T Nation

How Often Do You Cheat?


#1

Hi guys,

I simply would like to know how often you cheat during a bulk ? With cheating I mean something like fast food ,candy or similar. And do you count the calories for that ?

I've been bulking very clean for almost 2 months now, excluding christmas and new years eve and it's getting tough :smiley:


#2

And it will never get easy.
If it's a cheat then I would not cout the calories, if I did it would not be a cheat.
I cheat about once/week or once/2 weeks, then again I am at 16% bf...


#3

'Cheating' when on a bulk won't hurt you too much unless you start using crap food every day to try to reach your goals. Not that the food choices are especially bad, it's just that most people stop tracking #s when they start eating along those lines.

When I'm offseason (I don't "bulk" per say), as long as I'm getting some quality nutrients every few hours, I'll add whatever I want to it. When it's diet time though, no cheating, none, not even a thought in my mind.

S


#4

Is there a shop around you where you can buy willpower?
Not that it's very hard to try and not cheat but damn dude, "not even a thought" seems like you were trained with the guys above.


#5

Its one thing to sneak in a something here and there, just dont go on one of those full day cheats. Limit yourself to one meal of you cheat. its to easy to turn one bad move into a bunch of them.


#6

Stu is the 3rd dog from the left.


#7

For me..I feel like cheat days are better during a cut. Right now..certain days..about 3 out of the week, I'm only at around 800kcal no joke. Just my protein requirements, green veg and fish oil. By the end of the week, although leaner, I feel flat as fuck.

Depending on how hard I diet during the other 6 days of the week, I may include a full out cheat day on Sunday. Sometimes this is once a week and sometimes once every 14 days or so depending on how I feel. However, if I have a big cheat on Sunday..I almost always follow it up with a full 36 hour fast the following Monday.


#8

Once or twice a week... Adiposity at a high velocity will result otherwise.


#9

Jesus.....800k a day is crazy.... I mean, is it working out for you? Are you dieting for a contest or something?


#10

On a bulk, once I have established the meal schedule, I allow anything I have a mind to eat or drink at any time providing it is in addition to the schedule and not instead of. In addition will allow two restaurant meal replacements per week.


#11

how do you justify this kind've eating? 800kcal i mean.. seems like you're f*cking with your metabolism, wondering if it will/has had any negative effects.

As for cheating, I usually pick a meal a week. by a meal, i mean 1 meal. not a day. I'll head out to a restaurant, and not even consider macros, if it's on the menu it's fair game. Is it necessary? probly not, unlike Stu, i don't possess the willpower. It's nice to be able to look forward to something, makes my dieting much easier knowing i can stuff my face at some point. This is probably a bad psychological game of rewarding ones self with a detrimental prize.. oh well


#12

Well it's only for a week or 2 period and only about 2-3 days per week..the other days are near 2000kcal and maybe lowest 1400-600 accordingly..


#13

I still dont get why you have such insane low kcal days, granted i don't know your weight/bf.. you should read up on John Berardi's "A new view of energy balance", its on his website.


#14

For BB, I'm eating so much more than I do naturally that "cheat day" for me is skipping meals.


#15

Go read lyle mcdonalds rapid fat loss. Thats what it is based off of. There are many members that have had great success with it. I would be one of those (althought i wouldnt say great success as i am really not that big). But i dropped a bit over an inch off my waist and 10lbs in 8 days. Perfect way to strip some fat off fast. No muscle loss what so ever. And now right back to gaining. Of course its not for everyone. Some either cant take that low of cals because they are mentally weak. Or are to afraid of muscle loss (which doesnt happen as long as its run for a short amount of time and by the guidelines)


#16

by consuming that low of calories for such a short period of time, i'd contend you did not genuinely lose 10 lbs, rather, your glycogen/water/etc stores are emptied, and "water" weight was the bulk of what you lost, not necessarily fat. Eat a couple large meals, and you'd probably put most of it back on. Often periods of such severe restriction lead to negative binging, a thread facko himself created (not that he does than anymore, for i do not know).

sure, it's a quick way to lose "weight" however, is it necessarily healthy? probly not. sustainable? definitely not. Unless there is some deadline you're up against, i don't see the need to take such drastic measures. Not to mention, if he is training, with that sort of caloric restriction there would have to be some sort of negative effects.

I'm not saying this way is necessarily wrong, just suboptimal.


#17

What is "probably" unhealthy about it?
It 2 weeks maximum, what impact will a sub optimal 2 week (maximum) window have after a few weeks? Shit I bet you won't be able to tell any difference other than being tighter.


#18

How about you either A read the book or B try it before you start talking about it. Also try to do some simple math. You tried some a diff thread. 1lb of fat=3500 cal. Lets guess main of 2800. So 2000cal deficit every day. Even for 1 week that is 14000cal in the hole. That would be 4lbs of fat lost in a perfect word. Its never a perfect world so say 3lbs.

Also the weight lost does not just jump right back. I started at 194 and am currently a bit over a week back into gain mode and still only 189 and that inch off my waist has not returned.

Oh and i did have a large cheat on my bday to end it. 2gal of ice cream. 8000cals that day


#19

OP- FUCKING NEVER AAAAHHHHHH

I'm kidding. As long as the cheaty foods are coming in addition to a solid nutrition plan and not a part of the nutrition breakdown, don't worry about a little bit here and there. I went on a 3.5 week bulk in the fall and allowed dirty foods because I was busy and it was easy. Put on about 15lbs in that time period, but a shitload of it was water retention due to the garbage in highly-processed foods. A few pounds of that stuck and I crushed a ton of PR's on the last day of the bulking period, so I'm down with it. I don't think that was optimal at all though.


On the topic of cheats/dieting- I agree that extreme caloric restriction with cheats can be effective for a short period of time, but I don't think it's an effective way to go for a long-term fat loss plan. I did it for a whole semester of college, working on about 1000kcals/day 6 days/week and then allowing one cheat day/week.

I lost 30lbs (started at 220 and got to 187ish at my lowest). Yeah, I lost a lot of weight, but it was REALLY FUCKING BAD for my muscles. My strength levels were so low at the end of that. I started following Thibs' training methods and just eating to fuel serious training and I've since gained about 15lbs. I'm also leaner now, and I've stopped giving fux about scale weight.

So yeah, I think extreme caloric restriction can be a good tool on the short term. But in my experience it is not even remotely optimal on the long term. I'd really only give it a try if I had a period of time coming up when I wouldn't be able to train for some reason, or if I had a competition/date with a supermodel coming up. I don't think exteme caloric restriction leaves you looking very good because it cleans out the glycogen stores like a mofo and brings the flatness. The water loss can be sessi, but it really only looks good if you carb up while drinking nothing, which is just mis.

I'm just speaking from experience though- I'm a meathead and not a walking biology book or anything. I'm pretty much of the mindset that you can do whatever you want as long as you don't bitch about how hard it is/enjoy the results you're getting.

EDIT: I meant "30lbs" not "30lbs of fat." Typo, I promise I'm not that guy


#20

Sage...