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How Much More Weight?

I’m closing in on 200 pounds at 5’8-5’9" around 20% bodyfat. Which leaves me at around 160 pounds of LBM. I want to do a show before or during my freshmen year of college in 2 years(junior in HS now). HOw much more would I need to weigh before I can diet down and be competitive?

when you get to that stage you will know.

what weight class do you want to compete at? i think most people starting out at your height compete at 180, dry to the bone. keep in mind LBM also includes water weight which could be another 5-10 lbs entirely.

just dont get too far ahead of yourself. 2 years is a ways away.

[quote]LiveFromThe781 wrote:
when you get to that stage you will know.

what weight class do you want to compete at? i think most people starting out at your height compete at 180, dry to the bone. keep in mind LBM also includes water weight which could be another 5-10 lbs entirely.

just dont get too far ahead of yourself. 2 years is a ways away. [/quote]

interesting. My plan was to get up to 220 around the same or slightly less bodyfat by the end of senior year, and diet down from there. Most of you will recognize me as a powerlifter but competeing in bodybuilding is also something I want to do in my life. Hell, strongman too eventually. But that’s another thread.

http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/blog_sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_log/zepheads_log?id=1922298&pageNo=14

TOwards the bottom of that link is where I’m at now. I had leg pics posted a few weeks back. I’m bottom heavy as is. Are their any glaring genetic imperfections like shitty insertions. Or am I just too fat to tell?

I think , personally, that you need more mass. If you start doing carb curoffs and morning cardio on a regular basis (if that is something you are willing to do and have the means) then I think you should bulk for another 2 years smartly.

You are young and unless your final goal is to be 200lb I really think at this age it’s best to pack on as much mass as possible.

I think it’s a lot better to really built a great physique and only then diet down and really look great for a show. You have years ahead of you and adding more mass doesnt mean you need to become a fatass in the process.

I don’t know what you are eating now or how much energy systems work you are doing, and in the end of the day it’s all your call. These are all just suggestions and you seem like you know more or less where you are going. Good luck.

P.S
One thing I noticed was your 225lb bench on your log. I think a lot of people who are younger like us want everything now (it’s natural) but one thing I am sure you have realized is that this all takes many years. It will be much more rewarding, imo, if you get that bench up to at least 3 plates a side for reps (and have the resulting mass)before considering stepping on stage.
DOn’t get me wrong I am not trying to piss on your dreams, on the contrary, I think if you really put some years of your youth (whilke you have it) to try and become as strong and big as possible then later you can compete and it will really be worth it. Just my thoughts of course.

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
I’m closing in on 200 pounds at 5’8-5’9" around 20% bodyfat. Which leaves me at around 160 pounds of LBM. I want to do a show before or during my freshmen year of college in 2 years(junior in HS now). HOw much more would I need to weigh before I can diet down and be competitive?[/quote]

A lot.
20% bf and you are only 200 pounds…even in a natural show you would struggle. And if it is your first time to diet down, you will probably not do it optimally and you will lose a lot of muscle in the process, unless you do gear, in which case you won’t lose a lot.

[quote]Der Candy wrote:
It will be much more rewarding, imo, if you get that bench up to at least 3 plates a side for reps (and have the resulting mass)before considering stepping on stage.[/quote]

[quote]deanosumo wrote: A lot.
20% bf and you are only 200 pounds…even in a natural show you would struggle. And if it is your first time to diet down, you will probably not do it optimally and you will lose a lot of muscle in the process, unless you do gear, in which case you won’t lose a lot.[/quote]

i disagree with both of these statements. too many people are overly concerned and influenced by numbers whether it be body weight, lifting stats, bf %, measurements, etc. what really counts is how you look. i’ve seen so many guys who outweigh me and out lift me but they don’t look anything like me.

you can stand me next to a guy who’s my height (5’7), and say 175-180 lbs at 9% bf and can bench 315 for reps. in my best form, i was only 160 lbs at 9% bf. i can’t even bench 315 once. do you think you can automatically figure out who has the higher numbers just by looking at us? i’ll bet that in the majority of cases, you can’t. if i were ever to compete, i’d probably have to trim down close to 150 lbs! on paper, that’s not very impressive.

if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

i seriously suggest you start dieting down asap. when you get yourself under 10% bf, have some pictures taken and give yourself a hard, objective critique. do you need more size to make a dent in a show? maybe…maybe not at this point. you may look huge! or you may look like a skinny fitness model. it’s your body type…how you ultimately look on stage and not the actual numbers that will make or break your success.

I agree with 1morerep about the numbers. Hell I like numbers myself but lately I don’t give a shit about what weight I’m lifting. I’m concentrating on other shit then just lifting the weight and going through the movement.

I would guess myself to be somewhere around 20% and I still have way more shape. At this bf% you will still see the shape of your muscles. I really didn’t see anything that convinced me you lift in those pictures.

2 years is still a ways, so start lifting for size and don’t ego lift.

Personally if your keen on competing in 2 years, don’t waste time cutting because when your cutting your not gaining muscle, and you need to gain more muscle.

…i think anyone doing a show knows gear is a given.

[quote]1morerep wrote:
if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.
[/quote]

a-fucking-men…I feel like I’ve already been a victim of this myself!

[quote]acelement wrote:
1morerep wrote:
if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

a-fucking-men…I feel like I’ve already been a victim of this myself!

[/quote]

let’s face it. 1morerep is highly not the norm when it comes to #s like that

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
acelement wrote:
1morerep wrote:
if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

a-fucking-men…I feel like I’ve already been a victim of this myself!

let’s face it. 1morerep is highly not the norm when it comes to #s like that

[/quote]

He’s a fucking rarity which makes those agreeing with it sound a bit flaky. Acelement is 6’1". 200lbs is AVERAGE weight for that height for sedentary people. Comparing both of them as if people are just looking at numbers is retarded.

Also, if someone truly was 155lbs at 5’7" and a REAL 4% body fat, no one in their right mind would throw negative words in that person’s direction unless pictures showed them to be lying about how lean they are.

Why lie?

[quote]1morerep wrote:
Der Candy wrote:
It will be much more rewarding, imo, if you get that bench up to at least 3 plates a side for reps (and have the resulting mass)before considering stepping on stage.

deanosumo wrote: A lot.
20% bf and you are only 200 pounds…even in a natural show you would struggle. And if it is your first time to diet down, you will probably not do it optimally and you will lose a lot of muscle in the process, unless you do gear, in which case you won’t lose a lot.

i disagree with both of these statements. too many people are overly concerned and influenced by numbers whether it be body weight, lifting stats, bf %, measurements, etc. what really counts is how you look. i’ve seen so many guys who outweigh me and out lift me but they don’t look anything like me.

you can stand me next to a guy who’s my height (5’7), and say 175-180 lbs at 9% bf and can bench 315 for reps. in my best form, i was only 160 lbs at 9% bf. i can’t even bench 315 once. do you think you can automatically figure out who has the higher numbers just by looking at us? i’ll bet that in the majority of cases, you can’t. if i were ever to compete, i’d probably have to trim down close to 150 lbs! on paper, that’s not very impressive.

if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

i seriously suggest you start dieting down asap. when you get yourself under 10% bf, have some pictures taken and give yourself a hard, objective critique. do you need more size to make a dent in a show? maybe…maybe not at this point. you may look huge! or you may look like a skinny fitness model. it’s your body type…how you ultimately look on stage and not the actual numbers that will make or break your success.
[/quote]

It’s also pretty clear that you’re the exception, not the rule. You can look at zephead’s pictures and clearly see he doesn’t have your body type. While I agree the look is what matters, not the weight, he doesn’t have the look yet.

I think you should loose some bodyfat initially and then work on building mass over the long term. You don’t want to go from 20-30% even if you are gaining significant muscle. I would go down to around 10 or slightly visible abs and then start from there. Just keep an eye on your diet that go around so that it doesn’t get out of control.
That’s just my personal opinion because I hate having excess bf. A little bulk belly is ok though. Keep up the hard work!

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
It’s also pretty clear that you’re the exception, not the rule. You can look at zephead’s pictures and clearly see he doesn’t have your body type. While I agree the look is what matters, not the weight, he doesn’t have the look yet.[/quote]

Agreed.

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
I’m closing in on 200 pounds at 5’8-5’9" around 20% bodyfat. Which leaves me at around 160 pounds of LBM. I want to do a show before or during my freshmen year of college in 2 years(junior in HS now). HOw much more would I need to weigh before I can diet down and be competitive?[/quote]

My suggestion is to look at the teen class(you will be 19 right?) and find the guys who are in your height range… figure out what class they were in and add 40 lbs to that. You will need to be in decent shape at that weight to be competitive.

[quote]1morerep wrote:
Der Candy wrote:
It will be much more rewarding, imo, if you get that bench up to at least 3 plates a side for reps (and have the resulting mass)before considering stepping on stage.

deanosumo wrote: A lot.
20% bf and you are only 200 pounds…even in a natural show you would struggle. And if it is your first time to diet down, you will probably not do it optimally and you will lose a lot of muscle in the process, unless you do gear, in which case you won’t lose a lot.

i disagree with both of these statements. too many people are overly concerned and influenced by numbers whether it be body weight, lifting stats, bf %, measurements, etc. what really counts is how you look. i’ve seen so many guys who outweigh me and out lift me but they don’t look anything like me.

you can stand me next to a guy who’s my height (5’7), and say 175-180 lbs at 9% bf and can bench 315 for reps. in my best form, i was only 160 lbs at 9% bf. i can’t even bench 315 once. do you think you can automatically figure out who has the higher numbers just by looking at us? i’ll bet that in the majority of cases, you can’t. if i were ever to compete, i’d probably have to trim down close to 150 lbs! on paper, that’s not very impressive.

if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

i seriously suggest you start dieting down asap. when you get yourself under 10% bf, have some pictures taken and give yourself a hard, objective critique. do you need more size to make a dent in a show? maybe…maybe not at this point. you may look huge! or you may look like a skinny fitness model. it’s your body type…how you ultimately look on stage and not the actual numbers that will make or break your success.
[/quote]

I get what you are saying about the numbers and I agree with you.

My point was that I think he should focus on strength and size for a few more years (which at this point in time may be his most productive) and have a more impressive physique to step on stage with.

I am sure there are people out there who can look great benching 225 (you are testament to that), but I think zeph doesn’t fall into that category.

Just out of curiosity, how many years of serious training did you put down before you decided to diet down to your current leanness?

I take it you want to compete in a teen division? You can do that clear up to 19 so keep that in mind. I’d say pick a show before you turn 20 and zone in on that. Gain until you feel you need to start your cut.

Dont worry soo much about what you weigh unless it comes down to picking a class I.E. cutting another 5lbs even if it means muscle to get in a smaller class, or holding on to a lil water to compete in a bigger class.

Basically get as much muscle as you can, then start your diet. After you turn 20 you’ll be in another league with more goals. lol

Good luck dood.

DG

[quote]1morerep wrote:
Der Candy wrote:
It will be much more rewarding, imo, if you get that bench up to at least 3 plates a side for reps (and have the resulting mass)before considering stepping on stage.

deanosumo wrote: A lot.
20% bf and you are only 200 pounds…even in a natural show you would struggle. And if it is your first time to diet down, you will probably not do it optimally and you will lose a lot of muscle in the process, unless you do gear, in which case you won’t lose a lot.

i disagree with both of these statements. too many people are overly concerned and influenced by numbers whether it be body weight, lifting stats, bf %, measurements, etc. what really counts is how you look. i’ve seen so many guys who outweigh me and out lift me but they don’t look anything like me.

you can stand me next to a guy who’s my height (5’7), and say 175-180 lbs at 9% bf and can bench 315 for reps. in my best form, i was only 160 lbs at 9% bf. i can’t even bench 315 once. do you think you can automatically figure out who has the higher numbers just by looking at us? i’ll bet that in the majority of cases, you can’t. if i were ever to compete, i’d probably have to trim down close to 150 lbs! on paper, that’s not very impressive.

if i were to post here anonymously, sans pic, and say, “hey guys, i’m going to do my first show. i’m 5’7, 152 lbs at 4% bf. got any useful tips”? do you know the flaming i would get?!? what are u nuts?? get your ass back in the gym and gain some weight! but with my particular body type and full muscle shape, i’d be able to go at it with guys outweighing me by quite a bit so don’t be obsessed with numbers!

numbers are very useful…don’t get me wrong. they are an excellent guide to keeping track of progress (or lack there of). but the numbers themselves, or what they represent are meaningless. i’ve seen many guys benching 315 for reps and i swear you can hardly tell they work out.

i seriously suggest you start dieting down asap. when you get yourself under 10% bf, have some pictures taken and give yourself a hard, objective critique. do you need more size to make a dent in a show? maybe…maybe not at this point. you may look huge! or you may look like a skinny fitness model. it’s your body type…how you ultimately look on stage and not the actual numbers that will make or break your success.
[/quote]

good post

Yeah, I agree with most of this. I am not 1MR. Even if I do have a higher bodyfat In those pictures I look like I could weigh 160 pounds. That really irks me, and I want to add more size training into my routine.

I’ve been hitting Prs just about everytime I lift again and I’ve been feeling great, aside from the cold I just got. I really feel like I should keep going until I can’t keep hitting PRs.

As far as dieting down now. I don’t know if I just don’t get it but If I need more muscle before I compete anyways (and I deffinately do) shouldn’t I just keep going while as I’m hitting PRs all the time? I feel like I should prioritize arms chest and lats right now and If I’m making big gains I shouldn’t stop, yet.

I also get the feelign some of the posts where by people who thought I wanted to start show prep right now. Most deffinately not. I am nowhere near that point and am looking at competeing in a teen show as a long-term goal.