may be poor, please explain history of using iodized salt. If you start iodine supplements you really need to be getting 200mcg selenium per day and start that 7-10 days prior to iodine to avoid making your thyroid anti-bodies worse and yes, it can get much worse.

You have secondary hypogonadism to some degree. You might respond to hCG+AI. While E2 is not responsible for low LH/FSH, prolactin could be and should be tested.

Did you read the things that damage your hormones sticky?

With transdermal T absorption is typically poor with hypo thyroid. Your thyroid status is not clear, need those body temps.


#3

Thanks KS,i’ll start measuring bodytemp tomorrow.
P-Ferritin (30-400) is at 160.
CBC,RBC,Prolactin and Hematocrit was not tested,ill make sure those will be included next draw,anything else that needs to be checked also?

E2=0,09 yes but dont know if its nmol/L or pmo/L,i’ll make them specify next time.
Ok i have 100 anastrozole so AI is on hand.

Is not high free t4 hyper?? i have all the symptoms of hyper,high bodytemp,nervousness,depression,anxiety,poor sleep,night sweats,mood swings (more herpes related i think…),generally poor memory,did i mention anxiety and nervousness lol gawd…

Ok i will get some selenium.
Have for many years avoided iodine in salts. I get it,selenium 7-10 days prior to iodine.
Yes have read the things that damage hormones,i’ll take another read on it.
I dont use dairy,now and then some yougurt and chese but rare,i avoid soya. Also try my best to steer away from plastic.
Im often dead-cold on hands and feet,but elsewhere on the body more warm than cold.
What about my b-hemoglobin,is it high or ok? that count red blood cells?

Measure bodytemp morning,mid-day and afternoon,and orally right? Thanks again.


#4

When you wake up to get your low temp and mid-afternoon to get your peak temp. Do not be talking, walking, drinking, eating etc for a while before

fT3 is the active hormone and your level was good, but we do not know if rT3 might be blocking some fT3 at T3 receptors. Your concept of hyper needs revision to reflect that fT3 is the active hormone.

Iodine deficiency used to be a horrible problem for most of the human race and iodized salt worked miracles starting in 1922, for the last 20-30 years, everyone has forgotten and people suffer from sea salt and pink or raw salts or from salt avoidance. Salt does not cause heart disease or high blood pressure. If you have those, less sodium reduces blood volume which can be a useful compensation. Because reduced sodium is useful with those conditions, many made a stupid conclusion that sodium was a cause.

Low iodine, high TSH+years leads to hypo symptoms, nodules and later hyperthyroidism with low TSH. A wild progression that also presents thyroid autoimmune and cancer risks.

Are your outer eyebrows sparse?


#5

Got it.
Then i will buy salt with iodine.
I do not have any heart disease i know of,but sometimes the heart beats hard with some elevated pressure, have had two three episodes last 7 years of the heart suddenly gives a extra beat or what should i say and i get dizzy and almost passes out,dunno if its a panic-attack or disease related…
The tyroid-issue started in '08 after a hard round of mononucleosis,things have been ducked up since then.

Outer eyebrow are less dense than in the other ends yes,more sparse on left eyebrow.


#6

is there a specific iodine supplement i should buy? or just use salt with iodine? Just ordered Solaray Selen supplement.
In my multivitamin supplement i take and have taken for 3 years,gives me a daily dose of 45mcg selenium,but i should take 200mcg in addition?


#7

45 not good enough

have you read the thyroid basics sticky?

Multi-vit with trace elements including 150mcg iodine and 200mcg selenium, iron free. Perhaps a high potency B-complex type.

Hemoglobin is good relative to your T levels.


#8

Ok.
im at the thyroid basics sticky now reading.
I’ll check out another multivit,can you recommend me one? Iherb has a good selection,i look into some b-complex aswell. Thanks.


#9

I take Life Extension Two-Per-Day Tablets. Bought them off Amazon and states 150mcg of iodine, and 200mcg of Selenium.


#10

Thanks azwildcats,i check into that one for later use,last night i bought ‘solaray selenium 200mcg’ and ‘life flo health liquid iodine+’, it has good reviews on iherb. Have three bottles of bio-life ‘bio-balance multivit’ so keep using that for now with those two i bought last night. I’ll buy b-complex the 20. of august.

How does the body usually react when introducing selenium and iodine to this thyroid condition? (is iodine needed for both hyper and hypo thyroid condition?) symptoms disappear and things will level out? Hope to also get better sleep because it makes it all worse not getting enough,i look like a exhausted panda lol!
I guess it would be wise to wait trt to see how i react to selenium and iodine right?


#11

@KSman KSman: Found on stopthethyroidmadness .com: ‘If you have low FT4 and a mid-range or slightly higher FT3, it usually means the T4 is converting like mad to give you the T3 you do have, which means hypo’.

If im hypo as you said,i should have low free t4? I dunno but the quote says hypo have low free t4,i have high free t4…

Another quote: 'Some with Hashi’s can also have the Graves antibodies’
Does not the first quote show im hyper and not hypo? maybe im missing something important here,please explain why you mean im hypo and not hyper? Its the hyper symptoms i have…

Does both hyper and hypo’s need selenium and iodine??


#12

@KSman I still appreciate your insights,please come back. Is it ok to start selenium today even though i can not get a thermometer to measure oral temp before a week?


#13

second day of using 200mcg selenium,and mood is already better,less anxiety and depression,its really a big difference.


#14

Hoping that progress continues.


#15

Me too,have not felt like this in a decade,i fell like a new centered me. Will do temp readings in 8 days and post. Thanks for help so far KSman,i really appreciate it.


#16

That’s awesome to hear you’re getting great results!

Not so much in my case as I think I’m either adrenal and/or thyroid impaired… more data needed to confirm


#17

sorry to hear that cdmac,hope you get it sorted out real soon…


#18

last two nights,wood has been persistent much of the night,before i had it only occasionally early in the morning. Does this mean that anti-tpo is declining and free test is more avaliable?

Im feeling abit tired/sluggish on 200mcg pr day,can i take 150mcg a day instead? this suits me bad these days because the sharpness is needed for the course im working with. Will 150mcg in total from supplementation be ok KSman?


#19

You can try more/less, but these two things may not have that connection.


#20

its just a coincidence then…hm. Taper down a bit on selen,cant stand how tired i get. thanks.