T Nation

How to Change from 1/Wk to EOD?

I am currently on 200mg of testosterone once a week but would like to change my injections to every other day to help keep my levels normal throughout the week without the peaks. How much would I inject every other day?
-Bill

You are making big changes to your protocol and you aren’t likely to get it right the first time around and could take you the better part of 3-6 months to figure out. If you feel alright now except for the large peaks and troughs, I would start out at 150mg weekly split up twice weekly/EOD and see how you do.

It’s difficult to advise without knowing where your levels currently sit.

To actually answer your question, what is EOD? Every second day. So half the week. 7/2=3.5

So, 200 / 3.5 = 57mg per injection

If your SHBG is anything higher than 30 or so, I’d recommend twice weekly instead.

I just have been reading where people have split their doses up to twice a week, or EOD to help with estrogen control and keep testosterone at a steady level. I was also wanting to do SubQ injections so I’m thought they had to be split up.

If they are doing frequent administration in an effort to control estrogen, they don’t understand a thing. It’s to keep serum levels stable. Fluctuations in Serum levels are what often cause symptoms that people refer to as ‘high E2 issues’. Meanwhile when they go more frequent, their E2 barely changes but the symptoms go away. So it clearly wasn’t the E2. If you’re feeling up and down during the week, try more frequent and aww of that makes things better or worse. It’s that simple. I also wouldn’t recommend doing anything more than 0.3-0.4mL Sub-Q otherwise it may leave some large nodules. IM is typically the preferred starting point.

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Watched your video - what do you believe are the mechanisms involved in an AI masking issues on TRT? If issues are due an incorrect protocol, whether that’s incorrect dosing or administration schedule how does the AI mask these?
I understand you advocate strongly for not using an AI in the context of TRT although have you ever had anyone that was unable to dial in their TRT with dosage and administration schedule adjustment?

@dbossa
Not sure why message wasn’t posted as a reply.

I’m not ‘entirely’ sure. It’s possible that some guys get big fluctuations which spikes both testosterone and estradiol. At one point or another there may be huge variances in the ratios between them and taking an AI helps to control it. I really have no idea. Where it gets interesting is you get the same guy on the same weekly dose winding up with same total T, free T, and E2, doing more frequent injections, and his issues go away. So if his issues went away, with E2 the same, it wasn’t the E2. Dosing more frequent has a negligible impact on aromatisation but nothing significant enough to cause the night and day difference that it does. Not to mention, there’s DHT, IGF-1, estriol, estrone, and all the other hormones that are never finding any homeostasis or stability. When free T levels are at a decent level, and the guy says he’s injecting once a week but has symptoms, the very first thing I suggest is testing different injection frequencies and finding the one you feel best at. Once that’s determined you can start playing with dose. Always testing one variable at a time otherwise your experiment is useless.

So it begs the question: why take an anti cancer medication that is designed for women, that is toxic, just because you couldn’t be bothered to find a proper protocol where it isn’t needed all while taking advantage of all the benefits estradiol offers?

That does make sense, if someone starts out running a standard TRT dose and isn’t feeling great and mistakenly believes he needs an AI, it would bring the T and E2 ratio to a level that essentially masks systems. Being that e2 is being controlled and preventing Free T from being converted to e2, leaving higher levels of free T.

So in a lot of circumstances it’s simply fluctuating hormones that cause most issues? So simply changing administration schedule would have a huge impact.

I believe you. So far everything I’ve read points to an AI being unnecessary in the context of TRT. I mean, it may work, but why would you with the negative impacts it has on health when it’s as simply as taking the time to find the right protocol.

Thanks for the info. What you’ve said makes complete sense.

Not to mention, half the benefits people are after come from the actual action of aromatase.

“But I only want to lower E2 just a little bit, I don’t want to crash it!”

"So you only want to lower the benefits a little bit? Why would you want to do that??

The science is clear as day on this subject:

I don’t doubt your experience, but I just don’t get this at all. I am done with most symptoms of changing levels and pretty much know how I’m going to feel within two weeks of a dose change. Maybe three.

We can’t necessarily know that based on blood samples pulled very infrequently. E2 being at the same level at trough weeks apart doesn’t indicate the curve of aromatase activity. You would have to pull labs several times per day for multiple days to examine that.

Considering estradiol is a paracrine hormone and serum levels are essentially meaningless, even that test would produce irrelevant data. Serum levels do not drive tissue action.

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Keep in mind this is why I said I’m not entirely sure. I’m making an educated guess here as to why. I can tell you with certainty, however, that guys showing me their labs when doing once or twice weekly and moving to daily, for example, while keeping same weekly dose had a very tiny impact on measured estradiol. Not to mention, they found themselves able to raise their weekly dose, which in turn raised estradiol even further. So now they had even HIGHER E2 than they did previously and still symptom free. So, this would again demonstrate its not the E2. Simply find an injection frequency and weekly dose where you feel your best. It’s really that simple but people often lack the logic to create the strategy to figure it out.

I don’t think it’s trough numbers that matter for these guys. My purely anecdotal observations would steer me to believe they can’t handle the swings in ratio. I don’t think it’s the swings in T or E2 separately, it’s back and forth of the ratio that jacks with some people when they do less frequent shots. If the ratio stays steady, they simply adjust to that and problem gone.

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If I were to split it up, EOD, that would be .285 ml each injection. Is that correct?

Would twice weekly be every 3rd day? And how many mL do I inject on those days?

Twice weekly is like… twice in a week. Like, every Monday and Thursday for example.

Twice weekly is half a week. A week has 7 days. So how many days is half a week? Every 3.5 days. Dosing will be different that every 3rd day. The goal is to ensure your weekly dose adds up regardless of how many injections you want to split it into.

Yes. 1 / 3.5 = 0.285. Just round it to 0.29 or even 0.30.