How Many Cycles in Should My Failure Set

Grabs popcorn for incoming shitstorm.

[quote]punmaster wrote:
You are forgetting that ,as he has mentioned multiple times, he was a discus thrower for his track and field team in college and therefore did not start with a beginner base. It is very deceptive of you and Wendler to speak of his progress as though it was the benchmark/ typical progress you should expect when going on 5/3/1, and consequently go on a “THANK YOU FOR DOING MY PROGRAM AND NOT ASKING QUESTIONS” rant. Most people do not progress that fast, therefore I believe it to be perfectly reasonable to ask questions/readjust when your progress does not reflect expectations.

Also @Jim Wendler, everyone in the powerlifting community knows that you are HIGHLY defensive and critical about people who even think about inquiring on slower then expected progress. Asking questions, Jim, and readjusting when you don’t meet expectations is how you progress in LIFE. If questions about progress irritate you this much, I would propose that you have insecurities regarding the effectiveness of your program that YOU need to address. From what I can see, you are proposing that EVERYONE be satisfied with whatever progress comes of 5/3/1 and remain completely silent on the issue. That is a ludicrous rule to live by unless you produce double-blind studies that prove that your program has no room for improvement and will outperform all other programs in terms of long term strength gains.
[/quote]

Oh you’ve done yourself in now buahahaha

To the OP, you probably did the right thing when you dialed back your training maxes. Now you just need to do the program and do it for a long time, like 1-2 years.

I’ve made some incredible gains but there have been times I felt like I was stalling or going backwards. Early on my squat didn’t improve as fast as my other lifts. I’m a member of Jim’s forum and asked him on there what to do. His reply was something to the effect of “you’ve made some progress, what’s the problem”. I took that to heart and did the program. Now I’m prepping to squat 700 in a meet and the squat is my best lift. If anything my progress probably stalled from being too ambitious. I got an injury bug when I started doing all out PR Sets, FSL, and Jokers EVERY workout.

Stop the programming ADD and do the program. On Jim’s forum he has new templates that most of you have never even heard about. I typically file them away in the back of my brain as something I will try later, but for now I’m just going to keep doing what I’m doing and ride the hell out of it until it doesn’t work anymore.

OP, I don’t think Jim ever said this program was totally optimal. An “optimal” program would be highly goal specific and would have to be tailored to the individual.

What 5/3/1 IS, is a well-rounded program that is simple to use, works very well for virtually anyone who does it by the book, highly flexible, and usable for a long period of time.

The last two months I wanted to add some size, and successfully added 5-10 lbs w/ 531, hard work, and food. Now I have a 15k in march. A few modifications and I’ll be using 531 whilst I train for that, and expect to do well.

Also, the program progresses in weight AND reps, which allows for lots of improvement. Not to mention that you get out of a program what you put in.

[quote]punmaster wrote:
Im 5’11 200lbs (probably 25-30% BF) 21 years old
Squat (beltless/with knee sleeves):1529lbs
Bench: 1554lbs
Deadlift: 1573lbs
Press:585lbs[/quote]
Seems legit :wink:

[quote]jajarven wrote:

[quote]punmaster wrote:
Im 5’11 200lbs (probably 25-30% BF) 21 years old
Squat (beltless/with knee sleeves):1529lbs
Bench: 1554lbs
Deadlift: 1573lbs
Press:585lbs[/quote]
Seems legit ;)[/quote]

Yeah. These numbers makes you look like a troll.

If you could handle even half of those weights you would have years of experience and insight. Then you would not need to ask these questions from Jim or anybody else. You would already know what works for you and what does not.

And for you blames concerning to Wendler and the program: Well, I admit that he is not always as charming and helpful as many other coaches in T-Nation, but he often has a point. Nobody does not say 5/3/1 is something miraculous compared to other good strength programs around. But it is a good training philosophy and there is reason for everything.

Now look things from Jims view - he has developed a great and flexible training method which can be suited or almost anybody, and he spends great amount of time in internet to answer these questions, often without charge.

I surely believe he has other things to do, and he feels some pride for the program. Then people come to ask some obvious things (I found myself guilty here also), and when he advises them they surprisingly often decide not to follow the advice. So it is understandable that he seems a little irritated at times.

Maybe you’re just young. Train some years and do things in you life (get a family etc.), then you get some perspective on things.

To the topic: I have decided to follow the popular 5-3 split. I have done it just once (going through my second 15 week block now), but it felt good thought the last cycle was really tough. The program seems to work optimally for me with lower TM (first 3 cycles).

The original numbers he posted were more reasonable and actually were not bad numbers, but then he had a little hissy fit and decided to change them to some ridiculous numbers. I think the program may not work for him due to interactions with his psychiatric medications.

[quote]Discobolus wrote:
The original numbers he posted were more reasonable and actually were not bad numbers, but then he had a little hissy fit and decided to change them to some ridiculous numbers. I think the program may not work for him due to interactions with his psychiatric medications. [/quote]

lol no hissy fit, I live in residence (university) and last night was day 4 of carnival week so there were a lot of friends in my dorm and they were telling me to use troll numbers. I didn’t but I guess one of them decided to edit the post lel

changed them back tho

also big shout-out to everyone who took the time to write up recommendations and share their exp

What do you consider not optimal progress with a squat that’s about 2.5 and a deadlift that’s damn near 3 times body weight?

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
What do you consider not optimal progress with a squat that’s about 2.5 and a deadlift that’s damn 3 times body weight? [/quote]

This. You’re relatively strong (not in the eyes of elite PL, but for most of people), must have been doing something right. Still way to go if you want to be strong, but specially squat and DL looking good.

[quote]punmaster wrote:

Also @Jim Wendler, everyone in the powerlifting community knows that you are HIGHLY defensive and critical about people who even think about inquiring on slower then expected progress.
[/quote]

He has answered before, and I’m paraphrasing here: “Guys tell me 5/3/1 is too slow on progress, it’s not enough. I ask them how much they increased their BP in the last year. They look down and walk away.”

The real reason he probably doesn’t get into it with every Johnny-come-lately is because A: He really doesn’t care what YOU do for your training, and B: he’s seen far too many people that use 5/3/1 grow their numbers PERIOD that the idea it’s “too slow” seems silly when you are thinking lifelong instead of weeklong.