HOOAH!!!

One more thing. We are still trying to find Bin Laden. But it may never happen. So what we have to do is catch his subordinates like that Ron Jeremy looking guy, and remove people like Saddam from Power. It is part of the same situation. I don’t care if Saddam has direct ties to Al Queda or not. The fact is he would gladly contribute his money to any plans to terrorize our country. G.B. clearly said in one of his speeches last year that the war on terror would take on many forms and would probably last indefinitely. My definition of victory in this war is the ongoing absence of terrorist strikes since 9/11. But to keep another attack from happening we are going to have to keep on doing this kind of thing. It’s not WWII, it’s not Viet Nam. It’s a different kind of war.

“Let me ask all of you T-Men a question. If your neighbor was beating his kids or his wife, would you intervene? Or would you respect his autonomy to run his house as he sees fit?”
Helping the Iraqi people is just a nice side-benefit. It’s certainly not the US main goal. We’re more worries about the possibility that the neighbor will get bored with beating his own family and look to beat on his neighbors.

If you’re the US, you first determine whether you’re neighbor can effectively defend himself. If he can’t, go ahead and play hero. But if he can defend himself, you lay off.

North Korea is guilty of human rights abuses on an even greater scale than Saddam, but we let them alone.

In North Korea’s case, we let the neighbor beat his family, but to prevent him from beating our family, we put all our efforts into making sure the strong neighbor doesn’t have access to steroids (nukes).

While I believe the Iraqi will welcome liberation and democracy, people in the United States underestimate the magnitude of this challenge.

Just wanted to put something out there -
here’s an excerpt from a letter written by a leading Iraqi dissident and published in the National Review:

"My comments originate in an objective dilemma that we are certainly going to have to face tomorrow: the contrast between those of us who have been privileged to live outside in the West and those Iraqis who never have, and with whom we want to build a democratic society tomorrow inside Iraq.

I begin with an anecdote that happened to me the day before yesterday. A gentleman who had read a somewhat inaccurate translation of my Observer article on the web called late in the night and spoke to a colleague sleeping in the same compound with me to say that he was “going to wipe me off the face the earth.” He was livid and deadly serious; it was a physical threat coming from a deeply disturbed man. Apparently he had read the article, the main idea of which he agreed with, as a personal attack on him because of one of its sentences. He was sure that in one tiny little phrase of that particular sentence I was “intending” him, even though I did not know anything about this man at the time that I was writing the article. The whole thing blew over the next day and he came up to apologize after a colleague patiently explained to him how he was mistaken in his interpretation.

The details of the incident are not important. It is important however to know that this is a person who has suffered as much as any human being can possibly suffer at the hands of the Baath Party–relatives murdered, his body the target of terrible, terrible atrocities, etc, etc. Try to imagine the worst and still you will not come close to the physical pain this man has suffered in his life. At one point he weighed 30 kilos. And remember while you are trying to imagine what this person went through, that this is the human raw material that you want to build democracy for."

The rest can be found at nationalreview.com under Kanan Makiya’s War Diary

vredstein - I agree that helping the Iraqi people is a side benefit to the US government. So what. It’s still a worthwhile cause. I agree with you about N. Korea. But the fact of the matter is they are too strong for us to take on alone without serious repercussions to ourselves and/or the South Koreans. We can’t help everybody, but that does not mean we shouldn’t help when we can.

I’ve never understood why the U.S. feels obligated to help other countries. We don’t have to help anyone, unless of course it’s something that goes through the U.N. (like the Iraq attack). But even then, if you don’t agree, you don’t have to take part in it.

As a nation, we shouldn’t feel obligated to help others except ourselves. We have so many problems in our own country that we should focus more on our “home” rather than all the other countries and how its people are being treated/mistreated.

Sure, the U.S. is a good neighbor and wants to do the right thing, but we have far greater needs within our own nation that we shouldn’t forget about them.

I love America. I love it. I love us. We are participating in a forum where our opinion is uncensored, we’re allowed to protest everything from eating meat to Wars in foreign lands, and everybody gets upset with each other but no one gets maimed or killed because of it. Diesel, bro you may want to throttle back on the moto if you want to be in other people’s good graces, but fuck it, if you want to be all hardcore and obtuse, then go right ahead. It’s your right as an American. Just be ready for some criticism.

As this conflict accelerates, I feel we need to let the people in charge take care of the big issues. They know what they are doing, they’re focused on making this thing last only as long as it needs to. Protestors are really just being counterproductive.

I like Freedom, I’d like other people to enjoy it too.

Support our bretheren who are fighting over there. They’re making a difference on a global scale fellas.

Brad

BradTGIF,

Like I said before:

And know, I didn’t forget about the women involved too! Same goes for them as above.

Diesel, it’s a shame you weren’t there on 9/11, a lot of decent people probably died in there and what happened was a tragedy, but if only borderline retards like were there, I would celebrate it for the rest of my life. You disgust me. Really, you make me sick. Couldn’t help this. Sorry.

Restless –

Did you really just say you wished Diesel had been a victim of 9/11?

You disgust me.

Yep.

I can’t tolerate that someone is having a ball watching a fucking war were people will get killed. The world would be a better place without such people.

We haven’t stopped hunting Bin Laden and his crew. To believe that we cannot carry out these two things simultaneously is ridiculous. This isn’t shifting the focus of anything. Bad argument.

“As a nation, we shouldn’t feel obligated to help others except ourselves. We have so many problems in our own country that we should focus more on our “home” rather than all the other countries and how its people are being treated/mistreated.”

Two things. No, we don’t have to help out others. You also don’t have to help out that old lady who can’t carry her groceries, but I’m sure you do. You don’t have to help out anybody in this world other than yourself, but I’m sure you do. The isolationist stance (ala Patrick Buchanan) has no place in the modern world. We tried it in WWII, and it failed horribly. To isolate ourselves so fully from the outside world will bring nothing but bad things and ill will from the rest of the world upon us.

Also, our “problems” at home pale in comparison to those of people in countries such as Iraq. You aren’t getting exactly one gram of protein per pound of bodyweight? Try living in a country where you can be tortured and killed for speaking your mind. Our problems are minor. Yes, we need to address domestic issues. No, we don’t need to turn a blind eye to real problems in this world.

And, Restless, I find your attitude as deplorable as that of the one you’re criticizing.

 Geewiz Restless, maybe one day, when you're god, you can make sure Ill be at the dead center of the biggest atrocity ever.

 First, however, you might want to grow a teeny weeny lil brain.

 I am excited because we're finally gonna overthrow Saddam - FINALLY.

 When we left Kuwait, the kurds in Iraq tried to revolt. Saddam obliterated their armies, and laid the ones that were still alive on the ground. He then proceeded to build a new road, which was paved with asphalt over the (still alive) men. Yep, no reason to be excited about his toppling there.

 The Iraqis were happy when they saw our marines and army. They want to be liberated. No reason to be excited there.

 Saddam poses a very real threat to the U.S., no reason to be excited there either.

 If you read my post once more, and actually use your brain this time around, I dare you to find where did I specifically and directly say I a excited about seeing people dying and blood being shed on TV. Huh? What is that, can't find it? That's too bad, cuz neither can I.

 As for your 9/11 comment, worry not. I'm sure my time with the marines will give plenty of opportunities of the kind. Specifically with the growing threat with North Korea. And you know who drives the front lines.

 See, that's what separates the two of us. You speak a lot, always making sure you keep a safe distance between the threat and you and your fraternity friends.
 I am putting my money where my mouth is. I believe Freedom is not free, and I would rather fight along side my friends in the marines, then stay at home watching TV. 
 That said, you should respect the fact some people are very  motivated to do what most are unwilling to do. If not, you can bet your ass we'd be playing with a little thing called 'draft'. Anyone 18-26 yrs old would be eligible, and if your name came up, out you go.

In all reality guys it seems like at least from the news they are only targeting Saddam’s palaces and regime… It looks like all the infro structure in IRAQ is still intact. So leads me to believe that the only focus is take out hussian and his regime… Restless, your comments to diseal contradicting if u think about it… At least “Say” won’t say something like that I don’t think.

To all the doubters:

Whadja think of all the dancing in the streets in Iraq today, especially when a U.S. soldier tore down a large poster of the devil himself?

Hmmm?

I was in the Marines from 84-92. I got out after the first war over there. Let me tell you war is no fun. I have gone to group for PTSD since them. And while things started to build up leading to this war I have had Panic disorders along with agoraphobia just because of what happened before. Imagine your good friends getting killed right in front of you. Seeing burnt bodies. Having chemical alarms going off and having blisters on your arms but told it was a false alarm. Dealing with the health problems now due to burning oil wells, experimental shots, nerve agent pills, the list goes on. Having the DOD send you a letter stating that your unit was near a bunker that had serain nerve agent in it while it was blown up and you may of had low dosages of it. And in the mean time you cant get medical help cause they say its all in your head the DOD sends another letter saying the the CIA says that the wind was blowing the wrong direction at that time so you weren’t exposed. The CIA can tell which way the wind was blowning 12 years ago but can 't find someone. My only hope is that these batch of service personel get treated better than us and the ones before us. This country has a habit of putting us out like trash after we give our lives to our country. But they’ll be damn sure to take care of the welfare people better than a vet that is ill or a vet that lost a limb. Thus far I have had 5 individuals that have died in my unit due to the same illness. A link? Maybe or maybe not. It all boils down to this. I think its a great thing to serve my country but I expected my country to serve me as well. May God be will those troops over there and God Speed on our victory. Just remember a war is a horrible thing but sometimes its needed. Semper Fi

Fortunatelly, not americans are Diesels.

http://www.chronogram.com/backIssues/2002/1202/roomforaview/

I meant not all americans are diesels.