The OP is at 20% bodyfat or more, so at that level its not that difficult to gain strength (and muscle) while slowly cutting. Just focus on great pre-peri- and post-workout nutrition.
You manage 4300 calories a day and only eat chicken breast, oats, rice, milk? I’d be surprised if there isn’t some less nutritious food behind the scenes, despite milk being an easy way of getting calories in.
It’s pretty simple, if you’re 20%bf (I expect this is an estimation from the mirror but please tell me if it is from a different measurement. If it is an estimate I would bet on it being higher than 20% after one year of training) and 230 lbs it means that you have 46lbs of fat on you (probably more). You are clearly eating too many calories for someone at 6 foot. Gradually cut your calories by 500 daily for a few weeks till your weight plateaus then repeat. When this stops working you can add in cardio/HIIT.
Kind of a related question. I’m 5’9" 195 lbs (morning weight) and bod pod says I’m 20%, electronic scales say 17%. From a subcutaneous fat perspective, I don’t look as flabby as you’d expect from such numbers though certainly not as lean as a lot of you guys.
I’ve been eating at maintenance since going from 175lbs to 195 over the past 4 or 5 months.
Is this a bad/good plan? My max’s continue to increase. Wondering if I should up the calories and deal with the fat gain for bigger gains in the gym but don’t want to get sloppy. Trainer says “eat more”.
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
Kind of a related question. I’m 5’9" 195 lbs (morning weight) and bod pod says I’m 20%, electronic scales say 17%. From a subcutaneous fat perspective, I don’t look as flabby as you’d expect from such numbers though certainly not as lean as a lot of you guys.
I’ve been eating at maintenance since going from 175lbs to 195 over the past 4 or 5 months.
Is this a bad/good plan? My max’s continue to increase. Wondering if I should up the calories and deal with the fat gain for bigger gains in the gym but don’t want to get sloppy. Trainer says “eat more”.
[/quote]
What are your macros? And why would you want to get fat if you’re making strength gains on maintenance?
Oh, I don’t want to get all sloppy, but some fat comes with the added muscle for the most part (I think new trainees are an exception, and perhaps those on AAS).
Quite honestly macros are all over the place. But I always get in 220g protein/day and around 2700-2800 calories. Some days end up carb heavy, usually training days. Others a lot of fat from fattier meats.
The only real high glycemic load carb I eat is rice. . .I’ve pretty cut out bread and definitely all sugar except for occasional use of dextrose post workout.
My gains I think are coming from being a newbie along with solid programming and intensity. I know they’ll slow as my training continues.
[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
Kind of a related question. I’m 5’9" 195 lbs (morning weight) and bod pod says I’m 20%, electronic scales say 17%. From a subcutaneous fat perspective, I don’t look as flabby as you’d expect from such numbers though certainly not as lean as a lot of you guys.
I’ve been eating at maintenance since going from 175lbs to 195 over the past 4 or 5 months.
Is this a bad/good plan? My max’s continue to increase. Wondering if I should up the calories and deal with the fat gain for bigger gains in the gym but don’t want to get sloppy. Trainer says “eat more”.
[/quote]
What are your macros? And why would you want to get fat if you’re making strength gains on maintenance?[/quote]
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
I’ve been eating at maintenance since going from 175lbs to 195 over the past 4 or 5 months.
[/quote]
Correct me if I’m wrong but gaining a pound a week seems like a bit over maintenance? Even for a new guy
Sorry. I meant that my caloric intake is at about maintenance level now. I’ve had no weight gain or loss in the last 6 weeks. The above pic was before I started training.
I was 175 when I started, now 195. Weight gain happened over about 5 months.
I’ve read that you can achieve faster than usual mass and strength gains for newbs and for people who were once big/strong. So I’m a newb and in my 20s I was a gym rat and got reasonably strong but there was no real programming. Just f’ing around.
I’m probably faced with the reality that big strength gains and mass gains will slow considerably as I move out of the honeymoon stage.
Don’t change what you’re doing when it’s working…just doesn’t make any sense. When you stop seeing improvement, you could use a calorie bump like a training stimulus that may or may not help you break a plateau. But there’s no way at this point you’ve maxed out the amount of muscle you can build eating that much protein and lifting enough weights to grow. And there’s definitely no way you’ve maxed out your nervous system’s efficiency at this point.
Introduce new wrinkles strategically, basically.
[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
Don’t change what you’re doing when it’s working…just doesn’t make any sense. When you stop seeing improvement, you could use a calorie bump like a training stimulus that may or may not help you break a plateau. But there’s no way at this point you’ve maxed out the amount of muscle you can build eating that much protein and lifting enough weights to grow. And there’s definitely no way you’ve maxed out your nervous system’s efficiency at this point.
Introduce new wrinkles strategically, basically.[/quote]
OK thanks. I’m overthinking things admittedly as I’m pretty excited to be back in the gym and having a blast; just don’t want the party to end. LOL.
What does nervous system efficiency mean? I’m guessing strength gains to improved muscle activation?
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
What does nervous system efficiency mean? I’m guessing strength gains to improved muscle activation?[/quote]
There’s a couple other factors besides that, like rate coding, but basically, yes. Getting better at using all the muscle you have, in a “relative strength” sense.
OK, thanks. Is there any way to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency, or is there a timeline that is used to estimate it? I’m guessing as you close in on optimal usage, you start hitting a plateau.
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
OK, thanks. Is there any way to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency, or is there a timeline that is used to estimate it? I’m guessing as you close in on optimal usage, you start hitting a plateau.[/quote]
“to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency”? I’m not really sure what you’re asking.
If you’re able to generate more force, your nervous system is more efficient.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
OK, thanks. Is there any way to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency, or is there a timeline that is used to estimate it? I’m guessing as you close in on optimal usage, you start hitting a plateau.[/quote]
“to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency”? I’m not really sure what you’re asking.
If you’re able to generate more force, your nervous system is more efficient.[/quote]
I just mean that heavy’s post implies that at a certain level of training you max out your strength and power gains due to improvements in neurological control. Just trying to get a better understanding of how/when that happens.
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
OK, thanks. Is there any way to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency, or is there a timeline that is used to estimate it? I’m guessing as you close in on optimal usage, you start hitting a plateau.
[/quote]
Reaching your true strength potential would require maximum nervous system efficiency. This is related to increasing your strength through practicing and mastering the lift without consideration for adding muscle. Hitting a plateau can be related to many things such non-optimal training stimulus, stress, muscle weakness, improper form, poor recovery, poor diet, etc. at is typically not related to attaining maximum nervous system efficiency.
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]knobby22 wrote:
OK, thanks. Is there any way to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency, or is there a timeline that is used to estimate it? I’m guessing as you close in on optimal usage, you start hitting a plateau.[/quote]
“to estimate one’s state of nervous system efficiency”? I’m not really sure what you’re asking.
If you’re able to generate more force, your nervous system is more efficient.[/quote]
I just mean that heavy’s post implies that at a certain level of training you max out your strength and power gains due to improvements in neurological control. Just trying to get a better understanding of how/when that happens.[/quote]
It’s probably never going to happen. You can pretty much always get better at technique since it’s nearly impossible to get the old 10,000 hours of mastery with a powerlift.
Better way of saying it is at your stage you aren’t anywhere near diminished returns.