I’m reading this… I should be sleeping…
Sleep what the fcuk is that?
Anxiety was a major problem for me over the past decade. It seems the older I got the worse my sleep became (more worries) so dealing with the anxiety or the stressor will have a major impact on sleep patterns.
But since having kids, sleep is at a premium what with work commitments and child minding etc. so now I just pass out when I hit the hay, simply out of sheer exhaustion, averaging about 5-6 hours per night if I am lucky!
Some guys here have mentioned some useful information but what has helped me get through the day on little sleep is removing all forms of wheat from my diet. I used to go around like a wet rag while sleep deprived but now my head is clear and I have more energy! But if I sit still for long enough I will drop off no bother.
Hello,
I had terrible sleep in the past, especially when I was a kid / teen and when I started to work.
Tried doxylamine, zolpidem, etc… They worked but I would wake up totally fucked up and not feeling rested…
I recently changed my lifestyle a bit :
- reduced coffee intake (from 4 cups a day to 1-2 and no coffee after 3 PM)
- stop video games very early, never play before going to bed, especially stressful online games like Starcraft or Call of Duty
- wake up earlier (7 AM) and sleep earlier (11 PM)
- work out in the morning
I am doing a 5 day split at the moment and I have the best sleep I ever had. I wake up feeling rested (at the end of the week I feel more tired because of the workouts but it s ok), after a non stop night
Seriously this was ridiculous. I would wake up at 3, 5 AM every night before, feeling ready to rock then starting to feel destroyed at 11 AM…
I never tried any supplements like ZMA or whatever but I think they are totally overrated and useless.
When I had insomnia, the only thing that would knock me out was zolpidem at the end, and at the very end it was 2 of it, it s a huge dose, and not healthy.
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
[quote]MattyXL wrote:
My sleep has been uber shit over the past 6 months. I work the overnight, and I would guess I get a solid 4-5 hours sleep on average, which is not too restful as Im sleeping through the daytime…I do get one day to crash and really sleep but I end up sleeping too much sometimes 12 hours (from friday night to saturday afternoon) and Im out of it all day and still tired.
I do have access to ambien and try to stay away from it as it leaves me in a fog on top of having an addictive personality. Melatonin didnt work too well for me either. Im kind of shit of luck, I had to train myself to go to sleep immediatelt when I get home from work in the morning which isnt natural as it seems most people dont go directly to sleep when they work traditional hours. If I dont try to go to sleep immediately when I get home I cant make it up as I usually have to be up at around 1 to pick up the kids.
So overall Im fucked with the sleeping, and I love to sleep.
To over-compensate I have been doing alot of stimulant type drinks while training, and it seems to be a decent band aid but its probably not the healthiest route…
I would be curious if anybody had any helpful tips for me as well.[/quote]
Matty did it when I worked ER for 14 years, black out the windows, get a box fan for white noise, turn off phones and like you are doing just go do bed when you get home. Not much else you can do. I averaged about 4-5 hours for that 14 year span. [/quote]
X2 on the blackout windows Matty. I went to a fabric store and bought two yards of light cancelling fabric and then I made a wood frame that I stapled the fabric to. Picture a large speaker cover that press fits inside the window frame so when I’m on day shift I can just pop it out and lean it against the wall. Problem in the summer is that the room gets ridiculuosly stuffy because of the window cover so I have to have a small fan going.
My doctor told me years ago I have a busy brain when I sleep and there isn’t a whole lot I can do but too train it to relax before bed but it’s tough, I worry about shit waaaay to much. I pretty much dream every night and they are rarely pleasent so that just compounds the problem. That’s why ZMA and Rez-V are a problem for me. The dreams are so vivid that I wake up from the crazy dreams and defeat the purpose.
On top of all that I doubt many people could match the hell I’m in when it comes to shift work. I’m a casual on call worker at a hospital. I can go from days to midnights, one day off, back to days, no days off, back to midnights, one day off, afternoons, and back to midnights all in a two week period. Month after month, it’s a fucked up life.
As a matter of fact staffing just called me to see if I could work overtime tonight till 1:00 am but I’m alreay working tomorrow at 6:00 pm till 4:00 am for two days. I could use the money but fuck them. Did I mention I get maybe four weekends off a year? That’s why not many of my co-workers and I pick up the phone to help staffing out, they’re evil and don’t give a fuck about you, your just a body.
Actually my best sleep is when I go to bed drunk as a skunk,which is rare now and not a bad thing. Sleep like a baby but the fucking hangovers kill my training for days lol.
I will admit I’m very fortunate to have a well paying job, it just sucks that it’s slowly but surely eroding my health.
[quote]bond james bond wrote:
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
[quote]MattyXL wrote:
My sleep has been uber shit over the past 6 months. I work the overnight, and I would guess I get a solid 4-5 hours sleep on average, which is not too restful as Im sleeping through the daytime…I do get one day to crash and really sleep but I end up sleeping too much sometimes 12 hours (from friday night to saturday afternoon) and Im out of it all day and still tired.
I do have access to ambien and try to stay away from it as it leaves me in a fog on top of having an addictive personality. Melatonin didnt work too well for me either. Im kind of shit of luck, I had to train myself to go to sleep immediatelt when I get home from work in the morning which isnt natural as it seems most people dont go directly to sleep when they work traditional hours. If I dont try to go to sleep immediately when I get home I cant make it up as I usually have to be up at around 1 to pick up the kids.
So overall Im fucked with the sleeping, and I love to sleep.
To over-compensate I have been doing alot of stimulant type drinks while training, and it seems to be a decent band aid but its probably not the healthiest route…
I would be curious if anybody had any helpful tips for me as well.[/quote]
Matty did it when I worked ER for 14 years, black out the windows, get a box fan for white noise, turn off phones and like you are doing just go do bed when you get home. Not much else you can do. I averaged about 4-5 hours for that 14 year span. [/quote]
X2 on the blackout windows Matty. I went to a fabric store and bought two yards of light cancelling fabric and then I made a wood frame that I stapled the fabric to. Picture a large speaker cover that press fits inside the window frame so when I’m on day shift I can just pop it out and lean it against the wall. Problem in the summer is that the room gets ridiculuosly stuffy because of the window cover so I have to have a small fan going.
My doctor told me years ago I have a busy brain when I sleep and there isn’t a whole lot I can do but too train it to relax before bed but it’s tough, I worry about shit waaaay to much. I pretty much dream every night and they are rarely pleasent so that just compounds the problem. That’s why ZMA and Rez-V are a problem for me. The dreams are so vivid that I wake up from the crazy dreams and defeat the purpose.
On top of all that I doubt many people could match the hell I’m in when it comes to shift work. I’m a casual on call worker at a hospital. I can go from days to midnights, one day off, back to days, no days off, back to midnights, one day off, afternoons, and back to midnights all in a two week period. Month after month, it’s a fucked up life.
As a matter of fact staffing just called me to see if I could work overtime tonight till 1:00 am but I’m alreay working tomorrow at 6:00 pm till 4:00 am for two days. I could use the money but fuck them. Did I mention I get maybe four weekends off a year? That’s why not many of my co-workers and I pick up the phone to help staffing out, they’re evil and don’t give a fuck about you, your just a body.
Actually my best sleep is when I go to bed drunk as a skunk,which is rare now and not a bad thing. Sleep like a baby but the fucking hangovers kill my training for days lol.
I will admit I’m very fortunate to have a well paying job, it just sucks that it’s slowly but surely eroding my health.
[/quote]
0_0
I like the sound of those home made window covers, especially because you can just pop them out when on days. I am jealous.
[quote]Charlie Horse wrote:
[quote]bond james bond wrote:
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
[quote]MattyXL wrote:
My sleep has been uber shit over the past 6 months. I work the overnight, and I would guess I get a solid 4-5 hours sleep on average, which is not too restful as Im sleeping through the daytime…I do get one day to crash and really sleep but I end up sleeping too much sometimes 12 hours (from friday night to saturday afternoon) and Im out of it all day and still tired.
I do have access to ambien and try to stay away from it as it leaves me in a fog on top of having an addictive personality. Melatonin didnt work too well for me either. Im kind of shit of luck, I had to train myself to go to sleep immediatelt when I get home from work in the morning which isnt natural as it seems most people dont go directly to sleep when they work traditional hours. If I dont try to go to sleep immediately when I get home I cant make it up as I usually have to be up at around 1 to pick up the kids.
So overall Im fucked with the sleeping, and I love to sleep.
To over-compensate I have been doing alot of stimulant type drinks while training, and it seems to be a decent band aid but its probably not the healthiest route…
I would be curious if anybody had any helpful tips for me as well.[/quote]
Matty did it when I worked ER for 14 years, black out the windows, get a box fan for white noise, turn off phones and like you are doing just go do bed when you get home. Not much else you can do. I averaged about 4-5 hours for that 14 year span. [/quote]
X2 on the blackout windows Matty. I went to a fabric store and bought two yards of light cancelling fabric and then I made a wood frame that I stapled the fabric to. Picture a large speaker cover that press fits inside the window frame so when I’m on day shift I can just pop it out and lean it against the wall. Problem in the summer is that the room gets ridiculuosly stuffy because of the window cover so I have to have a small fan going.
My doctor told me years ago I have a busy brain when I sleep and there isn’t a whole lot I can do but too train it to relax before bed but it’s tough, I worry about shit waaaay to much. I pretty much dream every night and they are rarely pleasent so that just compounds the problem. That’s why ZMA and Rez-V are a problem for me. The dreams are so vivid that I wake up from the crazy dreams and defeat the purpose.
On top of all that I doubt many people could match the hell I’m in when it comes to shift work. I’m a casual on call worker at a hospital. I can go from days to midnights, one day off, back to days, no days off, back to midnights, one day off, afternoons, and back to midnights all in a two week period. Month after month, it’s a fucked up life.
As a matter of fact staffing just called me to see if I could work overtime tonight till 1:00 am but I’m alreay working tomorrow at 6:00 pm till 4:00 am for two days. I could use the money but fuck them. Did I mention I get maybe four weekends off a year? That’s why not many of my co-workers and I pick up the phone to help staffing out, they’re evil and don’t give a fuck about you, your just a body.
Actually my best sleep is when I go to bed drunk as a skunk,which is rare now and not a bad thing. Sleep like a baby but the fucking hangovers kill my training for days lol.
I will admit I’m very fortunate to have a well paying job, it just sucks that it’s slowly but surely eroding my health.
[/quote]
0_0
I like the sound of those home made window covers, especially because you can just pop them out when on days. I am jealous.
[/quote]
My wife finds me handsome not handy but I think this little project worked out well 
^ You had to get the steelers cap in didnt you.
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
^ You had to get the steelers cap in didnt you. [/quote]
On a strange note regarding sleep- My parents used to put me to bed when the game came on back in the dynasty days. Now when a Steelers game comes on I zonk out like its a reflex.
Which leads me to- Sleep training. Ian King wrote a good bit about this in his earlier books. Develop some type of pre-sleep ritual that prepares you for bed. He even recommends an alarm clock that is set for the time which you should begin going to sleep. I’ve found this type of consistency to be very helpful. I’m at the point now where I hit the pillow at within five minutes of a given time and wake up at virtually the exact same time every morning, then shut off the alarm clock so that it doesn’t wake up the wife.
The impetus for my interest was actually similar to yours (OP) too. When transitioning from active addiction to getting clean, sleep and the lack there of is the number one complaint of the majority of people I’ve known, and has foiled some honest attempts at getting there. The sooner you can develop some consistent sleep habits and patterns the better.
Room and body temperature are big factors for me. After doing rounds of max effort/dynamic strength type training, I will blast heat like a radiator. A fan helps, and I’v even gone as far as moving the bed to underneath a window so that I can get a cool draft to help sleep.
Good luck.
[quote]Derek542 wrote:
^ You had to get the steelers cap in didnt you. [/quote]
Well it was sitting on the dresser already and it helps to put the photo to scale. I did not type that with a straight face.
Also this OP. These 30 min thingys knock me right out. Unfortunatly they do not help me stay asleep. I got the first two for free from a friend, not sure if I would have spent the money legitimetly. Some food for thought though.
This is great stuff thanks DJ and BJB!
My sleep, oh my sleep…
I’m about to open up a little to you guys, because I legitimately need help.
So, for about 3 years now, whenever I manage to get to sleep I have horrifying nightmares.
Not typical, falling endlessly, lost in a dark place, but brutal, terrible, horrible things.
Things I’d rather not describe to be honest, they turn my stomach even after all this time.
After a year of incredibly sparse sleep, forcefully medicated sleep (Benadryl, Ambien, Lunesta, etc.), and noticeable deterioration of both mental and physical faculty, I couldn’t take it anymore, I decided to try Cannabis.
It was a wonder cure.
I slept like a baby, my head hit the pillow, and I awoke the next morning, happy, rested, with no decapitation induced night sweats even!
Oh! what a glorious time…
However, I fear my future.
Marijuana no longer does the task it was intended for, some nights the nightmares slip through.
It’s gotten to the point that the nightmare anxiety usually makes it so I go 24-30 hours at a time without sleep, and when I do sleep it’s always awakened short-lived, as if my body was protecting me from the nightmare. I usually wake in a sweat, my girlfriend has to sleep with ear muffs on because of the frequency I wake up loudly…
My sleep hygiene is spotless to my knowledge.
I’ve removed electronics from my room.
I read for a few hours before attempting to get in to bed.
I have a very expensive mattress, it’s extremely comfortable.
There is no light, anywhere, literally pitch black.
I really don’t know how long I can hold up like this, my life has a lot of physical and mental demands right now, and I’ve grown extremely fond of my current lifestyle.
I think the only way I’ve managed to maintain is due to a trance-like focus on my training and nutrition.
Without Cannabis what can I do short of resorting to pharmaceuticals again?
I constantly reflect upon and try and improve my self, I try and be a good person to all people every day, I never leave a responsibility unturned, so why can’t I get to sleep at night?
Such a wall of text, one begins to ramble being up this long I suppose…
[quote]X-Factor wrote:
This topic has been covered plenty…but has anyone gone through a bout of insomnia or just plain not being able to feel rested/get up in the morning…I know I was always able to get up when needed hit the track at 6am, work from 9-9 train on lunch, get groceries, cook, sleep, repeat ad nauseum…the last year however, I lost my job, my apartment…slept in my car, battled an addiction and I’ve finally come out of it albeit still dealing with a bit of fallout, but slowly and surely it’s coming along…
the one thing however that is getting to me is that I can’t seem to go more than 2 or 3 days in a row of feeling rested and popping out of bed…then going into a week of just exhaustion…It’s really strange and the thought it even makes me anxious at times…
Just kinda sharing here as I’m really finding how not being rested can effect the ability for me to enjoy my life…luckily today is a day I feel rested…not to mention the effects this is having on my training. Just as an example. I dieted 1.5 years ago from 215, down to a lean 195.
All that shit happened, then I went down to 165, and have just recently rebounded to 195 (NOT LEAN). I’m 6’ so I spent about 10 years getting myself to that point…and it’s just fuckin depressing and overwhelming…God i’m trying hard…but i’m so tired…[/quote]
You sound like you might have sleep apnea:
Symptoms may be present for years or even decades without identification, during which time the sufferer may become conditioned to the daytime sleepiness and fatigue associated with significant levels of sleep disturbance. Sufferers who generally sleep alone are often unaware of the condition, without a regular bed-partner to notice and make them aware of their symptoms. Obstructive sleep apnea - Wikipedia
My Dad discovered he had this in his 50s and has been used for studies because his is so extreme (he was waking up several times a minute for 25+ years!!!) My point is that if you do have this, it can lead to some incredibly undesirable health and mood problems that will increase with time.
Tell your doctor about your sleep issues and ask to get tested. If you can’t afford a doctor, there are sleep study clinics that might be interested in helping you out for free.
More about the sleep apnea:
Common signs of OSA include unexplained daytime sleepiness, restless sleep, and loud snoring (with periods of silence followed by gasps). Less common symptoms are morning headaches; insomnia; trouble concentrating; mood changes such as irritability, anxiety and depression; forgetfulness; increased heart rate and/or blood pressure; decreased sex drive; unexplained weight gain; increased urination and/or nocturia; frequent heartburn or gastroesophageal reflux disease; and heavy night sweats.
Adults
In adults, the most typical individual with OSA syndrome suffers from obesity, with particular heaviness at the face and neck. Obesity is not always present with OSA; in fact, a significant number of adults with normal body mass indices (BMIs) have decreased muscle tone causing airway collapse and sleep apnea. The cause of this is not well understood. The hallmark symptom of OSA syndrome in adults is excessive daytime sleepiness. Typically, an adult or adolescent with severe long-standing OSA will fall asleep for very brief periods in the course of usual daytime activities if given any opportunity to sit or rest. This behavior may be quite dramatic, sometimes occurring during conversations with others at social gatherings.
The hypoxia (absence of oxygen supply) related to OSA may cause changes in the neurons of the hippocampus and the right frontal cortex. Research using neuro-imaging revealed evidence of hippocampal atrophy in people suffering from OSA. They found that some sufferers have problems in mentally manipulating non-verbal information and in executive function.[2]
[quote]iVoodoo wrote:
My sleep, oh my sleep…
I’m about to open up a little to you guys, because I legitimately need help.
So, for about 3 years now, whenever I manage to get to sleep I have horrifying nightmares.
Not typical, falling endlessly, lost in a dark place, but brutal, terrible, horrible things.
Things I’d rather not describe to be honest, they turn my stomach even after all this time.
After a year of incredibly sparse sleep, forcefully medicated sleep (Benadryl, Ambien, Lunesta, etc.), and noticeable deterioration of both mental and physical faculty, I couldn’t take it anymore, I decided to try Cannabis.
It was a wonder cure.
I slept like a baby, my head hit the pillow, and I awoke the next morning, happy, rested, with no decapitation induced night sweats even!
Oh! what a glorious time…
However, I fear my future.
Marijuana no longer does the task it was intended for, some nights the nightmares slip through.
It’s gotten to the point that the nightmare anxiety usually makes it so I go 24-30 hours at a time without sleep, and when I do sleep it’s always awakened short-lived, as if my body was protecting me from the nightmare. I usually wake in a sweat, my girlfriend has to sleep with ear muffs on because of the frequency I wake up loudly…
My sleep hygiene is spotless to my knowledge.
I’ve removed electronics from my room.
I read for a few hours before attempting to get in to bed.
I have a very expensive mattress, it’s extremely comfortable.
There is no light, anywhere, literally pitch black.
I really don’t know how long I can hold up like this, my life has a lot of physical and mental demands right now, and I’ve grown extremely fond of my current lifestyle.
I think the only way I’ve managed to maintain is due to a trance-like focus on my training and nutrition.
Without Cannabis what can I do short of resorting to pharmaceuticals again?
I constantly reflect upon and try and improve my self, I try and be a good person to all people every day, I never leave a responsibility unturned, so why can’t I get to sleep at night?
Such a wall of text, one begins to ramble being up this long I suppose…[/quote]
When I was little, I used to have the same two re-occuring nightmares: I was crawling on my hands and knees out of a volcano before it was going to explode or I was continually getting in line to be eaten by two monsters. I eventually learned that I could tell when I was dreaming and force myself to wake up. Since I taught myself how to wake up out of these dreams, I’ve stopped having them.
Can you tell when you’re dreaming?
[quote]iVoodoo wrote:
My sleep, oh my sleep…
[/quote]
I used to get sleep terrors and disruptions that included hitting whoever was next to me, walking around, and some other bizarre shit.
At the advice of my psych professor, I started to employ some stress reduction techniques and process responsibility differently. The sleep terrors and disruptions are almost fully gone, occurring only in times of severe acute stress, and even then are minor compared to what they used to be. All the while, responsibilities have have continued to increase and accumulate.
Learning to process life events and even day to day stressors may help, and may provide more long term relief and benefit than what you are currently using. Not saying that this is the solution, but if you are looking for something else, that could be a good direction to start looking.
[quote]Oleena wrote:
Can you tell when you’re dreaming?[/quote]
Yes, usually I realize I’m dreaming.
Sometimes, not too often, usually when I’m forced to sleep without any medication whatsoever, I can go lucid, at least slightly.
I’m aware I’m asleep, I can even move about and try and fight within the dream, but I’m not omnipotent like I should be in my own head, the nightmare still traps me.
Whenever I do manage to wake myself it always results in just giving up on going back to sleep; how could I close my eyes again knowing what’s on the other side of my eyelids?
If I can’t control my own imagination, what can I?
[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
I used to get sleep terrors and disruptions that included hitting whoever was next to me, walking around, and some other bizarre shit.
At the advice of my psych professor, I started to employ some stress reduction techniques and process responsibility differently. The sleep terrors and disruptions are almost fully gone, occurring only in times of severe acute stress, and even then are minor compared to what they used to be. All the while, responsibilities have have continued to increase and accumulate.
Learning to process life events and even day to day stressors may help, and may provide more long term relief and benefit than what you are currently using. Not saying that this is the solution, but if you are looking for something else, that could be a good direction to start looking.
[/quote]
Thankyou for your reply.
I will have to talk to my psychology professor about this, I can’t believe that idea never occurred to me before.
Once again, thankyou.