T Nation

HOT-ROX Overnight?


#1

Okay, this doesn't happen often, but I was thinking the other day... why not take HOT-ROX right before going to bed?

A bunch of reasons spring to mind:

  • Your body is at rest during the night and should be burning a fairly high percentage of fat.

  • Especially under the assumption you've tapered off the carbs in the evening, your body should be ready to release fat stores, since it won't see food for eight or more hours.

  • This is a prime catabolic period and HOT-ROX does a good job of protecting against catabolism.

  • As we all know, HOT-ROX helps keep your metabolism going, which is a good idea in general, for leaning out.

  • This lets you consume Carbolin 19 or Spike during the day without mixing your supplements counter to recommendations.

On the flip side, it's possible that your body won't use much energy overnight and that there wouldn't be much if any increase in fat consumption due to the HOT-ROX.

Questions:

  • Would HOT-ROX boost evening metabolism?

  • Would HOT-ROX help prevent evening catabolism effectively?

  • Would a single dose still provide a general metabolic boost the following day?


#2

I'm interested to hear Cy's take.

The negative that comes to mind is any affect it would have on sleep quality.

If you got by that couldn't it also help prevent muscle catabolism @ night?


#3

Hmm, more thinking.

On the night of a strenous workout, your muscles are going to have raised energy needs -- your metabolism will be raised during the repair and rebuild process.


#4

I don't doubt that taking the HOT-ROX at night would accomplish the benefits that both of you guys have mentioned.

My only problem would be that most people are probably going to suffer from insomnia or at the very least, a disturbance in normal sleep physiology if doing such a thing.

An interesting note however, is that a single dose of the A7-E was shown to significantly increase energy expenditure for 24 hours, and a larger study is being planned last I had heard from Tim. If taking A7-E by itself, at night, now that would be an ok idea as there isn't any reason to suspect that it would cause any problems with sleep.


#5

Interesting... maybe A7-E will come out on it's own at some point then.

Thanks for dropping in Cy!


#6

No problem!


#7

I was gonna echo the same thing. I used to be a very erractic sleeper, until I found out about this site. Once I ditched the caffeine past 5pm and started taking ZMA, I now sleep better that I ever have. Just from getting better quality of sleep, my overall mood and health has improved dramatically. Thus, I wouldn't want to take anything, regardless of how beneficial it is, that would effect sleep quality. IMO, proper rest is probably one of the most important things to overall health in the world.


#8


Vroom:
I like your thinking here.

Regarding the anticatabolic rationale for using HOT-ROX: I believe the mechanism that HOT-ROX preserves lean tissue is via cAMP. This is attributable to the Sclaremax predominantly (if I understand all the info I've read on this site regarding HOT-ROX).

Now, isn't Carbolin 19 a much more effective cAMP raiser? If it is, and if my understanding is correct, then taking Carbolin 19 at night would be more appropriate for anticatabolic action.

Taking HOT-ROX in the morning (as I do...I absolutely love the stuff)elevates my mood and increases my thinking speed. For me, it is amazingly better than Spike even. I could not take it at night though, because of the way it "wakes" me up.


#9

Although against recommendation,

One wonders if you could pull:

AM: 2-4 HOT-ROX

Afternoon: 2 Carbolin 19

PM: 2 Carbolin 19


#10

I personally think that would be the way to go. Add in Methoxy-7 to the morning dose of Maximum Strength HOT-ROX and to the evening dose of Carbolin 19 and you have the ultimate lean tissue sparing/increaser and fat burning stack legally possible today I think.

It is alot of pills though isn't it? :slightly_smiling:


#11

Vroom-

Why don't you experiment on yourself, and post your results?


#12

Hey vroom,

If you decide to give this a shot, you might want to start off with 2 HOT-ROX and assess your insomnia tolerance. I've tried HOT-ROX (3-4 caps) at 6PM and have had alot of trouble falling asleep before 1-2AM. Not even ZMA & melatonin helped. As Cy mentioned, the stand-alone A7-E would likely be the optimal solution (because in addition to taking it later in the day, you could also take it with Spike). Tim Patterson hooked me up with some A7-E and it worked really well, but now it's all gone. Hopefully Biotest will introduce it as its own product.

MicroSlash - "Rockin' in the free world, since 1981...."


#13

Interesting thread. I'm one of those that doesn't seem to have much of a problem sleeping on HOT-ROX - I guess the caffeine doesn't hit me as hard as some - many years of drinking the real stuff and mighty strong!

Anyway my curiosity regarding this is more to do with cAMP and insulin. As a lipolytic agent, HOT-ROX is likely to be counteracted by the lipogenic (sp?) actions of insulin, or am I getting this wrong here?

If that is the case, would not it be almost almost ideal to be taking it (or A7-E) at night when food consumption, and insulin response from food is at a minimum? (I am aware that insulin is still released overnight as a counter-regulatory hormonal response to GH and cortisol).

In that respect if one were to use Carbolin 19 also, as my understanding of its primary effect is anabolic, this would be partially mediated by insulin, thus is obviously preferential during the day? An indeed in the mornings when carb intake (thus insulin secrection) would be higher?

In that respect vroom's original idea would -seem- to make most sense here.

Just some conjecture - I might be talking bull of course. If you're reading this Cy, care to comment?


#14

A7-E standalone...BRING IT! It's a no-brainer wrt its generic compatibility with other supps. BRING IT! The whole contraindication thing with Spike, HOT-ROX and Carbolin 19 is really a hassle.

BUILD IT AND THEY WILL COME!


#15

I'm going to try the HOT-ROX first thing in the morning, then a dose of Carbolin 19 later in the day, followed by another around bed time.

Worth a shot. But remember that Cy does not recommend mixing these, so you (and I) are on your own if you do so.


#16

I think you're all turning into the old version of me; overly-concerned.

Supplements are secondary; they're ancillaries to everything else. Instead of worrying about this stuff...well don't. Make the best of what you have and do the best you can. If you want to go ahead and make a case study out of it we'd all love to hear your results but nothing can replace the three main staples:

1) Dedication

2) Good program fed by knowledge

3) Good nutrition created by learning


#17

I'd love to try this. It will have to wait for the off-season though.

Let me know if you decide to go with this. I'll definitely be trying it.


#18

I think you're preaching to the choir.


#19

I've found I develop somewhat of a "tollerance" to the side-ffects of HOT-ROX. I imagine in the later stages of using HOT-ROX, one could take a dose later in the day/before bed with less risk of sleep disruption. Throw in a few mg's of melatonin, or a heavy dose of 5HTP and I bet you're good to go.


#20

At night, I take (2) HOT-ROX, (3) Alpha Male and (1) 50mg DHEA. Never bothers my sleep.