T Nation

How Much MAG-10 to Use on Diet?

If using Cy Willson’s steroid dieting protocol, how much MAG-10 would suffice to keep lbm loss to a minimum. Currently I’m near 12-14% bodyfat and would like to achieve 8% as soon as possible. I imagine it will take a maximum of 12 weeks to do so, using two 2 week on 4 weeks off programs but would like to achieve it in just 6 weeks. Since 1.5 capfuls (9ml) is good for gaining would half that (4.5ml) be good for dieting? I should mention that when I used 10ml/day I gained 12 lbs. without training and eating as much as planned. Any pointers or experiences w/ MAG-10 dieting would be very helpful.

OK, let’s assume you weigh about 200. In
that case, as an approximation (I’m aware
of the error but want to keep things simple)
dropping 4-6% means dropping 8-12 lb of
fat (actually slightly less.)

So at 2 lb/week, that would be 4-6 weeks
of dieting. At a more aggressive 3 lb/week,
which could require T3, it would be 3-4
weeks.

Personally, I’d like doing this as 2 weeks
of VERY severe dieting on MAG-10, one dose
per day, with MD6 or ephedrine/caffeine,
and T3, going up to no more than 50 mcg/day.
The T3 is optional but would improve speed.

By very severe dieting, I mean only one gram
of protein per lb LBM, so say 180 grams per
day (720 calories) and then no more calories
than this in combined carbs/fats. The total might be as low as about 1200. (Natural trainers, don’t try this.)

Then two weeks maintenance, no MAG-10 but using Clomid, or Tribex + Vitex, or Tribex + M; then repeat two weeks of dieting.

That might do it right there. If no T3,
then another round would probably be needed.

1/2 a dose (4.5 ml) is what I have seen as the best place to start while on a severe diet. Monitor body composition and if lean body mass is coming off too quickly you could up the dose as needed.

Bill, what does your training look like on this type of diet? Do you do any cardio?

I should have mentioned that I’m 204 lbs. Your guess was dead on. Thanks for replying quickly because I’m planning on starting Monday. My plan was similar to your idea. Here is my supplement program: Weeks 1-2 use daily MAG-10 at 1 dose, 6 caps Old MD6 split into 3 equal doses with 100mg extra caffein each dose, and 4 caps of Old T2. Weeks 3-4 use daily 3 caps M and 4 caps Tribex. Weeks 5-6 same as Weeks 1-2. So plan is to lose 3 lbs./week of fat mass during weeks 1-2 and 5-6 for a total of 12 lbs. Dieting protocol will be in next post…

…Weeks 1-2 eat daily 200g protein, 40g fat, and 70g carbs for a total intake of 1,440 calories. this is 55% protein, 25% fat, 20% carbs. details of diet is basically 4 meals of 2 scoops adv. protein with 6 fish oil caps (1,800mg EPA/DHA) and 1 meal of 2 scoop surge. every third day or so i might substitute a chicken breast, a salmon filet, or a lean cut of steak for the protein. since i’m clearly not getting the calories here i might consider a multi-vitamin. Weeks 5-6 are same. for Weeks 3-4 I don’t know what my diet should be. i will bring the cals back up to maintenance or near it but i don’t know how much carbs i should eat. i was thinking doing 45% protein, 30% fat, 25% carbs and only eating carb sources like oatmeal, 2 pieces of bread, 2 pieces of fruit, and veggies in a day. okay from this plan, does it sound like i should lose the stubborn 12 or so lbs. of fat i accumulated from a mass phase about 6 months ago from poor eating. i should mention that most of my bodyfat is in my abdominal area. thanks for the help Bill and any others who reply.

would using T2 be as effective as using T3 if i’m trying to stay legal while trying your recommendations?

my training is using the Fat to Fire program during my severe dieting weeks. if i ever have enough energy i might add a light cardio session on weight training days.

The original T2 can be substituted for T3,
at I think no more than 3 capsules per day
or certainly if you exceed it, work up to any increase very gradually and surely don’t go far past that.

T2 is quite effective but it may plausibly
be, and seemed to be with experience, somewhat less effective. The reason perhaps is that T3 metabolizes readily to T2, so when you take T3 you get both T3 and T2 in good quantities, but metabolism of T2 to T3 is less significant so basically the effect is basically from increased T2. That’s my hypothesis anyway.

how do you get T3 without a perscription??? and what are the side effects and things i should watch out for?

Man, this is so ironic!!! I have easy access to T3 but not to MAG10 (my order was stopped at the Canadian border) and you have the opposite problem. How about an exchange…(sigh)

Without a prescription, in the US T3 is probably available only from your favorite steroid dealer (though T3 is not a steroid.)

At lower doses, especially 12.5 mcg/day, there are really no side effects. At moderate doses such as 25 mcg/day, there is some suppression of natural thyroid production which if extended over time can result in difficulty in recovering natural thyroid production after the cycle. Also, there may be some sleep disturbances. Doses of 50 mcg/day increase these effects but otherwise are usually not problematic. Going past 50 mcg/day does not radically improve fat loss results but does significantly increase adverse effect.

Quoting from the Physician’s Desk Reference (not that this is a particularly good source of information, but in this case the quote is accurate) side effects include “Headache, irritability, nervousness, sweating, arrhythmia (including tachycardia), increased bowel motility and menstrual irregularities. Angina pectoris or congestive heart failure may be induced or aggravated. Shock may also develop. Massive overdosage may result in symptoms resembling thyroid storm. Chronic excessive dosage will produce the signs and symptoms of hyperthyroidism.”