How to 'Bulk' For Naturals

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
What sort of dietary approach would you suggest for someone who has the genetics of a distance runner and an appetite that self-regulates to 135lbs @ 5’10?[/quote]

It sounds like you are one of those people that will have a hard time putting on weight. Do you find that you can eat whatever you want and you can still see your abs? If you are one of those people, how you should start depends on your lifting experience. If you are a total noob, just make sure you have protein covered for you weight, and eat a little bit more than your current intake, say an extra 300cal. Once you have a solid foundation in Squats, Deads, Military press, Bench, Dips and rows (as in your technique is solid) then its time to push it.[/quote]

That’s was basically my approach before, and now that I’m back at it, again. The scale is moving in the right direction, strength (in the 8-15 range) is improving, and I look better than when I started.

Right now, I’m averaging about 2.5lbs a week weight gain, although there’s some muscle memory at play here. I went from basically 135->160 last year, so I’m working on getting that back.

Are these consistent enough to be useful? I know they’re not particularly accurate, but even if it’s 5% off, is it consistently 5% off?

[quote]I have a feeling you will find the number you need to gain is going to be more than you are used to eating.

Dairy IMO is best for peri-post workout. Yoghurt is actually a great one, just add 500g low fat natural yoghurt to your post workout shake and drink it up. That will spike insulin to a massive exent.[/quote]

Yes, it was more than I expected, but I’ve been able to do it with added dairy.

Before, I was using a shake made of protein powder + half&half + egg. Now, I’m using one that’s milk + powdered milk + pb + banana + ice cream + corn syrup + malt powder + egg.

Why use yogurt? Other than the obvious probiotic benefits, what else does yogurt do that other dairy sources don’t? Or do you mostly just suggest it for texture/thickness purposes?

How do you prepare the oats? I’m not a fan of oatmeal so I’m not really sure how to use them.

We need to consult ProfX. If there is ANY thread he can contribute in, this is it LOL

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]MassiveGuns wrote:

You need to buy a body fat monitor[/quote]

Are these consistent enough to be useful? I know they’re not particularly accurate, but even if it’s 5% off, is it consistently 5% off?
[/quote]

Most are by no means accurate…but they can help you keep track of where the “false number” is headed. I personally don’t think you need to worry about getting one…but if it helps have at it.

anyone here do arms twice a week? started doing it 2 weeks ago since my shoulders make my arms look really small. not to mention they’re extremely long.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.
[/quote]

Right, I get that.

But after that point, when you’re at the point of eating plenty of proteins and fats, and cut out the junk, how would you use foods to maximize protein synthesis?

EDIT: For that matter, how do you do it?

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:
anyone here do arms twice a week? started doing it 2 weeks ago since my shoulders make my arms really small. not to mention they’re extremely long.[/quote]

I do biceps almost everyday.

That is why they look like they do now. This is the best they have been in a long time…since my shoulder injury also meant no heavy alternate curls.

I do NOT train them heavy everyday as that would affect recovery.

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.
[/quote]

Right, I get that.

But after that point, when you’re at the point of eating plenty of proteins and fats, and cut out the junk, how would you use foods to maximize protein synthesis?[/quote]

My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:
anyone here do arms twice a week? started doing it 2 weeks ago since my shoulders make my arms really small. not to mention they’re extremely long.[/quote]

I do biceps almost everyday.

That is why they look like they do now. This is the best they have been in a long time…since my shoulder injury also meant no heavy alternate curls.

I do NOT train them heavy everyday as that would affect recovery.[/quote]

so you go light on most days and focus on a pump, no failure? i hate training like that makes me feel like im hardly doing anything.

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:
anyone here do arms twice a week? started doing it 2 weeks ago since my shoulders make my arms really small. not to mention they’re extremely long.[/quote]

I do biceps almost everyday.

That is why they look like they do now. This is the best they have been in a long time…since my shoulder injury also meant no heavy alternate curls.

I do NOT train them heavy everyday as that would affect recovery.[/quote]

so you go light on most days and focus on a pump, no failure? i hate training like that makes me feel like im hardly doing anything. [/quote]

Fuck the pump.

I go for form and really feeling that muscle work. I also often do a hold at the peak contraction on those days.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.
[/quote]

Right, I get that.

But after that point, when you’re at the point of eating plenty of proteins and fats, and cut out the junk, how would you use foods to maximize protein synthesis?[/quote]

My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.[/quote]

A few other questions then

  1. What did you do for breakfast?

  2. How did you approach post-workout nutrition? Pre-workout? During the workout?

  3. Did you eat before bed, or was your last meal a few hours before bed?

  4. I’m assuming your metabolism has slowed down over the years, so how has your approach changed?

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.

Furthermore, unless someone has the genetics I discussed before, the current concept of “bulking” has been murdered and been replaced with a bunch of internet warriors acting like bulking up means get fat.

That is the only reason this much bickering still exists.

Bulking up used to mean focusing on size and strength alone for a while and keep tabs on your body fat gain. That is all it is…and there is no exact blue print for that. You base it on the results seen.[/quote]

So instead of getting a calorie amount and letting them be flexible with food choices (which would actually allow them to reach a goal)

you have them pointlessly avoid certain foods yet stuff their faces and end up fatter than if they eat what they want in sensible amounts. makes sense.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.[/quote]

Translation: I have always winged it and have never put forth the effort to actually be able to quantify my body’s caloric needs, carb tolerance, etc. I think EVERYBODY should do the same thing, even if they have different goals than I do, like being under 15% bodyfat…which I’ve never done.

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.

Furthermore, unless someone has the genetics I discussed before, the current concept of “bulking” has been murdered and been replaced with a bunch of internet warriors acting like bulking up means get fat.

That is the only reason this much bickering still exists.

Bulking up used to mean focusing on size and strength alone for a while and keep tabs on your body fat gain. That is all it is…and there is no exact blue print for that. You base it on the results seen.[/quote]

So instead of getting a calorie amount and letting them be flexible with food choices (which would actually allow them to reach a goal)

you have them pointlessly avoid certain foods yet stuff their faces and end up fatter than if they eat what they want in sensible amounts. makes sense. [/quote]

I think you will find he is saying to eat enough to gain, while making sure you don’t get too fat.I’ve seen many people recommend avoiding certain foods because most people will struggle to truly moderate their intake of those foods, and will end up going way over their calorie amount.
If you eat lots of good foods, and limit the amount of junk you eat, it will be harder to overeat to the point where you’re gaining too much fat.

1 Like

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.[/quote]

Translation: I have always winged it and have never put forth the effort to actually be able to quantify my body’s caloric needs, carb tolerance, etc. I think EVERYBODY should do the same thing, even if they have different goals than I do, like being under 15% bodyfat…which I’ve never done. [/quote]

come on man. =\

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.[/quote]

Translation: I have always winged it and have never put forth the effort to actually be able to quantify my body’s caloric needs, carb tolerance, etc. I think EVERYBODY should do the same thing, even if they have different goals than I do, like being under 15% bodyfat…which I’ve never done. [/quote]

come on man. =\ [/quote]

Lol the truth hurts. But if your goal is to be just big honestly it’s not hard eat your pro and the rest is up to you and what you like eat lots of it

Is it necessary to know exactly how many calories your eating? Personally I put everything I eat into a calorie counter most days, but if your eating similar foods all the time, and keeping tabs on your appearance could you not simply just eat a bit less/do some more cardio, to slow down the rate your gaining? If that fails, then you can start being more precise, but surely not everyone needs to count, all the time.

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:

So instead of getting a calorie amount and letting them be flexible with food choices (which would actually allow them to reach a goal)

you have them pointlessly avoid certain foods yet stuff their faces and end up fatter than if they eat what they want in sensible amounts. makes sense. [/quote]

Nowhere did I write “stuff your face”.

It may help your constant confusion if you stuck to what I actually write.

You seem to have constant trouble when you make shit up.

[quote]whattt wrote:
Is it necessary to know exactly how many calories your eating? Personally I put everything I eat into a calorie counter most days, but if your eating similar foods all the time, and keeping tabs on your appearance could you not simply just eat a bit less/do some more cardio, to slow down the rate your gaining? If that fails, then you can start being more precise, but surely not everyone needs to count, all the time.[/quote]

Bingo.

Someone dedicated to this will not be eating drastically different everyday of the week.

This used to be common sense.

[quote]jskrabac wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
My personal rule was to focus on the protein and let the rest fall where it may when “bulking”…trying to avoid crap like donuts, cookies and sodas. I had the metabolism to match that so it worked.

For instance, yes, I would eat that hamburger…and may even eat 5 fries…but I would try to avoid the whole casual throw care to the wind pig out.

You watch the scale and the mirror and your strength. The rest depends on your genetics and the results you get.[/quote]

Translation: I have always winged it and have never put forth the effort to actually be able to quantify my body’s caloric needs, carb tolerance, etc. I think EVERYBODY should do the same thing, even if they have different goals than I do, like being under 15% bodyfat…which I’ve never done. [/quote]

Ridiculous post.

I know my bodies general needs without a calculator…because my diet does not change much from day to day.

This would be a natural part of a bodybuilder’s life as they learn what works for them.

Once again, it seems when none of you can argue what I write, you just make shit up and argue that.

[quote]whattt wrote:

[quote]Mtag666 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LoRez wrote:
The core question:

What kind of a modern “bulking diet” would you advocate in order to optimize muscle gains and take advantage of hormonal fluctuations, insulin response, etc.?[/quote]

I would avoid giving out a specific diet right off. I would just get them to understand the basics of how food works in their body.

I would tell them the crap that is likely much less useful to their goals…like cookies…and get them to understand that hamburger meat isn’t evil.

Furthermore, unless someone has the genetics I discussed before, the current concept of “bulking” has been murdered and been replaced with a bunch of internet warriors acting like bulking up means get fat.

That is the only reason this much bickering still exists.

Bulking up used to mean focusing on size and strength alone for a while and keep tabs on your body fat gain. That is all it is…and there is no exact blue print for that. You base it on the results seen.[/quote]

So instead of getting a calorie amount and letting them be flexible with food choices (which would actually allow them to reach a goal)

you have them pointlessly avoid certain foods yet stuff their faces and end up fatter than if they eat what they want in sensible amounts. makes sense. [/quote]

I think you will find he is saying to eat enough to gain, while making sure you don’t get too fat.I’ve seen many people recommend avoiding certain foods because most people will struggle to truly moderate their intake of those foods, and will end up going way over their calorie amount.
If you eat lots of good foods, and limit the amount of junk you eat, it will be harder to overeat to the point where you’re gaining too much fat.
[/quote]

Thank you.

I am not sure how anyone can argue this and look sane.