How Come We Never See Huge Zercher Lifts?

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

This lift looks fucking dangerous to anyone who values their arm development.[/quote]

… and riding a motorcycle is dangerous to anyone who value their lives.

Look there are almost always some safer way to do something, people take other paths for no other reason that they want to.

You think it’s stupid to do zerchers, but than again I’m sure YOU do something that would make someone else shake their heads at the risk to reward ratio.

Compared to riding a bike instead of a car, doing zerchers instead of normal deadlifts seems like a minor issue. lol
[/quote]

OK, so now we aren’t discussing effectiveness and injury prevention in rating how much attention a movement should get…it is now about the thrill?

I don’t ride my motorcycle just for transportation. I would pick air conditioning and four wheel drive every time if that were the case.

I do it BECAUSE there is a risk and I enjoy the feeling it provides…almost like flying.

If THAT is why you lift, then your comment makes perfect sense.

If you lift for a specific purpose shown in results, then it doesn’t.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

This lift looks fucking dangerous to anyone who values their arm development.[/quote]

… and riding a motorcycle is dangerous to anyone who value their lives.

Look there are almost always some safer way to do something, people take other paths for no other reason that they want to.

You think it’s stupid to do zerchers, but than again I’m sure YOU do something that would make someone else shake their heads at the risk to reward ratio.

Compared to riding a bike instead of a car, doing zerchers instead of normal deadlifts seems like a minor issue. lol
[/quote]

OK, so now we aren’t discussing effectiveness and injury prevention in rating how much attention a movement should get…it is now about the thrill?

I don’t ride my motorcycle just for transportation. I would pick air conditioning and four wheel drive every time if that were the case.

I do it BECAUSE there is a risk and I enjoy the feeling it provides…almost like flying.

If THAT is why you lift, then your comment makes perfect sense.

If you lift for a specific purpose shown in results, then it doesn’t.[/quote]

I’m saying some people just like to train, and see how much weight they can move. A buddy of mine is like that, he wants to know how much he can do on farmer walks, zerchers, old school weight lifter exercises, whatever. That is what he enjoys, and when I tell him he would have bigger muscles if he focused on a few basic lifts over time, he just laughs at me. Yes, for him it’s about the thrill of what his body can do, and as such the lifting IS the goal. For you the results are the goal. The thread was in GAL, so I didn’t read the OP in a bodybuilding context.

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

I’m saying some people just like to train, and see how much weight they can move. A buddy of mine is like that, he wants to know how much he can do on farmer walks, zerchers, old school weight lifter exercises, whatever.
[/quote]

I know…and most of them fall into the category I talked about before…the type who never make much physical (or even much overall strength) progress but use something arbitrary like “function” to justify the time they spend on this.

To each his own…but I think most would agree that when it comes to getting shit done and actually accomplishing something that translates as significant progress to others (whether that be bodybuilding or powerlifting) those types are NOT the ones to pull it off.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
My comment wasn’t directly to the Original Poster…so what is your problem?

There are several other movements for lower back development that do not put the biceps tendon in a position to be injured…so why even approach this as if this needs to take first in line over all of those?

Are YOU recommending people start using Zercher lifts for this purpose? Or are you just here arguing with me because I posted?

Tell us, do you think this lift is the best way to get the job done?
[/quote]

While we’re on the topic of doing stupid shit in the gym: I’d imagine you’d consider someone* trying to curl 100lb DB’s without a proper warm-up and ACTUALLY hurting their bicep dumber than someone who’s training for strength sports using zerchers as a tool for posterior chain development. No?

*like, say, oh, I don’t know… you.

Also, show me where I said this lift should be first in line for lower back development. I specifically said on the first page it’s good for VARIATION. So far all you’ve contributed to this thread is belitteling people for being smaller than you (as usual), twisting others’ words (as usual), and saying that you think the movement is retarded - when it’s likely you’ve never even done them, let alone done them for a significant period of time to see what your results were. While the last bit about you think they’re retarded is relevant, OP is still going to do them, which is why I gave him advice on how to do them and even gave him (and anyone else who’s reading this thread) advice on how to make them a better movement.

re: the part I bolded, I never ONCE said in this thread ANYTHING about the purpose of this movement is lower-back development. You, in your egotistical head, thought “well MY goals are hypertrophy and lower back development, thus any movement that doesn’t directly help this cause is retarded.” I did, however, mention increasing DL lockout strength, which I think the zercher lift can be greatly beneficial. I’ve also discussed this matter with other powerlifters (some being weekend warriors and some being world record holders) and some of them think there’s a place in training for this movement.

And I didn’t want to suggest the OP do rack pulls… because, you know, those aren’t real.

[quote]
Or am I your main focus still?[/quote]

Get over yourself. And before you get a hard on because of how “on your nuts” I am for remembering you hurt your bicep a while back acting like an insecure child and “proving” to some no-named retard at your local gym that you can curl 100s, I’ll let you know it’s just because I have a pretty good memory for random, ridiculous shit.

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

While we’re on the topic of doing stupid shit in the gym: I’d imagine you’d consider someone* trying to curl 100lb DB’s without a proper warm-up and ACTUALLY hurting their bicep dumber than someone who’s training for strength sports using zerchers as a tool for posterior chain development. No?

*like, say, oh, I don’t know… you.
[/quote]

There’s no need to read the rest of the crap you just posted because this dumb comment is enough by itself. My picture is right there. I have had ONE injury in the years I’ve been training and it it obviously didn’t keep me from making progress.

Most people anywhere near my size have injured themselves way worse over time. My injury was caused by not warming up enough…something that I try avoid from that point forward. If you see that as a “failure” in some way, you have issues.

For the record, I sure as hell hope all of your own progress is visible here to be calling me out like that for a training injury.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, this shit was posted in the GET A LIFE section yet idiots are acting like only powerlifters can respond? Shouldn’t it be in that section if that is the goal? I think this was moved from the bodybuilding section.

That would mean we all get to comment on how ridiculous this movement is in comparison to others.

LOL @ retards.[/quote]

No one’s saying BB’s CAN’T respond, it’s just that your goals are completely different than the OP’s, and you’ve offered very little advice in HIS thread about HIS training and managed to interject YOUR thoughts on YOUR goals.

It’s similar to posts like yours a few down in this thread:

When that guy commented on his thoughts, you said “please show back” as if to say “show RELEVANT back development progress or have your thoughts completely dismissed.”

So in a similar fashion, “please show zercher lift/deadlift” [or have your thoughts completely dismissed.]

It’s funny how, in almost every other thread, you ask for proof of muscle development before even considering someones opinion on matters of muscle development - which, isn’t necessarily a bad thing, obviously - but when YOU’RE asked to provide proof relevant to this thread (ie, a big deadlift or zercher lift), you don’t need to.

Who are you? Fucking roguevampire?

Continue having your fun being a huge fucking hypocrite.

You also completely ignored the fact that two of this sites most impressive lifters, hungry4more and maraudermeat, both include them in their training.

But what the fuck do I know? I’m not even a fuckin’ DOCTOR.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

While we’re on the topic of doing stupid shit in the gym: I’d imagine you’d consider someone* trying to curl 100lb DB’s without a proper warm-up and ACTUALLY hurting their bicep dumber than someone who’s training for strength sports using zerchers as a tool for posterior chain development. No?

*like, say, oh, I don’t know… you.
[/quote]

There’s no need to read the rest of the crap you just posted because this dumb comment is enough by itself. My picture is right there. I have had ONE injury in the years I’ve been training and it it obviously didn’t keep me from making progress.

Most people anywhere near my size have injured themselves way worse over time. My injury was caused by not warming up enough…something that I try avoid from that point forward. If you see that as a “failure” in some way, you have issues.

For the record, I sure as hell hope all of your own progress is visible here to be calling me out like that for a training injury.
[/quote]

LOL. Argue a minute point that I made about you being guilty of doing stupid shit in the gym before that’s FAR dumber than what the OP’s doing, and completely ignore the RELEVANT argument on the matter.

Typical.

Just for the people who hadn’t seen freaky weight on these. I actually think Nick Best is one of the few pro strongmen whose biceps and assorted parts are actually healthy in a sport rife with bicep tears (don’t quote me though) so it’s possible that doing them like many other things makes you better at them and likely strengthens what it stresses, not to condone going for 1 RM’s. I’ll say personally they helped me rehab well and force you to sit back to a greater degree which is handy for improving back squat form. They also murder your traps increase your tolerance for pain and put your posterior chain as a whole through the ringer. Wearing light elbow sleeves like APT’s or an old hoodie also reduces the marks they leave if you’re concerned about people thinking you cut yourself and make them far more bearable on the whole. Not saying they replace anything physique wise but they’re good for if you are a powerlifter or strongman or someone who just really wants to deadlift more. The pain gets better as you go, I don’t know if it’s nerves dying such as with a hook grip or what.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, this shit was posted in the GET A LIFE section yet idiots are acting like only powerlifters can respond? Shouldn’t it be in that section if that is the goal? I think this was moved from the bodybuilding section.

That would mean we all get to comment on how ridiculous this movement is in comparison to others.

LOL @ retards.[/quote]

I’m going to bite and say the only reason I’d do this is if I didn’t have a squat rack available.

Otherwise I’m fine squatting regular and dead lifting regular.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]xjusticex2013x wrote:

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:
^^ X2 - what’s the value of the zercher unless you’re doing functional strongman training?

Even for strongman (i’m ignorant on strongman lifts) why do you need to go so heavy? How much weight would be the normal amount for say Stone Lifts?[/quote]

It’s a biceps tear waiting to happen.

I swear, it is like some people do shit just so no one calls them a bodybuilder. If the result of a 400lbs “zercher squat” is to look like the guy in that vid, I’ll really fucking pass.[/quote]

Why are you so jelly? Its obvious those Zerchers are what made the guy in the video so huge. If you really focus and eat right you too can be 6’ 190. [/quote]

So now zerchers make you skinny? lolwut?
[/quote]
?

No, it is that if “400lbs” is the weight that someone like that can do, then 400lbs isn’t that fucking impressive.

Why would I do shit that leads to lesser progress in muscle growth?

It is a movement that serves little purpose unless specifically training for something with movements like that. So, again, why do people do shit that has such little return in terms of progress?

Oh, wait…that’s the function of most “functional” training…give people who don’t look like they lift seriously something to be proud of.
[/quote]

Because everyone doesn’t lift to get bigger - but you already knew that. This isn’t solely a BB site and not every lift is a BB lift. Yet already, you’ve judged the guy in the video as some sort of failure at achieving size. Typical of you.

If 400 isn’t impressive, we await your video of you knocking it off. Should be easy for you. We’ll save you the risk of injury too by only asking for a zercher squat. [/quote]

Gee, I know everyone doesn’t lift to get bigger. I also know I see a lot of people who are NOT into competing in powerlifting who use “functional strength” as the tag for not making much physical progress. Obviously this is not referring to some serious power lifter who has trained for years. But of course, you have never seen this.

400lbs on a zercher squat isn’t impressive to me if this is the result. You see, I also get to speak my own opinion here…and you can keep waiting for a video until you die because I don’t do shit in the gym for your entertainment or anyone else. I do it for results.

This lift looks fucking dangerous to anyone who values their arm development. If you don’t, more power to you. I personally won’t be doing shit in the gym with a risk like that no matter how “bad ass” someone else may think it looks.

Also, This was written in the post you quoted:

No. You’re arguing. But I forgot that anyone who has a retort to any opinion you express, constitutes an “argument” or, sometimes even is an idiot.

OP did not use the alleged “functional strength” argument to forgive and/or excuse any alleged (there was none except from you) lack of development. No one did.

You cannot zercher squat 400+ and have a lack of development, but I digress. Looks to me like he has a solid back and hasn’t been too concerned with doing what I’ll from henceforth call “Situation Curls”.

OP didn’t say it was “bad ass”.

Please explain the mechanism by which the zercher lift will damage the arm or hinder development. They are uncomfortable, but damage? I’ve never seen a zercher squat arm injury although I have seen plenty of bicep tears from deadlifts and I’ve seen plenty of pec tears from bench presses.

No one thought you worked out in your gym for entertainment purposes. Don’t worry.

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, This was written in the post you quoted:

And OP specifically stated:

[quote]xjusticex2013x wrote:
Hypertrophy isn’t the goal for me, powerlifting is. [/quote]

…yet, you, a bodybuilder who doesn’t squat, bench press, OR deadlift are still here arguing.[/quote]

a “bodybuilder” who has never competed, to be fair.

[quote]BEAR BORN wrote:

Just for the people who hadn’t seen freaky weight on these. I actually think Nick Best is one of the few pro strongmen whose biceps and assorted parts are actually healthy in a sport rife with bicep tears (don’t quote me though) so it’s possible that doing them like many other things makes you better at them and likely strengthens what it stresses, not to condone going for 1 RM’s. I’ll say personally they helped me rehab well and force you to sit back to a greater degree which is handy for improving back squat form. They also murder your traps increase your tolerance for pain and put your posterior chain as a whole through the ringer. Wearing light elbow sleeves like APT’s or an old hoodie also reduces the marks they leave if you’re concerned about people thinking you cut yourself and make them far more bearable on the whole. Not saying they replace anything physique wise but they’re good for if you are a powerlifter or strongman or someone who just really wants to deadlift more. The pain gets better as you go, I don’t know if it’s nerves dying such as with a hook grip or what.[/quote]

Good post. I’ve done them in small cycles before, and the pain is really on bad the first 2 or 3 times you do them. Every time I’ve gone back to them since, the pain is nowhere near what it was those first 2 or 3 times.

LMAO

Edit: LMAO @ deezweez

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, This was written in the post you quoted:

And OP specifically stated:

[quote]xjusticex2013x wrote:
Hypertrophy isn’t the goal for me, powerlifting is. [/quote]

…yet, you, a bodybuilder who doesn’t squat, bench press, OR deadlift are still here arguing.[/quote]

My comment wasn’t directly to the Original Poster…so what is your problem?

There are several other movements for lower back development that do not put the biceps tendon in a position to be injured…so why even approach this as if this needs to take first in line over all of those?

Are YOU recommending people start using Zercher lifts for this purpose? Or are you just here arguing with me because I posted?

Tell us, do you think this lift is the best way to get the job done?

Or am I your main focus still?[/quote]

If that’s your slant, then why don’t you illustrate the alternate methods and means to develop lower back and hip power for the squat and deadlift? And, have you ever done a zercher or are you making assumptions about the bicep tendon? It actually causes more forearm discomfort than anything.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, this shit was posted in the GET A LIFE section yet idiots are acting like only powerlifters can respond? Shouldn’t it be in that section if that is the goal? I think this was moved from the bodybuilding section.

That would mean we all get to comment on how ridiculous this movement is in comparison to others.

LOL @ retards.[/quote]

Ahh, I knew it wouldn’t be long before “idiots” and “retards” followed. LOL. If anything, you’re predictable. Didn’t even take a page.

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

I’m saying some people just like to train, and see how much weight they can move. A buddy of mine is like that, he wants to know how much he can do on farmer walks, zerchers, old school weight lifter exercises, whatever.
[/quote]

I know…and most of them fall into the category I talked about before…the type who never make much physical (or even much overall strength) progress but use something arbitrary like “function” to justify the time they spend on this.

To each his own…but I think most would agree that when it comes to getting shit done and actually accomplishing something that translates as significant progress to others (whether that be bodybuilding or powerlifting) those types are NOT the ones to pull it off.[/quote]

Where the fuck is this shit coming from? Where is the discussion about “progress” except from you? You can sneeze at a 400lb zercher when you can bang out a few. OP is a strong kid. Period.

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Also, This was written in the post you quoted:

And OP specifically stated:

[quote]xjusticex2013x wrote:
Hypertrophy isn’t the goal for me, powerlifting is. [/quote]

…yet, you, a bodybuilder who doesn’t squat, bench press, OR deadlift are still here arguing.[/quote]

a “bodybuilder” who has never competed, to be fair. [/quote]

I was going to include that fact, but I figured if I did he’d pull the race card.

lol

I know for a fact that wide stance zerchers from pins have definitely helped my deadlift, from off the floor to lockout. TBH, I would not be doing them if my goal wasn’t powerlifting. But, I do know zerchers have played a large part in increasing my deadlift and they will continue to. If it aint broke, why the fuck fix it?

I’m not sure I follow the logic of how these are any risk to your bicep tendon. That’s analogous to saying you risk a trap tear from back squats.