T Nation



  SEMPER FI - DO OR DIE!!!! Fuck the other guy!!!


  Anybody else excited about this war? I can't wait till tomorrow morning and check the news. I am certain we're going to take care of this war in a snap. However, there's always a possibility something will go horribly wrong - I hope it doesnt. I heard the war will be televised DIRECT, without censorship from the military.
   The top military guys said they will leave it up to the media to decide what to censor or not - and said they wil probably catch a blunder such as the shooting of civilians, but that if it happens, the public has a right to know, and its their call on wether they air it or not.
   I hope I'm not sounding out of line here, but this is the ultimate footbal game, anybody else agree?

   Please note, in no way am I glorifying the killing of inocent people, or even war itself - if can be avoided so much the better. But it's damn exciting to see whats going to happen - well, if you're on our side of the border anyway.

I think the US should ship your stupid ass over there, and then you can post about how excited you are.

 Hold your breath for a few more weeks before I join the Marines soldier!

 Then, feel free to wish my ass in the front line. 

 Much more appropriate then dont you think?

I think you enthusiasm is a bit inappropriate. The Super Bowl is the “ultimate” football game. This is a war, not a video game. People will die. Try to control yourself.

And I guarantee you that you will not be seeing uncensored battlefield images on your TV.

Are you for real?


Even if you agree with the US position how the fuck can you glorify a war

Grow up little boy this isn’t a game.

You are what is wrong with America.

Hell yeah! I can’t wait to see my tax money go to blow up the entire country.
Now I can see next year’s tax money go towards trying to building someone else’s country back up again. It’s cycles like these that bring much needed continuity to my life.

This will also stimulate my creative side. I’ll have to figure out new ways to pay for my health insurance.

It also will be a big boost for my ego. Now that the tax money is going towards the military instead of schools, it’s a sure bet that I’ll be better educated than any of these punk kids currently in school.

Sending thousands of reserve troops will also teach our kids about fire safety. Wilh all the firemen who serve as National Guardsmen out of the country, dodging sniper fire, we’ll get a chance to learn how to put out our own city fires.

I can also feel better about never being able to take a vacation. Now, I can use the excuse that it’s too damn dangerous for an American to travel outside the good 'ol USA!

Keep thinking positive kids!

Dude, dude, dude!
I know you motivated…I was once in your shoes. I join the Marine in 89 out of high school. I served during Desert Storm, but was in South America at the time for a float. Once your in a position that you might be in, your attitude will be different. It’s not about glory, or whose right or wrong. It’s about doing something that has to be done. Are you prepared mentally to see some of the things you might see? I don’t think any of us are…that’s why it’s called war!

I wish you well and all of my fellow service brothers…Good Luck, God Bless American and most of all…
CPL Dominic

  1. As I kindly pointed out, I am not glorifying war. 

  2. I never said this is a game.

  I think I will need to clarify my position here:

  This is a war. People WILL die. I dont want our soldiers to die, I want them to go in and do a good job. HENCE the rooting for our americans - which I dared to compare to the rooting for your favorite team because you dont want them to lose.

  YES, I am rooting for our troops, much more so than I would root for my favorite team. This does not imply in any manner whatsoever, that this is : a game;comparable to a game; glorifying; a movie; anything related to any of these things.

  It simply means, as the hardcore american I am, who believes freedom is not free, I am rooting for our troops to do their job fast and effectively, and come back home soon. As such I am glued to the TV and news - which, again, I compared to being glued to the tv when rooting for your team.

 Why is this 'the ultimate football game'? Because now people will die. We have to play all our cards as best as we can to spare as many lives as possible. Understand? Good.

 For the Marine above, I do understand the kind of commitment you take when you join, and I do know once you're on the field things change drastically. Its never about glory - as you said, its about getting what needs to get done when it needs to get done. You will see many things most people are lucky to never see. As such you need to be mentally strong - very strong. 
  That shouldnt take away your motivation however. And it certainly should not justify us at hme stop rooting for our troops overseas!

History repeats itself. Will this be Persian Gulf War II with the same results?

Diesel. I can see why you are excited. War is exhilirating if you don’t get killed or wounded. However after being in one I can state I have no desire to be in one again. War has a time and a place however it is best fought by the new and uninitiated. the combat veteran has a different perspective. You soon realize flesh and bone is no match for steel and explosives and that survival is more a matter of luck then skill.

There have been some very intelligent thing said on this thread…yeah right. Saddam is evil. This had to be done. Bottom Line. Its not good for us. Its good for the Iraqis who no longer have to live in fear of their tougues being cut out and nailed to the wall or being thrown head first into a plastic shredder.

Devil’s Advocate

Who says the Iraqi’s want Democracy?

diesel, really now? I know you probably didn’t mean to sound like you did in your opening post, but you wrote what you wrote nonetheless and now you have to face the criticism.

Anyway, best of luck as you embark on your Marine career. Serve us proud.

Nate - check out sportscenter tonight and listen to some former Iraqi Olympic athletes. Let’s see; There was the guy who played soccer and had his feet caned and then was dragged on his back until it was bloody. There’s the marathon runners who were forced to run on nails. There’s the boxers who were almost drowned. There’s the weightlifters who were not allowed to use the bathroom so they had to defecate in their pants. There’s the other athletes who were urinated on by Saddams son, Udaye, who’s the sports director or something like that. There’s the former volleyball coach who was chained up for 1 month with his arms extended behind his back. Then there’s another guy who was whipped with electric cords. They live other places now, but they probably wouldn’t mind a change of government since the current one will probably seek retribution against their family members because they spoke out.

Nate, surely you can’t be serious.

Yes, I’m sure they’d much rather be under total control of their government, unable to speak their minds and do as they please on a daily basis, often fearing for their lives for no reason at all.

You’ve never talked to an Iraqi defector, have you?

Nate, did you notice how many of the countries in the Coalition of the Willing are countries that were formerly led by dictators? I’d like to see you live in constant fear of your life. And don’t give me that “they’ve been under a dictatorship all their lives, its the only thing they know” argument because it doesn’t work that way. Its human nature to want freedom. When you were growing up, what did you constantly want from your parents? Freedom. Its a basic human desire.

In case some of you missed it, the heading of Nates post was “Devils Advocate”.

It seems by the tone of some of the replies that some people are assuming Nates opinion when all he has done is present a statement for debate.

Its true that Democracy would be a much better alternative to the present system( hell, even Communism would be a step up!!!) it doesnt mean that its the best system for the situation.

I would be interested to know how many Iraqis would welcome a true Islamic system of government. In the Qu’ran and the Hadith there are guidelines and principles by which an Islamic nation should by run. The only problem is that everytime anyone attempts such a system you end up with some despot, maniac, puppet or zealot at the helm.

Like spiderman pointed out. I was playing Devil’s Advocate and just putting out some other potential questions and things to think about. Hey, I believe in freedom. That’s why I live in the United States of America. That’s one of the whole underlying reasons people came to the United States…to be free.

I’m just saying that there are some who are brainwashed or know no better, so they may not want democracy or America butting into their ways.

And like I said before, “History repeats itself.” I hope this is not Persian Gulf War II with similar results.

By the way, what ever happened to Osama Bin Laden and the whole deal with us trying to stop him?

After months of no success, it seems as though Bush and his administration had to change their focus.

I’m not going to get into a political debate about the reasons for or against going to war. There is way too much misinformation on the topic to begin with. But there are some things to think about or wonder why they happened the way they did (i.e. Bin Laden no longer being sought, but now focusing on Sadamm and Iraq).

Whether anyone agrees or disagrees with what is happening, the bottom line is that the decision has been made and we must support all our boys (fathers, sons, brothers,grandchildren, etc.) that are over there fighting the fight. If it wasn’t them, it could be you or someone you know. GO U.S!

Like I’ve said before, I’m not completely opposed to war, but sometimes, you just have to think about other questions or reasons why.

Spiderman and Nate - I did see the “devils advocate” part of the post. Nate was taking a stance, and I answered as if those were his true feelings, although I know that that may not be the case. When you play devils advocate you open yourself up to those kind of responses. It’s Nothing personal. Just a debate.

Back to the point though. There have been times that the United States has been critisized for not intervening in situations where human rights were so clearly being violated. So what are we supposed to do? Let me ask all of you T-Men a question. If your neighbor was beating his kids or his wife, would you intervene? Or would you respect his autonomy to run his house as he sees fit? I can see the flames coming back now for making this kind of comparison, but that’s OK.