http://creation.com/comparative-study-of-gilgamesh-and-genesis-introduction Just a tidbit
We have a small Christ centered film making crew in our Church led by a young man named Timashion. Redirecting... They are REALLY good. http://framedbygracefilms.com/films/a-love-that-hurts/ They have lent their God given and glorifying talents to do a wedding film for a brother and sister in the Lord from a different church. This is the “trailer”. WOW!! Rafael + Grace // Framed By Grace // Wedding Film & Highlights - YouTube
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?
I have found that those who are the biggest Bible thumpers are the ones with the biggest skeletons in the closet.
[quote]MaximusB wrote:
I have found that those who are the biggest Bible thumpers are the ones with the biggest skeletons in the closet.
[/quote]
I will tell you my skeletons are not in the closet. They are out and I am open to all questions about them. The difference is most Bible Thumpers understand they are forgiven for their sins. I will say some Christians will use the Bible to Thump people about their sins, instead of just loving that individual and allowing the Holy Spirit to convict an individual of their sins which is Biblical. When it is Christian on Christian then you can use the Bible to correct a Christian about their sins.
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]
So, no one has an answer or opinion?
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]
So, no one has an answer or opinion? [/quote]
Many people believe that Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven at the moment. Forgiveness and all that. If that dude gets a pass then the morbid obesity of the Bible belt doesn’t seem like it’s going to pose much of a problem.
[quote]smh23 wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]
So, no one has an answer or opinion? [/quote]
Many people believe that Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven at the moment. Forgiveness and all that. If that dude gets a pass then the morbid obesity of the Bible belt doesn’t seem like it’s going to pose much of a problem.[/quote]
I am not Roman Catholic so I do not want to speak for them. I am Evangelical so there are no gluttony issues, but I feel bad every time I eat way too much. 
smh when you are dealing with grace that is the case. I believe if Jeffrey Dahmer is saved then yes he is forgiven and yes he will be in heaven. I have heard it said that all sins no matter how bad are still a sin in the eyes of God. Sin is what separates us from God. No sin is too great for the Grace of God to forgive, except denying him. That is why I love him so much.
If god was so smart he wouldnt have had to sacrafice his son, i mean he is the all knowing right? he should have known some shit like that would go down and figured out a better way around it if he was such a great problem solver. religion is for those who cant govern themselves and are afraid to just die and thats it. some very smart philosiphers figured out that if people did not fear something that shit would be nuts so they came up with some religions. also it was a way for primitive man to explain shit they couldnt explain ie clouds earthquakes tornados farts etc. religion is comfort food.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]smh23 wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]
So, no one has an answer or opinion? [/quote]
Many people believe that Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven at the moment. Forgiveness and all that. If that dude gets a pass then the morbid obesity of the Bible belt doesn’t seem like it’s going to pose much of a problem.[/quote]
I am not Roman Catholic so I do not want to speak for them. I am Evangelical so there are no gluttony issues, but I feel bad every time I eat way too much.
smh when you are dealing with grace that is the case. I believe if Jeffrey Dahmer is saved then yes he is forgiven and yes he will be in heaven. I have heard it said that all sins no matter how bad are still a sin in the eyes of God. Sin is what separates us from God. No sin is too great for the Grace of God to forgive, except denying him. That is why I love him so much.[/quote]
I understand, and I respect the fact that there are many people willing to take their faith’s dogmas to their logical conclusions.
That said, I’m ecstatic not to believe in such a God.
[quote]smh23 wrote:
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]smh23 wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]
So, no one has an answer or opinion? [/quote]
Many people believe that Jeffrey Dahmer is in heaven at the moment. Forgiveness and all that. If that dude gets a pass then the morbid obesity of the Bible belt doesn’t seem like it’s going to pose much of a problem.[/quote]
I am not Roman Catholic so I do not want to speak for them. I am Evangelical so there are no gluttony issues, but I feel bad every time I eat way too much.
smh when you are dealing with grace that is the case. I believe if Jeffrey Dahmer is saved then yes he is forgiven and yes he will be in heaven. I have heard it said that all sins no matter how bad are still a sin in the eyes of God. Sin is what separates us from God. No sin is too great for the Grace of God to forgive, except denying him. That is why I love him so much.[/quote]
I understand, and I respect the fact that there are many people willing to take their faith’s dogmas to their logical conclusions.
That said, I’m ecstatic not to believe in such a God.[/quote]
You might be ecstatic, but God is sad that you think that way.
[quote]roadwarrior83 wrote:
If god was so smart he wouldnt have had to sacrafice his son, i mean he is the all knowing right? he should have known some shit like that would go down and figured out a better way around it if he was such a great problem solver. religion is for those who cant govern themselves and are afraid to just die and thats it. some very smart philosiphers figured out that if people did not fear something that shit would be nuts so they came up with some religions. also it was a way for primitive man to explain shit they couldnt explain ie clouds earthquakes tornados farts etc. religion is comfort food.[/quote]
That is your opinion.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
You might be ecstatic, but God is sad that you think that way.
[/quote]
If that could be proven to me, maybe I’d reconsider. But since it can’t, I won’t.
Anyway, I find it unlikely that I’m capable of making the architect of the cosmos sad.
And a last point: if it were indeed true, as has sometimes been argued, that Dahmer is with God in heaven while all of the billions of good non-Christian people who’ve died without ever having killed, raped, or eaten another human being are not, then heaven is the last place I’ll ever go willingly. For all of the conventional wisdom about bleeding heart liberals and their pansy sentimentality, I’m not big on forgiveness of any kind when we’re talking the rape and murder of teenage boys.
[quote]smh23 wrote:
good non-Christian people [/quote]
Not discounting the rest of your post, but this stuck out to me. Who determines what good means?
I heard an analogy once used. God’s goodness is the empire state building (I would say it is an infinitely high building, but that was the analogy), and the goodness of man is about as high off the ground as the height of an atom. So if God is Good what does that make man?
I understand what you are saying, because I don’t like rapists, murderers, child molesters, and other harden criminals and I would be just fine with them all dead. Especially the child molesters I would rip their arms off with my bare hands if given the chance. All I am saying is that Man does not determine who gets to be with God and who doesn’t. Only a Just God is able to do that. And if God sees all sin the same then we humans are not Good. We are evil, and God paid the debt for all of us evil humans so that he could be with us again.
I would challenge you to just talk to God. I am not going to tell you to read the Bible or any other religious texts. Just talk to God, and see what he says to you.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]smh23 wrote:
good non-Christian people [/quote]
Not discounting the rest of your post, but this stuck out to me. Who determines what good means?
I heard an analogy once used. God’s goodness is the empire state building (I would say it is an infinitely high building, but that was the analogy), and the goodness of man is about as high off the ground as the height of an atom. So if God is Good what does that make man?
I understand what you are saying, because I don’t like rapists, murderers, child molesters, and other harden criminals and I would be just fine with them all dead. Especially the child molesters I would rip their arms off with my bare hands if given the chance. All I am saying is that Man does not determine who gets to be with God and who doesn’t. Only a Just God is able to do that. And if God sees all sin the same then we humans are not Good. We are evil, and God paid the debt for all of us evil humans so that he could be with us again.
I would challenge you to just talk to God. I am not going to tell you to read the Bible or any other religious texts. Just talk to God, and see what he says to you.
[/quote]
Indeed, you’ve made a good argument. And I like the empire state/atom analogy.
My point, however, is right there in your post: “Man does not determine who gets to be with God and who doesn’t. Only a Just God is able to do that. And if God sees all sin the same then we humans are not Good.” You’re right: I certainly don’t get to decide who gets to be with God and who doesn’t, if God does in fact exist. But if it turns out that Dahmer is with God because of his conversion, and I am not because I will certainly die an unbeliever, then I will be proud for all of eternity not to have won the favor of an entity capable of creating, loving, and embracing Jeffrey Dahmer.
To take your tower analogy a bit further: it would seem that in God’s eyes (again, assuming that this particular interpretation is accurate), Dahmer’s tower is high enough to have cleared the bar for entry into the eternal kingdom, whereas mine is not, despite the fact that I’ve never injected acid into the exposed brain of a living human being in an effort to create a sex zombie. It logically follows that Dahmer’s tower is higher than my own–a position that in my view deserves nothing less than outright contempt.
[quote]dmaddox wrote:
[quote]MaximusB wrote:
I have found that those who are the biggest Bible thumpers are the ones with the biggest skeletons in the closet[/quote]
I will tell you my skeletons are not in the closet. They are out and I am open to all questions about them. The difference is most Bible Thumpers understand they are forgiven for their sins. I will say some Christians will use the Bible to Thump people about their sins, instead of just loving that individual and allowing the Holy Spirit to convict an individual of their sins which is Biblical. When it is Christian on Christian then you can use the Bible to correct a Christian about their sins. [/quote]Very good D. There are those here who do not seem to get this at all. Sinners are sinners. They think, speak, act and think like sinners. That’s what they’re supposed to do. That’s why you NEVER see me here, after all his time. tryin yo get sinners to speak and act right. They are dead in their sin just like I was the first 20 years of my life and was far worse than many of them. What I will not and indeed CANNOT suffer is people taking the name of my beloved master upon their lips while promoting damnable heresy and or flagrant immorality. I still have PM,s. “Why are you beatin up fellow Christians when there’s all these atheistic pagans around here?”
I do not beat up on fellow Christians. I beat up on liars who by calling themselves Christians bring grievous dishonor and reproach upon Jesus Christ, the holy spotless lamb of God. If there be any doubt about whether we should be calling out heretics and whoremongers (I’ve been taken to task on that too), please see my VERY long exposition on the subject of “judging” whch is found on this page: Pat Robinson on Young Earth Bullsh*t - Politics and World Issues - Forums - T Nation at 1:38pm. The public scandals we see, Catholic AND protestant, are a terrible tragedy, but are testimony of the sin of man. Not the Character of the perfect God.
[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:[quote]xXSeraphimXx wrote:
Would gluttony be considered a sin? For Catholics is it a mortal sin? If so, why are so many followers fat? As well as overweight people who hold positions within in the church (priests, etc.) Do they choose to ignore it?[/quote]So, no one has an answer or opinion? [/quote] Sadly this man makes a good point. Gluttony IS sinful and obesity is not a good witness. There are those at my own church. Even in leadership who of course know this and do struggle with that sin. As with any sin, the genuine struggle is what separates the sheep from the goats.
Right now there is a young man at my church who is at WAR with same sex attraction. He knows all the bible butchering arguments people attempt to use to pervert God’s word into supporting homosexuality. Nobody will EVER convince him because He loves the Lord and hates his sin. If there is one sure fire way to tell if somebody’s a Christian THAT is it. His attitude has nothing to do with me OR our church. Some will no doubt think of how sad it is that this guy feels compelled to fight his true self. Talk to him. We didn’t make him this way. HE will tell you. “I am NOT gay. I am a man of God called from the darkness of sin into His marvelous light and I will die before corrupting His word with my filth.” He was like this when we met him last year. HE came to US. He has been given the right hand of fellowship, is a member in good standing AND is permitted at the communion table despite the fact that he has fallen in the time he’s been with us. Myself and a couple of the other men are walking with him. I see Jesus in his eyes. He longs to please his Lord. I will love him and receive him and embrace him while there is breath in my lungs.
However, when we get people telling the world they are followers of Christ while posting masturbation pics of their wife, or proclaiming godless cultic heresies, or announcing that homosexuality and or abortion are not sinful, or that man came from monkeys, (the list goes literally on and on around here) the true disciple of the one true and living God and His Christ CANNOT allow such to go unchallenged. We are COMMANDED to confront and defend where necessary. I’ll probably wind up having to write an exposition on that too one day.
[quote]smh23 wrote:<<< Dahmer’s tower is high enough to have cleared the bar for entry into the eternal kingdom, whereas mine is not, despite the fact that I’ve never injected acid into the exposed brain of a living human being in an effort to create a sex zombie. It logically follows that Dahmer’s tower is higher than my own–a position that in my view deserves nothing less than outright contempt.[/quote] You miss the point. One bite from a piece of fruit in defiance of the command of the infinitely holy and righteous creator God constituted an attack upon His authority and hence His person. A mortal crime the result of which was the damnation of every man descended from Adam.
With regard to one’s acceptance or rejection before God the sins of Jeffery Dahmer are no more damnable than the sins of Mahatma Ghandi. both were idolators. What you do not understand is that Jesus Christ, being fully man AND fully God bridged the chasm between God and man opened by Adam and maintained by every last one of his descendants. Jesus of Nazareth was conceived and born, not a sinful son of Adam, but sinless of the seed of the Father God with a human mother. He lived a life in spotless obedience to the law of God and yet suffered the death of MY sins as if they were His own. Having no sin of His own, death could not defeat Him and in rising that third day, brought me with Him. I will live forever as a member of the body and bride of Christ.
The evil of Jeffery Dahmer is no match for the power of the blood and resurrection of the holy spotless risen Christ, the sacrificial Lamb of God.
Of course I have no way of knowing for certain and I am the CHIEF of skeptics, but I have seen Dahmer’s testimony. He made no excuses even when the doctors tried to make them for him. “I AM EVIL. he told them. No need to try to figure me out any further than that. Nobody abused me, nobody made me do anything, I am not sick. I am a bad man and Jesus has made me new”. (Very abbreviated paraphrased version. There’s far more than that) Amen and praise the glorious name of the Lord. I believe that this man is my brother in Christ and I embrace him as such. MY sin AFTER I knew God and knew better is FAR worse than his. In the family of God, gathered under the blood of Christ all are equally righteous just as without Him, ALL are equally lost. The difference is Jesus. Not who did their best and who messed up “worse” than others.(Though there are levels are both reward and punishment for those in heaven and lake of fire respectively)
What IF that’s true? WHAT IF the one true and living God sent His son to make a way of reconciliation and freely offer it to all who believe Him? What’s he supposed to do? Say, oh well, it was a nice gesture, but these folks don’t seem to like my way so I guess I’ll have to let them do it theirs? Really? No sir. The apostle Paul quite rightly told the Galatians that if people could just do good enough to avoid hell then Christ died for nothing. I know you don’t like that. You’re not supposed to like that. It’s not until after he saves you that you get to not just like it, but see it as the very definition of everything you are and everything you have. At least if you were a true convert. There’s no shortage of counterfeits for whom there’s a not a dime’s wortha difference between them and the world. The bible tells us they’ll be with us in multitudes til the end of the age and waddaya know? There they are. Everywhere.
“Right now there is a young man at my church who is at WAR with same sex attraction. He knows all the bible butchering arguments people attempt to use to pervert God’s word into supporting homosexuality. Nobody will EVER convince him because He loves the Lord and hates his sin. If there is one sure fire way to tell if somebody’s a Christian THAT is it. His attitude has nothing to do with me OR our church. Some will no doubt think of how sad it is that this guy feels compelled to fight his true self. Talk to him. We didn’t make him this way. HE will tell you. “I am NOT gay. I am a man of God called from the darkness of sin into His marvelous light and I will die before corrupting His word with my filth.” He was like this when we met him last year. HE came to US. He has been given the right hand of fellowship, is a member in good standing AND is permitted at the communion table despite the fact that he has fallen in the time he’s been with us. MYSELF AND A COUPLE OF THE OTHER MEN ARE WALKING WITH HIM. I SEE JESUS IN HIS EYES. HE LONGS TO PLEASE HIS LORD. I WILL LOVE HIM AND RECEIVE HIM AND EMBRACE HIM WHILE THERE IS BREATH IN MY LUNGS”
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]smh23 wrote:<<< Dahmer’s tower is high enough to have cleared the bar for entry into the eternal kingdom, whereas mine is not, despite the fact that I’ve never injected acid into the exposed brain of a living human being in an effort to create a sex zombie. It logically follows that Dahmer’s tower is higher than my own–a position that in my view deserves nothing less than outright contempt.[/quote] You miss the point. One bite from a piece of fruit in defiance of the command of the infinitely holy and righteous creator God constituted an attack upon His authority and hence His person. A mortal crime the result of which was the damnation of every man descended from Adam.
[/quote]
Oh no, I understand this. But there are two problems:
-
I don’t believe that this or anything like this ever happened.
-
If–and I consider this to be so crushingly improbable as to be very close to unworthy of consideration–but if it did happen–if I am born into sin by virtue of the fact that my great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandmother took a bite from an apple–then, as I said, I have no use for a petulant child of a God and I will enjoy being as far from Him as possible.
[quote]smh23 wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]smh23 wrote:<<< Dahmer’s tower is high enough to have cleared the bar for entry into the eternal kingdom, whereas mine is not, despite the fact that I’ve never injected acid into the exposed brain of a living human being in an effort to create a sex zombie. It logically follows that Dahmer’s tower is higher than my own–a position that in my view deserves nothing less than outright contempt.[/quote] You miss the point. One bite from a piece of fruit in defiance of the command of the infinitely holy and righteous creator God constituted an attack upon His authority and hence His person. A mortal crime the result of which was the damnation of every man descended from Adam.
[/quote]
Oh no, I understand this. But there are two problems:
-
I don’t believe that this or anything like this ever happened.
-
If–and I consider this to be so crushingly improbable as to be very close to unworthy of consideration–but if it did happen–if I am born into sin by virtue of the fact that my great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great-great grandmother took a bite from an apple–then, as I said, I have no use for a petulant child of a God and I will enjoy being as far from Him as possible.[/quote]Actually it was your great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, grandFATHER. It was in Adam that all died (1 Corinthians 15:22). He was the head. That’s why the Christ could be born of a woman, but not a human father.
Nuthin to do with Petulance. His holiness and justice which He CANNOT violate. I of course earnestly hope and pray it doesn’t come to this, but if you do enter eternity without the covering of the blood of Christ, You WILL be far from Him indeed and it will NOT be enjoyable. What you have use for is entirely irrelevant until you become the creator and king of the universe. I learned this the hard way.