Hormones Out of Whack Just from Dieting?

Pharma / TRT Testosterone Replacement
21

[quote]KSman wrote:
LH levels jump around. Yes, LH is low. FSH levels are relatively steady and are a better diagnostic. Your low FSH tells the story. You might be an candidate for hCG mono therapy. If T levels do not correct with hCG you would then have primary + secondary hypogonadism.

TSH is too high, fT4 seems is a bit below mid line. Would be better near 1.3, sort of fits with your lower fT3.

I do not see your iodine intake discussed here or waking body temp.

I can’t recall your insurance/budget situation. There is still the out-of-pocket option with a doc that I know.

Food allergy testing: There are implications if some tests are false positives. I would be wanting to have a confirmation before I eliminate a food that I like from my diet for the rest of my life. You have a sensitivity to beef but not milk from cows?[/quote]

I am not counting out the “out of pocket” option. I just want to use that as my last resort. As you know, ongoing labs and visits aren’t cheap. And I would rather get the use out of my insurance if I can.

Yeah, the current Doc is no help in the thyroid area. He seems to be “a by the book” type of guy as far as normal means normal. I have an appt with the endo friday, so we will see what he thinks. Hopefully he will order some type of cortisol test, anything would be better than nothing.

My multi-vit has 150 mcg of Iodine. And i use iodized salt on all my food. Definitely no shortage there. I did add an extra 150mcg/day. And just stopped that last night actually.

Here is my weekly average temp updated.

96.3
96.4
96.5
96.5
96.6
96.6
96.6
97.1
96.8
96.8
96.7
96.7

About the food allergy test. I totally agree. But it was easy enough to cut out the foods for now. Another couple weeks and I will add a food back in and see how I react.

Thanks for the insight,
Beau

22

Tell doc that you want to do a trail dose of thyroid meds to see if it resolves any of your symptoms. This cannot do any harm. Ask that your symptoms be addressed. Low body temps are an indication of hypothyroidism. You can tell him that you have a goal of 97.8 for waking body temp and mid-line for fT4, fT3. [When that is done, TSH should be lower too.] Try T3 meds. If you get mid-line fT3 and body temp remains low, test rT3.

Point out that normal lab ranges include those with undiagnosed thyroid problems. Normal is a statistical range and does not imply that ones health is normal. The fact that thyroid and TSH “normal ranges” are so broad indicates that the tested base population has thyroid problems.

Review my earlier comments.

But you are on another doctor quest it seems.

23

[quote]KSman wrote:
Tell doc that you want to do a trail dose of thyroid meds to see if it resolves any of your symptoms. This cannot do any harm. Ask that your symptoms be addressed. Low body temps are an indication of hypothyroidism. You can tell him that you have a goal of 97.8 for waking body temp and mid-line for fT4, fT3. [When that is done, TSH should be lower too.] Try T3 meds. If you get mid-line fT3 and body temp remains low, test rT3.

Point out that normal lab ranges include those with undiagnosed thyroid problems. Normal is a statistical range and does not imply that ones health is normal. The fact that thyroid and TSH “normal ranges” are so broad indicates that the tested base population has thyroid problems.

Review my earlier comments.

But you are on another doctor quest it seems.[/quote]

Good point. I need to get over my fear of telling him how to do his job.

Yes, Doctor quest, and the holy grail will be a doc that treats symptoms and signs rather than numbers.

24

well… made it a little further. Finally got prescribed with Testim.

Then I went and paid for it. WOW… 99/month after insurance. I will only use this until i can get a doc to prescribe T-cyp that is for sure.

Definitely going to switch to androgel until i can get T-cyp. I think with the discount card i can get it to 67/month.

Going back to him in 2 months with follow up Total Test/Free Test labs.

Hes against any other treatments for me as far as thyroid and adrenals go. I am curious to see the response from just the gel. So I am fine for now starting only with one medication at a time.

25

Keep in mind that once on the T replacement you close some doors as far as finding the underlying problem since t replacement is considered a lifetime treatment.

26

Ok very Interesting.

I’m in the same boat man, Battling.

Shit, this sucks. Head up.

27

Interesting thread, as a long term dieter myself. Any relevance to axillary temperature? I tested mine over a 7 day period and was ultra low, compared with norms of axillary temps. The only symptoms that I would identify is the inability to lose body fat with the amount of training I do. Thanks, MD.

28

[quote]Mdougherty40 wrote:
Interesting thread, as a long term dieter myself. Any relevance to axillary temperature? I tested mine over a 7 day period and was ultra low, compared with norms of axillary temps. The only symptoms that I would identify is the inability to lose body fat with the amount of training I do. Thanks, MD. [/quote]

As per what KSman mentions in this thread and others. Normal waking temp is 97.8. Anything consistently below that and you should start looking at possible thyroid hormone deficiencies. Then the hard part will be finding a doc to work with you. Because even with a low temp all my numbers are considered “normal”.

29

Thanks for the reply but what about axillary temp (under the armpit)? Their values are slightly lower with norms at 96.6° and 98° F. I’m just curious if those are valid, however, I probably should do oral as well!

Thanks, MD

30

I have had pretty much the same exact problem as you with all the same events lol. Our cases are practically identical- I to used shelby and was doing Keto for about 6 months ( got up to 1 hr and 40 mins of cardio a day and used clen pretty much the whole time) the result were sub par so he reccomended a BT to test for low thyroid thats when the low test and thy were discovered- test 87 ng/dl- I have been hopping around to docs for a month now-endocrinologist, urologist,- lastly I had an MRI to check and see if I might have a possible pit tumor (as i am almost certain it is a pit prob and the endo concurs) but that was a negative so as for finding the tru cause I do nor the endo know- from all that Ive researched I believe my prob stems from an under active pituitary ( you might all in this categorey) causing hypo thy, low test and possible adrenal fatigue-

I recently spoke to my endo to go over MRI–he is at a loss of what truly is the cause so he suggest I take 3 weeks and cut out all supps and test again. I hate this but i think if i go along he could write the scrips and ins would cover-
]
so now I am faced with going around to docs seeing who will write what-- I did speak to a very informed MD at an anti aging clinic- From every thing he saw he reccomend using a dessicated thyroid for the low thy and HCG to restim the testicles to produce their own test again since the pit might be broken but the testes still work. I like this approach because it agrees with all my research. He did not feel comfotable giving me TRT at such a young age (22).

Just thought i should share my case, It helps knowing im not the only one in this pain in the ass boat

31

my post is here if you want a reference
http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/sports_training_performance_bodybuilding_trt/help_low_free_t3_and_low_test_what_to_do?id=4185739&pageNo=1

32

Just a quick update… made it back to the Doc that prescribed the Testim…

He only checked Free Test on the re-visit. about 12 hrs after application of testim. I was a little agitated when i left so I didn’t even grab the blood work. but if i remember right it was…

2.55 pg/nl range something like [.9 - 4.5]

I have been improving over the last 2 months for sure. Energy is back for the most part. Zest for life is still lower than i would like. Probably a 30-50% improvement on most of my symptoms. Morning body temps are still hovering in the upper 96’s to low 97’s some days. I have put on 20 pounds. up to 220 now. Haven’t done much cardio for 2 months. Just lifting 3 times/week. blood pressure and resting hr were still good. Lifting must keep my cardiovascular system in check. 110/60 and a hr of 58.

Sex drive and wanting to pursue females has improved but not where it needs to be for me to actually want a relationship or go out and date.

So for now I think the goal is to get off the gel and onto injections. My current doc is only willing to do in office injects every 2 weeks. So that is not going to work. The problem with the Testim is price, and now I am getting a rash on my upper arms. And my current doc doesnt want to help with my T-3 problem. And with the TRT side he doesn’t do hCG or AI.

33

Update time… Different Doctor.

I think this is a good start. I think he is shooting on the higher side of T-levels because of how shutdown my natural levels were. I also got a few more tests run Wed am. Igf/cortisol/and the usual suspects. I know this isn’t ideal as per what is recommended here, but it is a very good start. At least compared to where i was at with my last doc.

I will continue with doing exactly what he says and see how i feel. hCG isn’t cheap so hopefully i can bump down to the 250/EOD. And I know he definitely prescribes AI, just surprised with that high of an injection schedule we didn’t start out with any. I’m sure i will be feeling that sooner than later. If my nipples start getting sensitive i will definitely be calling to get a script for an AI. We are also holding off on treating my Thyroid with meds until we see if the T improves it. He said 50/50 chance of it doing anything to improve T-3 issues.

200mg/mL test cyp. 1 - 1mL IM Injection per week. First one was Wed AM.
1250 IU hCG twice/week. Got the hCG this morning so went ahead and had my first one today.

I’m getting an MRI of the pituitary next wed. And then i meet again with him at the end of the month.

Other than being sick this whole week i am hopeful that things will start looking up. At least i am done with that Gel Shit… My skin is already starting to recover. I would rather do daily injections than use that gel.

34

How are you feeling?

35

[quote]Substance P wrote:
How are you feeling? [/quote]

Not sure if you mean now, with this new protocol or overall? You can check my post above from 12-23. I had seen some improvements from the testim alone.

But on the new protocol - I have been sick since before my first injection and its still with me today. So not good… We’ll see how it pans out. However, 3 days after my first shot of hCG and my testes are hanging low again. Hopefully size will come back in another couple weeks. I predict that I lost about 30% in volume over the 9 weeks on testim.

5 days and my Testim skin irritation is 90% gone.