How Do You Rank MMA Quality?

Another hijack concerning a fight on the same card- coleman vs this japanese wrestler legend.

In my humble opinion, Coleman took a dive.
I wonder how much you have to pay a guy like him? Perhaps there is blackmail involved?

[quote]Mousse wrote:
elliot007 wrote:
I agree with xen on all points except BJ would get faber out of there.

Faber beat jens solidly, but Penn annihilated him. Penn annihilated sherk. Destruct and destroyed joe stevenson, beat the piss out of Gomi. slapped around both renzo and rodrigo gracie, fought better against machida than rich franklin, tito ortiz, and sokodjou. Also lost a narrow decision to GSP, and is 1-1 against matt hughes

so, i dont see Faber offering any threat to BJ

I agree with all XN’s points except I like TUF and agree with the “no stomping” rule.

BJ is a great fighter at 155.

GSP is at his best right now IMO and BJ can’t seem to go up in weight without running into conditioning problems. Even if he packed on solid muscle he doesn’t get past GSP so what’s the point? I’m really looking forward to watching GSP dominate Penn. Fitch is no joke btw and will be a good tune up match before Penn if that’s where this thing ends up.

As far as Faber goes, I’m not sure he can get much bigger! He’s a rock and a big rock at that and conditioned to the max. I think a Faber vs Penn fight would be incredible personally, but a risk for Faber going up.

Let’s not forget Faber’s ability to improvise - he’s like a monkey in there. This fight would go the distance IMO and “going the distance” and “BJ Penn” bares a striking resemblance to oil and water;)

Another incredible fighter in the WEC is Carlso Conti, but then again at 170 the UFC has a handfull of fighters that would probably beat him.

[/quote]

I like BJ Penn @ 155 and I think there are a LOT of fights still there for him. It’s pretty arrogant imo to believe that he beat a few guys which are easy for him stylistically and now should move up without facing the guys still at 155 that could actually pose a problem for him.

There are a smattering of guys that shouldn’t be in the UFC at 170, and there are a some that should have been there a long time ago… Carlos Condit is the latter. I’m not sure how he’d do against some of the UFC weight cutting monsters at 170 but he more than has the skills to take nearly everyone except GSP (a few are iffy to me).

He’s pretty much the only person i think could keep up with Anthony Johnson standing right now… but again the size is a problem he doesn’t seem that big and i dont know where he cuts from.

interesting observation… Dana White acts like its about the organization and treats fighters like crap. I could put up a bunch of quotations that prove such. But when a talk regarding quality of MMA organizations comes up, guess what occurs?

It goes right back to the fighters…

THE FIGHTERS MAKE THE LEAGUE!!!

Anyway, imo the UFC would do good restructuring some divisions and buying up fighters. But again they probably want to but fighters are expecting huge pay days (in the eyes of the UFC) so don’t sign.

[quote]Mousse wrote:
elliot007 wrote:
I agree with xen on all points except BJ would get faber out of there.

Faber beat jens solidly, but Penn annihilated him. Penn annihilated sherk. Destruct and destroyed joe stevenson, beat the piss out of Gomi. slapped around both renzo and rodrigo gracie, fought better against machida than rich franklin, tito ortiz, and sokodjou. Also lost a narrow decision to GSP, and is 1-1 against matt hughes

so, i dont see Faber offering any threat to BJ

I agree with all XN’s points except I like TUF and agree with the “no stomping” rule.

BJ is a great fighter at 155.

GSP is at his best right now IMO and BJ can’t seem to go up in weight without running into conditioning problems. Even if he packed on solid muscle he doesn’t get past GSP so what’s the point?

I’m really looking forward to watching GSP dominate Penn. Fitch is no joke btw and will be a good tune up match before Penn if that’s where this thing ends up.

As far as Faber goes, I’m not sure he can get much bigger! He’s a rock and a big rock at that and conditioned to the max. I think a Faber vs Penn fight would be incredible personally, but a risk for Faber going up.

Let’s not forget Faber’s ability to improvise - he’s like a monkey in there. This fight would go the distance IMO and “going the distance” and “BJ Penn” bares a striking resemblance to oil and water;)

Another incredible fighter in the WEC is Carlso Conti, but then again at 170 the UFC has a handfull of fighters that would probably beat him.

[/quote]

Faber isn’t going up in weight, unless he can find a way to avoid fighting Tyson Griffin again.

A fat, out of shape BJ took St. Pierre to a decision where GSP basically laid on BJ for two rounds to eke out a ‘win,’ yet a BJ who packed on solid muscle wouldn’t stand a chance? hahaha

considering GSP’s record in rematches i would never write off the canadian

[quote]Xen Nova wrote:
Mousse wrote:
elliot007 wrote:
I agree with xen on all points except BJ would get faber out of there.

Faber beat jens solidly, but Penn annihilated him. Penn annihilated sherk. Destruct and destroyed joe stevenson, beat the piss out of Gomi. slapped around both renzo and rodrigo gracie, fought better against machida than rich franklin, tito ortiz, and sokodjou. Also lost a narrow decision to GSP, and is 1-1 against matt hughes

so, i dont see Faber offering any threat to BJ

I agree with all XN’s points except I like TUF and agree with the “no stomping” rule.

BJ is a great fighter at 155.

GSP is at his best right now IMO and BJ can’t seem to go up in weight without running into conditioning problems. Even if he packed on solid muscle he doesn’t get past GSP so what’s the point? I’m really looking forward to watching GSP dominate Penn. Fitch is no joke btw and will be a good tune up match before Penn if that’s where this thing ends up.

As far as Faber goes, I’m not sure he can get much bigger! He’s a rock and a big rock at that and conditioned to the max. I think a Faber vs Penn fight would be incredible personally, but a risk for Faber going up.

Let’s not forget Faber’s ability to improvise - he’s like a monkey in there. This fight would go the distance IMO and “going the distance” and “BJ Penn” bares a striking resemblance to oil and water;)

Another incredible fighter in the WEC is Carlso Conti, but then again at 170 the UFC has a handfull of fighters that would probably beat him.

I like BJ Penn @ 155 and I think there are a LOT of fights still there for him. It’s pretty arrogant imo to believe that he beat a few guys which are easy for him stylistically and now should move up without facing the guys still at 155 that could actually pose a problem for him.

There are a smattering of guys that shouldn’t be in the UFC at 170, and there are a some that should have been there a long time ago… Carlos Condit is the latter. I’m not sure how he’d do against some of the UFC weight cutting monsters at 170 but he more than has the skills to take nearly everyone except GSP (a few are iffy to me).

He’s pretty much the only person i think could keep up with Anthony Johnson standing right now… but again the size is a problem he doesn’t seem that big and i dont know where he cuts from.

interesting observation… Dana White acts like its about the organization and treats fighters like crap. I could put up a bunch of quotations that prove such. But when a talk regarding quality of MMA organizations comes up, guess what occurs?

It goes right back to the fighters…

THE FIGHTERS MAKE THE LEAGUE!!!

Anyway, imo the UFC would do good restructuring some divisions and buying up fighters. But again they probably want to but fighters are expecting huge pay days (in the eyes of the UFC) so don’t sign.

[/quote]

Werd

[quote]slimjim wrote:
Mousse wrote:
elliot007 wrote:
I agree with xen on all points except BJ would get faber out of there.

Faber beat jens solidly, but Penn annihilated him. Penn annihilated sherk. Destruct and destroyed joe stevenson, beat the piss out of Gomi. slapped around both renzo and rodrigo gracie, fought better against machida than rich franklin, tito ortiz, and sokodjou. Also lost a narrow decision to GSP, and is 1-1 against matt hughes

so, i dont see Faber offering any threat to BJ

I agree with all XN’s points except I like TUF and agree with the “no stomping” rule.

BJ is a great fighter at 155.

GSP is at his best right now IMO and BJ can’t seem to go up in weight without running into conditioning problems. Even if he packed on solid muscle he doesn’t get past GSP so what’s the point?

I’m really looking forward to watching GSP dominate Penn. Fitch is no joke btw and will be a good tune up match before Penn if that’s where this thing ends up.

As far as Faber goes, I’m not sure he can get much bigger! He’s a rock and a big rock at that and conditioned to the max. I think a Faber vs Penn fight would be incredible personally, but a risk for Faber going up.

Let’s not forget Faber’s ability to improvise - he’s like a monkey in there. This fight would go the distance IMO and “going the distance” and “BJ Penn” bares a striking resemblance to oil and water;)

Another incredible fighter in the WEC is Carlso Conti, but then again at 170 the UFC has a handfull of fighters that would probably beat him.

Faber isn’t going up in weight, unless he can find a way to avoid fighting Tyson Griffin again.

A fat, out of shape BJ took St. Pierre to a decision where GSP basically laid on BJ for two rounds to eke out a ‘win,’ yet a BJ who packed on solid muscle wouldn’t stand a chance? hahaha[/quote]

Really? In hindsight I think I should have mentioned several others. GSP and BJ have evolved right now into the best fighters that they have been to date, and GSP is still at least a notch above Penn. It’s not even subjective, when the fight is over you may bow to me, and if Penn wins I’ll tattoo your avatar on the tip of my penis.

[quote]Mousse wrote:
slimjim wrote:
Mousse wrote:
elliot007 wrote:
I agree with xen on all points except BJ would get faber out of there.

Faber beat jens solidly, but Penn annihilated him. Penn annihilated sherk. Destruct and destroyed joe stevenson, beat the piss out of Gomi. slapped around both renzo and rodrigo gracie, fought better against machida than rich franklin, tito ortiz, and sokodjou. Also lost a narrow decision to GSP, and is 1-1 against matt hughes

so, i dont see Faber offering any threat to BJ

I agree with all XN’s points except I like TUF and agree with the “no stomping” rule.

BJ is a great fighter at 155.

GSP is at his best right now IMO and BJ can’t seem to go up in weight without running into conditioning problems. Even if he packed on solid muscle he doesn’t get past GSP so what’s the point?

I’m really looking forward to watching GSP dominate Penn. Fitch is no joke btw and will be a good tune up match before Penn if that’s where this thing ends up.

As far as Faber goes, I’m not sure he can get much bigger! He’s a rock and a big rock at that and conditioned to the max. I think a Faber vs Penn fight would be incredible personally, but a risk for Faber going up.

Let’s not forget Faber’s ability to improvise - he’s like a monkey in there. This fight would go the distance IMO and “going the distance” and “BJ Penn” bares a striking resemblance to oil and water;)

Another incredible fighter in the WEC is Carlso Conti, but then again at 170 the UFC has a handfull of fighters that would probably beat him.

Faber isn’t going up in weight, unless he can find a way to avoid fighting Tyson Griffin again.

A fat, out of shape BJ took St. Pierre to a decision where GSP basically laid on BJ for two rounds to eke out a ‘win,’ yet a BJ who packed on solid muscle wouldn’t stand a chance? hahaha

Really? In hindsight I think I should have mentioned several others. GSP and BJ have evolved right now into the best fighters that they have been to date, and GSP is still at least a notch above Penn. It’s not even subjective, when the fight is over you may bow to me, and if Penn wins I’ll tattoo your avatar on the tip of my penis.[/quote]

Have to save this one

How does taking someone down and laying on them place GSP a notch above BJ? Everyone talks about GSP’s evolution as a fighter, but the only area I’ve truly seen vast improvement in is his wrestling.

Otherwise, his standup is basically the same it has always been, he’s learned a few new combos that can be impressive, but he’s still operating out of the same basic skill set on the feet. Maybe in terms of his ground game there has been some improvement, but then we’ve never really seen GSP in trouble on the ground before except for the one time Hughes submitted him.

All I’m saying is, before you guys get your panties in bunches, is that while it is ridiculous to write of GSP, it’s equally ridiculous to write off a fighter like BJ who has the ability to finish a fight from any position in the octagon.

I’ll settle for “property of slimjim” on one of your testicles.

[quote]slimjim wrote:
How does taking someone down and laying on them place GSP a notch above BJ? Everyone talks about GSP’s evolution as a fighter, but the only area I’ve truly seen vast improvement in is his wrestling.

Otherwise, his standup is basically the same it has always been, he’s learned a few new combos that can be impressive, but he’s still operating out of the same basic skill set on the feet. Maybe in terms of his ground game there has been some improvement, but then we’ve never really seen GSP in trouble on the ground before except for the one time Hughes submitted him.

All I’m saying is, before you guys get your panties in bunches, is that while it is ridiculous to write of GSP, it’s equally ridiculous to write off a fighter like BJ who has the ability to finish a fight from any position in the octagon.

I’ll settle for “property of slimjim” on one of your testicles.
[/quote]

I don’t know…I’ll think about it, although I doubt we need to worry about it. I’ve always wanted to have some sort of surfer tattoo, and living in Ohio makes this pretty unreasonable, but this would be the perfect excuse - besides, do you really want your name on a gonad?

I get your point, and ruling anyone (ahem-Matt ahem Serra) out is pretty ignorant IMO, which is pretty much exactly what I did :stuck_out_tongue: I guess I’m thinking along the lines of them both giving their best performance - which with it being such a marquee fight, I imagine that is exactly what we would see. And no, GSP does not possess the heaviest of hands but he knows how to bring it if he connects, he has excellent fighter intuition and he certainly has the stronger kicking game, while Penn probably has the heavier of hands. I gave the GSP notch + above Penn due to his ability to dominate within the toughest weight class in MMA and the fact that he is and will be in far superior condition. I stand by my prediction.