T Nation

How Do People Use Steroids Before Age 25?


#1

Arnold started steroids at 15, theres a dude on instagram doing tren at 16 (this guy is a lost cause, i know), and just about every mens physique athlete/fitness model is doing steroids far before the age of 25.

My question is, how do they get away with this and live a long healthy life like Arnold?

The reason i ask is, because im 20, and part of an elite coaching group. One of the worlds most successful supplement companies is gonna sponsor 1 athlete from our group for sure.

I have everything except for the body. I believe i have a very good chance of getting the sponsorship, because Im more marketable, more sophisticated, have a much larger online presence than the rest of the group, and i own 2 fitness businesses which i can use to promote the supp line.

But I dont want to mess up my body by doing steroids before 25. If i lose out on the sponsorship, it most likely will be because i dont have the body. Would you guys recommend going on a cycle at 20 years old, to pursue a career in the fitness industry? (I wont be dependent on competing and sponsorships, i have my own businesses that are doing well, but it would be a great opportunity to get more exposure and network within the industry)


#2

No one is going to say yes.

Do you know what can go wrong and what needs to be done and why?
Don’t count on getting good advice from other gym rats, many are doing stupid cycles and PCT. You need to do a lot of study.


#3

Not to say that this was caused by steroids necessarily, as Arnold has had an extraordinarily stressful life between hiding a mistress and having a political career, but Arnold has had significant heart trouble. He’s not exactly the epitome of health. I imagine he’s had fairly enormous healthcare bills over the years. It’s a well documented fact that many, many steroid users have health problems that can be attributed to their steroid usage.

What the fuck are you talking about with this coaching group though? You’re 20. You are not an elite coach. Don’t give us that garbage.

Also, what sort of athlete are you? What do you compete in at a high level? What would make a top supplement company even want to sponsor you?

Your body looks like garbage anyway. Steroids aren’t going to fix that. You obviously suck at training and diet as far as your own physique goes, which gives me absolutely no faith in your assertion of being some sort of elite coach. You are light years away from attaining what can be done naturally in the first place. But of course you already know this, as your elite coaching team should have already told you this.


#4

Flip, agree with most of what you said. Arnold and other pro bodybuilders are not the epitome of health, but then again, i wont be taking the kind of dosages they take.

I should have been clearer. When i say im part of an elite coaching group, i mean to say that i am being coached, not doing to coaching. The coaching includes everything that an athlete needs, from training, to nutrition, and learning to market ourselves. Its a group of 25 members in my country, and everyone except for me in the group is above 30 years old, on juice, and competing in shows like MuscleMania. Im just getting started in this industry.

Im not saying that they will definitely sponsor me, but I will regret it all my life if i dont try everything thats needed.

I was a highly successful athlete at national level karate in india, but have gotten into bodybuilding and fitness lately. In karate, we train for agility, speed, and core strength. Training for strength and hypertrophy was pretty much out of the question.
So yes, i am fairly inexperienced, and thats why im here for guidance.


#5

If you’re part of such an elite group, then why are you here “for guidance”???


#6

That clarifies quite a bit, thank you for that. Now I have more questions.

  1. How do you know you won’t be taking the dosages they took? Do you actually know how much or how little Arnold used? I certainly don’t.

  2. What do you think sponsors are looking for in their athletes, other than physique and performance? Why would they choose the guy who is just getting started in the industry over guys who have competed on big stages? And can you quantify your online following? If you don’t have literally a million youtube subscribers, you really don’t have much to offer in that respect. Just something to consider. Your claim that you’re more marketable than these other athletes seems strange. I’m not sure why you believe that if you have a worse physique than they do. I don’t know how ‘being sophisticated’ means anything at all in the industry.

  3. Does being a former karate competitor make you marketable in your country? I know it wouldn’t in most countries.

You should understand that there will be many, many opportunities in your future if you’re the kind of person you suggest that you are. Don’t be short sighted.


#7

first things first, Arnold was born with a heart defect.

anyways…

I started using steroids when I was 20, for no other reason than I ‘felt like using them’. Would I go back and do it all over again if I could?

Absolutely… though I would have never PCT’d and just blasted/cruised (which I started doing when I was 22).

injectable steroids by themselves are not nearly as dangerous as many will have you believe (unless you have underlying health issues/genetic predispositions).

it’s high doses of injectable steroids, combined with high doses of GH, ran for extended periods of time. Add insulin, lots of oral steroids, stimulants like clenbuterol, diuretics to get ready for the stage, and painkillers to help mask the pain from joint issues from moving ridiculous amounts of weight for years.

I think you get the picture…

on blasts, stick to moderate doses of testosterone about 1 gram/week, maybe 600mg of EQ/week (im not a big fan of nandrolone decanoate as it is bad for blood vessels), NPP would be fine to rotate with EQ I guess since it gets out of your system faster than the decanoate ester thus helping to mitigate the damage.

and you shouldn’t really need more than 400mg of tren a week… maybe a moderate dose an oral like dbol if you are trying to grow, and anadrol if you are going through a diet phase (anadrol tends to reduce appetite, so it’s beneficial for dieting periods as it is also very good at preserving strength and size under caloric restriction. if anadrol doesn’t reduuce your appetite, it’ll be very good for growing as well).

blast for 10 weeks, cruise for 8-10 weeks (longer cruise if you want…)

cruise dose should be 200-300mg of testosterone/week

letrozole will be your AI of choice.

use tudca, curcumin, vitamin k2, a good fiber supplement, fish oil, and nac, and you should be just fine.

keep your blood pressure in optimum range, don’t drink alcohol, and eat a clean diet, dont get fat, and you should be just fine.


#8

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:
first things first, Arnold was born with a heart defect.

anyways…

on blasts, stick to moderate doses of testosterone about 1 gram/week, maybe 600mg of EQ/week (im not a big fan of nandrolone decanoate as it is bad for blood vessels), NPP would be fine to rotate with EQ I guess since it gets out of your system faster than the decanoate ester thus helping to mitigate the damage.

and you shouldn’t really need more than 400mg of tren a week… maybe a moderate dose an oral like dbol if you are trying to grow, and anadrol if you are going through a diet phase (anadrol tends to reduce appetite, so it’s beneficial for dieting periods as it is also very good at preserving strength and size under caloric restriction. if anadrol doesn’t reduuce your appetite, it’ll be very good for growing as well).

blast for 10 weeks, cruise for 8-10 weeks (longer cruise if you want…)

cruise dose should be 200-300mg of testosterone/week

[/quote]

did not know this about Arnold. I’ve always mostly assumed that his heart problems were related to the stresses I mentioned. I would still think they’d be contributing factors. But whatevs.

At the risk of a hijack (you can respond in the thread I created if that makes more sense), those are the main injectables I was planning on running for the next couple blasts. Although I was planning on running 500 test rather than a gram. So my questions would be as follows: If I do run EQ and Tren at 500ish, you would suggest running test at 1000? How long do you run orals for, and how much time in between do you generally have? I was looking at the first and last 4 weeks of both blasts. I was also only planning on cruising for about a month. You think 2 months would be significantly better? I wouldn’t have an issue with doing that.

Purpose of the cycles are primarily strength-oriented. Weight gain is fine if it happens, also fine if it doesn’t.


#9

First off, thanks for the responses, flip and mr walkaway.

I am gonna give out some more details here-

  1. Yes, i am inexperienced and dont have the best body, but i am working towards it. Diet, training and supplementation is on point for now. I am seeing great progress since the last 6 months, test levels are climbing.

  2. Flip, you are right. My assumption that i will get the sponsorship is not based on how large my following is, but rather how large my following is AS COMPARED to the other members of the group (my following on instagram is 80k, the guy with the next largest following in my coaching group has 5k followers).

The coaching group consists of less than 30 members, and the company has promised to sponsor at least one athlete from within this group.
I also have a digital magazine on fitness (not gonna give out the name because i dont want my real Identity online), and it has featured some of the major names in the fitness industry, such as spokespersons and people who have video trainer series on another site. I believe i can leverage the magazine in my favor (50k+ subscribers), and this is why i have a better chance of getting the sponsorship.

Im gonna launch a youtube channel soon, i have set long term plans for myself, found a business mentor and have a friend who has 15 years of digital marketing experience helping me out.
Also, when i said sophisticated, i meant presentable and well spoken. Most of the guys in the group cant really speak a whole lot of english, just their native tongue.

  1. No the karate probably wont help.

I have been reading these forums for 6 months now, i have a basic understanding of steroids. I would be extremely careful, and responsible if i use them. If i use steroids at all, i would go easy. My first cycle would be Test Sustanon 500mg a week (inject every alternate day) (sustanon because i can acquire pharma grade sust without a script, friend’s dad works at a pharmacy), and maybe some dbol to kick start the gains.

I dont see myself ever injecting more than 2g a week in any cycle, and i’ll probably stay away from tren till my 3rd cycle.

I dont mean to sound or be short sighted, its just that this is a supplement company who’s beliefs and ideology totally lines up with mine, and it is my favorite brand. It would be a dream to work with this company.

I know i will have many more opportunities in th future, but i just want to make sure that i try my best at this one.


#10

Also, thanks for all the input of cycles, mr walkaway.

A little off the topic, a few years ago, i read this article in one of bodybuilding.coms forums. It was an old interview, i think with Serge Nubret or Sergio Olivia (i cant recall exactly who, but it was a well known old school black bodybuilder, i remember this for certain because he mentioned racism in the sport)

He spoke about how arnold and mike mentzer nearly had a physical altercation at the 1980 olympia. Mike was pissed because Arnold was Joe Wider’s favorite and would win the title regardless of his size. Mike also seemed mad about the fact that Arnold was making big money in movies.

The interview also spoke about steroids, the bodybuilder said something along the lines of ‘today’s bodybuilders abuse the steroids too much, but its not my position to say anything, back in our day we were just as reckless, Mike Mentzer was injecting 1.5g of deca per week, Arnold was popping Dbol without even keeping track of how many he was taking. We had a bowl of Dbol on the kitchen table and we would eat them like candy. Arnold and Franco always had an edge over the rest of us because they would travel to Europe and come back with something none of us had access to - primobolan’

It was an interesting read, I’ll see if i can find the link


#11

http://nattyornot.com/steroids-used-golden-era-bodybuilding/


#12

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
did not know this about Arnold. I’ve always mostly assumed that his heart problems were related to the stresses I mentioned. I would still think they’d be contributing factors. But whatevs.

At the risk of a hijack (you can respond in the thread I created if that makes more sense), those are the main injectables I was planning on running for the next couple blasts. Although I was planning on running 500 test rather than a gram. So my questions would be as follows: If I do run EQ and Tren at 500ish, you would suggest running test at 1000? How long do you run orals for, and how much time in between do you generally have? I was looking at the first and last 4 weeks of both blasts. I was also only planning on cruising for about a month. You think 2 months would be significantly better? I wouldn’t have an issue with doing that.

Purpose of the cycles are primarily strength-oriented. Weight gain is fine if it happens, also fine if it doesn’t.[/quote]

testosterone is my favorite aas… it’s cheap and effective. I am of the believe that your doses should be progressive, so ill answer your question with a question - how much testosterone did you use last blast?

that should help you decide how much to use this time.

as for orals, I run them throughout my blast. I use 1 gram of tudca a day and 1200mg NAC alongside.

I would strongly recommend cruising for more than 4 measly weeks… you need to give your body a break from all the drugs…and besides, if you are using longer esters, they won’t even be completely cleared out after 2 weeks into your cruise anyway…

as ive mentioned in other posts, I like to use about 250mg of DNP/day on my cruise phases. this will really help you drop the fat during your cruise, and increase your insulin sensitivity so you will be “primed” by the time your next blast rolls along.


#13

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
did not know this about Arnold. I’ve always mostly assumed that his heart problems were related to the stresses I mentioned. I would still think they’d be contributing factors. But whatevs.

At the risk of a hijack (you can respond in the thread I created if that makes more sense), those are the main injectables I was planning on running for the next couple blasts. Although I was planning on running 500 test rather than a gram. So my questions would be as follows: If I do run EQ and Tren at 500ish, you would suggest running test at 1000? How long do you run orals for, and how much time in between do you generally have? I was looking at the first and last 4 weeks of both blasts. I was also only planning on cruising for about a month. You think 2 months would be significantly better? I wouldn’t have an issue with doing that.

Purpose of the cycles are primarily strength-oriented. Weight gain is fine if it happens, also fine if it doesn’t.[/quote]

testosterone is my favorite aas… it’s cheap and effective. I am of the believe that your doses should be progressive, so ill answer your question with a question - how much testosterone did you use last blast?

that should help you decide how much to use this time.

as for orals, I run them throughout my blast. I use 1 gram of tudca a day and 1200mg NAC alongside.

I would strongly recommend cruising for more than 4 measly weeks… you need to give your body a break from all the drugs…and besides, if you are using longer esters, they won’t even be completely cleared out after 2 weeks into your cruise anyway…

as ive mentioned in other posts, I like to use about 250mg of DNP/day on my cruise phases. this will really help you drop the fat during your cruise, and increase your insulin sensitivity so you will be “primed” by the time your next blast rolls along. [/quote]

I just recently came off of 750mg/week test only, and my strength in all lifts is currently the best it’s ever been. About a 1500 total. And testosterone has served me quite well to this point, so I guess no need to spend the money on EQ.

And noted on the cruise. I’ll plan for 8 weeks or more.

About the Tudca and Nac… This seems like it would be pretty expensive based on what I’ve seen… at least 100 bucks a month? Does that sound like what I should expect?


#14

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
About the Tudca and Nac… This seems like it would be pretty expensive based on what I’ve seen… at least 100 bucks a month? Does that sound like what I should expect?[/quote]

the amount you would use is really dependent on the amount/type of oral aas you are taking…

50mg dbol/day or 100mg anadrol/day? I don’t think tudca is really necessary…

a significant dose of superdrol and/or m1t? you may want to use 500-1000mg/day


#15

[quote]Mr. Walkway wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
About the Tudca and Nac… This seems like it would be pretty expensive based on what I’ve seen… at least 100 bucks a month? Does that sound like what I should expect?[/quote]

the amount you would use is really dependent on the amount/type of oral aas you are taking…

50mg dbol/day or 100mg anadrol/day? I don’t think tudca is really necessary…

a significant dose of superdrol and/or m1t? you may want to use 500-1000mg/day[/quote]

Got ya. Labs have looked really good each time I’ve gotten them done. And I don’t intend to go over the aforementioned levels of dbol or anadrol. I’ll plan on running the Tudca when I run Halo (and maybe other things) the last month of the 2nd blast.


#16

Thought you had a strong dislike for EQ, walkaway?


#17

[quote]eatliftsleep wrote:
Thought you had a strong dislike for EQ, walkaway?[/quote]

I do, but OP’s ambitions seem modest

EQ is relatively low risk if you keep your eyes on your hematocrit and RBC levels


#18

hairydinkbrah , Im going to go with, Go For It, if you can get it. You clearly are a well thought out, ambitious person. I’ve seen worst reasons to do a cycle and things still turned out fine, maybe better than fine. Do your research, get your PCT together and start with a Pharmaceutical grade Test only cycle.

I prefer longer esters because they stay stable and you don’t feel as if you are on a roller coaster, but that’s just me and allot of people like shorter cycle times so take your pick. As you said, You are not a Pro like Arnold Schwarzenegger so you will not be doing a pro cycle. But remember, this is a line that you can not uncross and You are responsible for the outcome, good or bad.


#19

[quote]Socalshocker wrote:
hairydinkbrah , Im going to go with, Go For It, if you can get it. You clearly are a well thought out, ambitious person. I’ve seen worst reasons to do a cycle and things still turned out fine, maybe better than fine. Do your research, get your PCT together and start with a Pharmaceutical grade Test only cycle.

I prefer longer esters because they stay stable and you don’t feel as if you are on a roller coaster, but that’s just me and allot of people like shorter cycle times so take your pick. As you said, You are not a Pro like Arnold Schwarzenegger so you will not be doing a pro cycle. But remember, this is a line that you can not uncross and You are responsible for the outcome, good or bad. [/quote]

Thanks. Im going to wait it out for another 6 months, im working as a Personal trainer, and have now quit my job.
The long hours dont allow me to take care of myself, so i decided to focus on online coaching, and on my business instead. The first few months will be rough, but I’ll be able to get back in shape, take care of myself, have more time for family, etc

The cycles and sponsorship can wait.
I still will apply for the sponsorship, i’ll try and leverage my large following, my experience as a marketing executive, and my business to score the sponsorship as a natty.

If i dont get it, then fuck it. I’ll live another day and try again next year, when i have my shit together


#20

I always laugh at this wait til 25 garbage. Stop reading shit boards like uk muscle where a bunch of 20% bodyfat 35 year old gym rats talk about how all you need is 500mg test and food.

OP if your diet and nutrition is on point and you are serious about this then start. What the fuck do you think is going to be different magically at 25 vs 22???

Also basically everything walkaway said except I don’t like that it comes off as “the correct way” regarding the ratio’s and doses.

I also say blast minimum 14 weeks if using long esters, and EQ is so long 16-20 IMO, if you tolerate it well that is.

I don’t get the point of 8-10 week long ester blasts, get your blood concentration up and only have it at a peak level 4-6 weeks (with e or cyp, deca and eq are even longer)?? What sense does that make.