T Nation

Hows This Diet Then?

I don’t weigh enough. I was having a massive steak the other day and decided steak will definitely solve everything. So guys, what do you think of my relatively simply bulk plan?

Meal 1: 4 turkey sausage sandwich. 1 scoop whey, 2 scoop ultra fine oats. 2 fish oils. 5g creatine (non workout days)
1000 or just under cals
Meal 2: Snack, 1 cup yogurt, 1 scoop protein. 300 cals
Meal 3: 200-250 grams lean beef mince or chicken/turkey breast, sandwich/quinoa/cous cous/sweet potatoe. Side carrot. 600 cals
Meal 4: As meal 2
Meal 5: Big steak 350g or more, 200g potatoe/sweet, broccoli/sweetcorn
Above 1100 calories here
Meal 6: snack/maybe nuts/fruit. 200-300 cals
Meal 7: Whey/Casien shake. 2 fish oil. 200 cals

Daily total: 3700+, I should grow on roughly 3300 though, so maybe bringing this to closer to 3500 would be wise?

Workout Nutrition:
Pre- 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g Dextrose
During- 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g Dextrose
Post- 5gram creatine, 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g dextrose

Workout nutrition total: 1000 cals, this seems too much, half the cals? half the dextrose?

Some thoughts? Add more fish oils? Add olive oil/flax oil shots? Bit more fruit&veg? Any peri-workout reccomendations??

Cheers.

Based on CT’s periworkout nutrition stuff you could probably cut out the dextrose PWO.

IT IS SHIT AND YOU SUCK AND I HATE YOU.

I think you might be trying to take in a little too much whey. Now don’t get me wrong, protein is definitely not the worst thing to over-eat, but you’re a college student and money is tight. Just consider it as something to watch; I know a lot of guys that have consumed upwards of 500g of protein.

It definitely wasn’t hurting them, but their free amino pool was full all day so there was no need to blow through a tub of Grow every few days. It’s just that by that point, you’re using it as energy, and it would be easier (and cheaper) to use some fats and carbs for that.

The only other thing I think could be an issue is your potato at night. That’s a crapton of carbs, and I think that even on a bulk, most guys recommend trying to not overeat on carbs later in the day.

As for your workout nutrition, that seems like a lot of dextrose, 600kcals in all. Try halving it and seeing what happens. Even on a low-carb diet, Surge Workout Fuel works wonders for me, and it’s only 164 kcals of carbs.

I then follow it up with some Grow, which has next to no carbs, and a banana, which has about 100 kcals of carbs, and I recover pretty quickly. Yeah, we’re all different, but still, 1000 kcals of dextrose seems like a hell of a lot.

I’d advise seeking some more opinions on those two matters before making any sweeping changes though. There’s at least no gaping holes, so that counts for something. All in all, it looks like a solid plan.

Peri-workout there would be some smarter options perhaps like waxy maize starch etc. lower calories, no sugar. However, dextrose is what I have (5kg of) and is what I can afford, so I have to base my principles around that, at least for now, Berardi’s recommendations actually put me at having closer to 60g Dextrose pre/post/during & around 30g Protein which would be just over 1 scoop pre/post/during, suppose I can save a couple of scoops a workout here by not going overboard with the whey. Could also half my scoops in the yogurt if necessary to save a bit, but whey/casien isn’t especially expensive. I also suppose it should be casien shakes/mixes outside of workout times too.

Protein clocks in as roughly:
340g protein non workout
420g workout with above reccs

I definitely don’t think I “need” that many total calories around workout times, but if having that amount of Dextrose is beneficial I can “live with” the extra calories, certainly, it’s not like Berardi to suggest a calorific approach without pretty good reason.

Potatoe/sweet potatoe at night would be fine imo if it was within the 2-4 hour window after workout, for non-workout days and maybe even workout too though, the portion could be half or less to minimise the damage, considering how many total calories I already seem to have.

Looking into adding BCAA/L-Glutamine/Leucine? to peri-workout shakes, again via Berardi’s recommendations (&CT is into Leucine iirc?), just trying to see if this is at all affordable, not the number 1 priority but once everything is in place it might be a good little proven boost.

[quote]chimera182 wrote:
Based on CT’s periworkout nutrition stuff you could probably cut out the dextrose PWO.[/quote]

yeah i agree, no one ever built muscle using carbs post workout…

[quote]E99_Curt wrote:
chimera182 wrote:
Based on CT’s periworkout nutrition stuff you could probably cut out the dextrose PWO.

yeah i agree, no one ever built muscle using carbs post workout…

[/quote]

I lol’d, think he means CTs reccomendations with pulsing and everything offer alternatives to the carbs, but as I said Dextrose is much more affordable, and surely tried and tested.

[quote]E99_Curt wrote:
chimera182 wrote:
Based on CT’s periworkout nutrition stuff you could probably cut out the dextrose PWO.

yeah i agree, no one ever built muscle using carbs post workout…

[/quote]

Because that’s exactly what I said. If he can utilize the carbs more effectively pre workout, why have them post?

[quote]jake_j_m wrote:
E99_Curt wrote:
chimera182 wrote:
Based on CT’s periworkout nutrition stuff you could probably cut out the dextrose PWO.

yeah i agree, no one ever built muscle using carbs post workout…

I lol’d, think he means CTs reccomendations with pulsing and everything offer alternatives to the carbs, but as I said Dextrose is much more affordable, and surely tried and tested.[/quote]

I didn’t say remove the dextrose completely, just have it pre as opposed to post.

Ah yeah i understand. I need to get up on my peri-workout though, the one im “following” is Berardi’s reccomendations (for my bodyweight) of 60g simple carbs, 30grams protein pre+during+post, potentially adding 3grams l-glutamine & 3grams bcaa pre+during+post.

Is this theory a little outdated now or are there just improved/better alternatives? Baring in mind I cannot afford (for now at least) the quality of protein required for proper pulsing and am using just a standard whey blend. Also I don’t quite understand the benifits of Leucine (dont have) or Creatine (do have) use around workout times, anyone care to clear that up if they know?

[quote]jake_j_m wrote:
Ah yeah i understand. I need to get up on my peri-workout though, the one im “following” is Berardi’s reccomendations (for my bodyweight) of 60g simple carbs, 30grams protein pre+during+post, potentially adding 3grams l-glutamine & 3grams bcaa pre+during+post. Is this theory a little outdated now or are there just improved/better alternatives? Baring in mind I cannot afford (for now at least) the quality of protein required for proper pulsing and am using just a standard whey blend. Also I don’t quite understand the benifits of Leucine (dont have) or Creatine (do have) use around workout times, anyone care to clear that up if they know?[/quote]

I’m sure Berardi’s stuff works, and works well. I just think that the new stuff might work better, and I’m willing to try it out.

CT’s new stuff for peri workout doesn’t really require pulsing. Just having specific carbs around your workout. If you can’t afford all the fancy supps, check out Waylander’s thread in the T cell where he talks about just having a lot of carbs pre workout, then protein post.

[quote]jake_j_m wrote:
I don’t weigh enough. I was having a massive steak the other day and decided steak will definitely solve everything. So guys, what do you think of my relatively simply bulk plan?

Meal 1: 4 turkey sausage sandwich. 1 scoop whey, 2 scoop ultra fine oats. 2 fish oils. 5g creatine (non workout days)
1000 or just under cals
Meal 2: Snack, 1 cup yogurt, 1 scoop protein. 300 cals
Meal 3: 200-250 grams lean beef mince or chicken/turkey breast, sandwich/quinoa/cous cous/sweet potatoe. Side carrot. 600 cals
Meal 4: As meal 2
Meal 5: Big steak 350g or more, 200g potatoe/sweet, broccoli/sweetcorn
Above 1100 calories here
Meal 6: snack/maybe nuts/fruit. 200-300 cals
Meal 7: Whey/Casien shake. 2 fish oil. 200 cals

Daily total: 3700+, I should grow on roughly 3300 though, so maybe bringing this to closer to 3500 would be wise?

Workout Nutrition:
Pre- 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g Dextrose
During- 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g Dextrose
Post- 5gram creatine, 1 1/2 scoop whey, 50g dextrose

Workout nutrition total: 1000 cals, this seems too much, half the cals? half the dextrose?

Some thoughts? Add more fish oils? Add olive oil/flax oil shots? Bit more fruit&veg? Any peri-workout reccomendations??

Cheers.[/quote]

Turkey sausage sandwhich for breakfast sounds yummy. Where do you get turkey sausage? Tesco?

Couple of things:

If you are going to have lean mince, i’d have more than 250g. It’s easy to eat so take advantage of that.

Stop measuring calories, it’s a meaningless number, just measure the amounts of food. If you aren’t gaining weight, add more (in manageable amounts, i.e - +4oz meat, +1/4 cup of rice/pasta etc, +1/2 a sweet potato).

Keep diets simple so they are easy to keep consistant.

Also, I wouldn’t count nuts/fruit as any of my meals.

[quote]chimera182 wrote:
If you can’t afford all the fancy supps, check out Waylander’s thread in the T cell where he talks about just having a lot of carbs pre workout, then protein post.[/quote]

Ah thanks I’ll take a look at that thread now, that place has some quality stuff from the brief time I’ve looked through it, I’m definitely willing to experiment if I can afford it.

Haha, I get my turkey sausages from Asda, 80% turkey, rest is mostly wheat flour, bit of maybe veg fat or something… so they are far from ideal for low-carb/completely clean approach but they are clean enough and for breakfast I “get away with it” the most anyway. Something like 435grams (8 sausages) for £1.50 if they are on offer, £1.76 i think if not, pretty much as cheap as meat gets, I have 4 per meal so 75p per meal for turkey sausage meat!

Mince wise I normally have a 200gram portion but just thought I’d up the ante a bit for the new bulk plan, with the rest of the day though I should be getting by far enough protein, so I’m just thinking roughly the amount you get divided in 3 out of a 750-800gram pack for 3 meals.

The nuts and fruit are just snacking foods yeah, but total cals & macros are effected by it quite abit if I eat alot. But to stop basing it on formulas and start in real world terms: I know I will grow at least for a while on this many calories, almost definitely, and the macros should be suffecient, even if my mono/poly Fats aren’t in place as much as they should be, I’ll eat like this and measure weight weekly or so if possible to detirmine my needs, thinking roughly this should hold me till 173+ though, we’ll see.

In terms of thinking about the best way to handle carbs, I’m thinking for all meals outside breakfast, workout and post-workout times I will replace the bread/carbs with a similar amount of calories from olive oil/flax oil/peanut butter. That little edit for maybe 8 of my meals a week or so could save me a little of the fat gain possibly.