I have been using the westside template. DE squat and bench, ME squat and bench with accompanying supplemental exercises and accessory movements. my question is how often do you use the deadlift as your ME movement? i hear comflicting arguments that sometimes deadlifts are done as speed sets after squat workouts on ME day. Or that deadlifts are done rahter than squats but only once every certain amount of weeks. can somebody please straighten me out?
It really depends on how much you deadlift. I deadlift every other week alternating with speed sets. If you are deadlifting over 3x your bodyweight, you can probably only handle a ME day of deadlifts once a month.
You can it treat just like any other max effort movement. I know plenty of people that rotate between squats and deads each week.
Example
Week 1 Squat
Week 2 Rack-Pull
Week 3 Safety Bar Box Squats
Week 4 DeadLift
There are a lot of things that come in play that will determine how often you can pull. For example, I was able to DL pretty regularly until I hit 500(2.5xBW). Now I can’t do that. I can pull maybe once every three weeks, but usually it will be 4-5. I absolutely can’t pull two weeks in a row. The moral of story is that it is going to depend on your train age and how much big pulls take out of you. Experiment and you will learn.
Speed pulls are a different story. I was doing them every week after my DE squats. I could still do that, but I am doing other things currently.
[quote]Pemdas wrote:
You can it treat just like any other max effort movement. I know plenty of people that rotate between squats and deads each week.
Example
Week 1 Squat
Week 2 Rack-Pull
Week 3 Safety Bar Box Squats
Week 4 DeadLift
There are a lot of things that come in play that will determine how often you can pull. For example, I was able to DL pretty regularly until I hit 500(2.5xBW). Now I can’t do that. I can pull maybe once every three weeks, but usually it will be 4-5. I absolutely can’t pull two weeks in a row. The moral of story is that it is going to depend on your train age and how much big pulls take out of you. Experiment and you will learn.
Speed pulls are a different story. I was doing them every week after my DE squats. I could still do that, but I am doing other things currently.
[/quote]
i think that was my main question. i should have phrased it better. i was considering doing the speed pulls after my DE squats. not too many sets, not toomuch volume in general. im not a big fan of pulling every week or even every other week. i will most likely be pulling every third week for my ME workout while doing some lighter speed work on my DE lower days.
thanks for the input
I rotate Rack Pull, Zercher Squat, Deadlift, Box Squat.
I think some people can pull heavy every week and some people can only pull heavy every other week. I’m currently pulling every other week just because I can’t handle two heavy Squat/DL days so one of them needs to be a Dynamic Effort workout. I suppose if I did Heavy Squats and Heavy Pulling on ME Squat/DL workouts I could cycle
SSB Box Squats, Zercher Squats, Front Squats, Full Squats as my first ME lift and
Block Deadlifts, Rack Pulls, Deadlifts, Sumo Deadlifts as my second ME lift.
I have done something like this before where I’ve done 2 lifts for ME workouts but between going heavy on supplemental exercises, recovering from daily throwing workouts, and recently adding sled dragging into my workouts I think adding a second ME lift would stop the progress I’m making.
If all you’re doing is powerlifting, then you might be able to handle deadlifting every week. But I also think that all trainees should be squatting as frequently or more frequently than they deadlift.
Alternating Power Cleans and Deadlifts also works well if you’re not following Westside. If you follow Matt K’s template (he does no speed work) you know that he alternates Banded Back Extensions with Deadlifts but he once deadlifted every week. Instead of alternating back raises with deadlifts, alternate with Power Cleans.
Sun: Dead/PC
Mon: Rows + Triceps + Delts + Biceps
Wed: Olympic Squat/PL Squat
Thurs: Bench + Chins + Triceps + Delts + Biceps
If you do a DC template or a bodybuilding template that has a slot for a back thickness exercise you can alternate deads and rack pulls with T-Bar rows.
I deadlift once a week but I set it up like this:
Week 1: ME Deads
Weeks 2-3: DE/Speed Deads
Week 4: ME Deads
Weeks 5-6: Defecit Deads(off a platform or plates)
Repeat
I deadlift once a week. I will go 4 weeks straight with a deadlift or deadlift style movement (sumo, rack pull, snatch grip dead, good morning) and then take a full week off before doing a max effort attempt. So I only go Max effort once a month. This is not set off of any well known template, but I have tried many and like this the best. So far anyway.
I also am a big beleiver in the fact that everybody is different in terms of what works best for them. There are simply too many aspects that come into play during powerlifting.
I usually deadlift once a week. Now I don’t because of a back injury.
I was just pulling once a week for the past couple months, but I’ve gone as high as 4 times a week as well. Just depends on the volume and intensity.
I deadlift for a 1RM PR attempt after 6-8 weeks of OlyLifting.
Last week I hit a PR, 375lb (not much), after not DLing once for over 2 months.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
I was just pulling once a week for the past couple months, but I’ve gone as high as 4 times a week as well. Just depends on the volume and intensity.[/quote]
HAHAHA, my missus came in as I was reading your post and said ‘What the fuck???’
I just rotate it into my ME days everynow and then. I never back it up week after week though
I’ve pulled each week as well as squatting and it worked great.
I currently pull with 75-80% 10x1 once a week, some form of RDL or SLDL too, and a ME pull (sumos with 35’s or rack pulls) every 3rd week. It also seems to be working well.
The key to both is managing volume and intensity. I train with several 600+lb pullers, and once close to 700 at 198 who pull every week.
I deadlift once a week, and if you don’t, you’re a pussy! LOL
[quote]daraz wrote:
I deadlift once a week, and if you don’t, you’re a pussy! LOL[/quote]
That isn’t necessary true, how much of your bodyweight are you deadlifting? If you are deadlifting over 3x your bodyweight, you are going to need more then a week to recover. Again, it is the recovery that makes you stronger.
right now i’m deadlifting twice every 8 days, and doing some form of squat on each day…i always wondered if this was too much (only around 2xbw right now though)…so far with really focussing on eating and recovery methods its going ok so far…but maybe i should back off, i’ve only been back to this method for a month or two so far…
[quote]brian.m wrote:
right now i’m deadlifting twice every 8 days, and doing some form of squat on each day…i always wondered if this was too much (only around 2xbw right now though)…so far with really focussing on eating and recovery methods its going ok so far…but maybe i should back off, i’ve only been back to this method for a month or two so far…[/quote]
You should back off when you can’t add weight to your deadlift each time. You are probably fine for now.
Twice every three weeks as ME. Dead/Squat/Dead repeat. I don’t do speed deads.
[quote]anoddparadigm wrote:
daraz wrote:
I deadlift once a week, and if you don’t, you’re a pussy! LOL
That isn’t necessary true, how much of your bodyweight are you deadlifting? If you are deadlifting over 3x your bodyweight, you are going to need more then a week to recover. Again, it is the recovery that makes you stronger.[/quote]
You do realise that just because you can deadlift 3x bodyweight doesn’t mean you HAVE to do it every week.
Like I said previously, I train with many 3x bodyweight pullers and they deadlift weekly. They just don’t train absolute maxes all the time. They might do 4 weeks of SLDL’s, 4 weeks of Sumos, 4 weeks standing on boxes and then 4 to 6 weeks of conventional coming up to a comp.
And all of that is on a seperate day to their squat day.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
anoddparadigm wrote:
daraz wrote:
I deadlift once a week, and if you don’t, you’re a pussy! LOL
That isn’t necessary true, how much of your bodyweight are you deadlifting? If you are deadlifting over 3x your bodyweight, you are going to need more then a week to recover. Again, it is the recovery that makes you stronger.
You do realise that just because you can deadlift 3x bodyweight doesn’t mean you HAVE to do it every week.
Like I said previously, I train with many 3x bodyweight pullers and they deadlift weekly. They just don’t train absolute maxes all the time. They might do 4 weeks of SLDL’s, 4 weeks of Sumos, 4 weeks standing on boxes and then 4 to 6 weeks of conventional coming up to a comp.
And all of that is on a seperate day to their squat day.[/quote]
Revolutionary concept! training your dead.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
anoddparadigm wrote:
daraz wrote:
I deadlift once a week, and if you don’t, you’re a pussy! LOL
That isn’t necessary true, how much of your bodyweight are you deadlifting? If you are deadlifting over 3x your bodyweight, you are going to need more then a week to recover. Again, it is the recovery that makes you stronger.
You do realise that just because you can deadlift 3x bodyweight doesn’t mean you HAVE to do it every week.
Like I said previously, I train with many 3x bodyweight pullers and they deadlift weekly. They just don’t train absolute maxes all the time. They might do 4 weeks of SLDL’s, 4 weeks of Sumos, 4 weeks standing on boxes and then 4 to 6 weeks of conventional coming up to a comp.
And all of that is on a seperate day to their squat day.[/quote]
I don’t disagree with any of that. I was just saying he is only gonna do (for example ) 3RM max on his deadlift once every 2 weeks/every month. Of course he is going to do deadlift assistance exercises every week like SLDL, RDLS, Rack pulls, speed sets, etc.