T Nation

High bar and low bar

Im new on here so heres the thing i want to compete in powerlifting soon. I have previously tried low bar squats and my shoulders killed me i tried for 6 months i trained with a guy who did powerlifting and squats low bar 575 lbs raw and he told me to do shoulder mobility work which i did 3x a week it still not no help. Once i get up to about 225 still shoulder pain ive squatted 315 low bar and it felt like it ripping my shoulders out.

He assured my form was corrent and we even tried a few different positions. So i started squatting high bar which feels much more natural i can do 375x7 at body weight of 198 i have not maxed out on high bar. So to make this short would i be able to use the high bar squat in poeerlifting meets and how effective is it ? And is it legal to wear oly shoes in raw powerlifting?

Yes you can use a high bar placement in meet, how effective depends on how strong and how well your geneticly made up to effectively use your bodies leverages in the movement, yes Oly Shoes are allowed.

[quote]Reed wrote:
Yes you can use a high bar placement in meet, how effective depends on how strong and how well your geneticly made up to effectively use your bodies leverages in the movement, yes Oly Shoes are allowed.[/quote]

Thank you very much for responding.

No problem and good luck.

I tried low bar for a month and my wrist and shoulder killed. i tried it because i saw a few big time lifters using low bar.
i switched back to high bar, and i fell 10x better.
do what works for you.
look at eric lilliebridge. he squats high bar.

I switched from low bar to a high(er) bar placement because my shoulders couldn’t take the punishment. It’s worked for me. It may take a while to get use to the switch, but you have to ins the optimal form for your body. A
Wide stance/low bar form isn’t for everyone

Maybe this is just me but when I high bar squat it would kill my back, hurt so much I would not be able to squat for week or so. I started low bar squatting really pulling in my back and holding the bar at the collars, so my entire arm span was across the bar.

I literally went from a 300 pound squat to 400 pounds just because for some reason high bar KILLED me, but alot of big lifters to high bar, alot do low bar. It is what ever works for you but for my low bar is 10000x’s better for my body.

i have long legs and short torso and low bar makes me look like im doing a squatmorning. its worse with a narrow stance. i still train the low bar as i find when i go back to high bar i stay much more upright. i dont always have access to a safety squat bar so i basically use it in replacement of that.

so ya. body type can effect the type of squat you do.

[quote]asooneyeonig wrote:
i have long legs and short torso and low bar makes me look like im doing a squatmorning. its worse with a narrow stance. i still train the low bar as i find when i go back to high bar i stay much more upright. i dont always have access to a safety squat bar so i basically use it in replacement of that.

so ya. body type can effect the type of squat you do. [/quote]

I’m the opposite (SUPER short legs, long torso) and get the same squat-morning effect. I can’t keep balance without sticking my ass out WAY behind me, or I fall over backward. So I do a high-bar squat with a wide stance and that works out really well for my leverages.

[quote]animus wrote:

[quote]asooneyeonig wrote:
i have long legs and short torso and low bar makes me look like im doing a squatmorning. its worse with a narrow stance. i still train the low bar as i find when i go back to high bar i stay much more upright. i dont always have access to a safety squat bar so i basically use it in replacement of that.

so ya. body type can effect the type of squat you do. [/quote]

I’m the opposite (SUPER short legs, long torso) and get the same squat-morning effect. I can’t keep balance without sticking my ass out WAY behind me, or I fall over backward. So I do a high-bar squat with a wide stance and that works out really well for my leverages.[/quote]

Do you have long femurs relative to you lower leg?

[quote]Fletch1986 wrote:

[quote]animus wrote:

[quote]asooneyeonig wrote:
i have long legs and short torso and low bar makes me look like im doing a squatmorning. its worse with a narrow stance. i still train the low bar as i find when i go back to high bar i stay much more upright. i dont always have access to a safety squat bar so i basically use it in replacement of that.

so ya. body type can effect the type of squat you do. [/quote]

I’m the opposite (SUPER short legs, long torso) and get the same squat-morning effect. I can’t keep balance without sticking my ass out WAY behind me, or I fall over backward. So I do a high-bar squat with a wide stance and that works out really well for my leverages.[/quote]

Do you have long femurs relative to you lower leg?[/quote]

What counts as long? 37.7" hip bone to ground, 18" knee to hip… so femur is 18 to tibia’s 19.5" (Knee to the hip joint is 15") … I’mma go with no.

[quote]Umbrata Fortis wrote:
Maybe this is just me but when I high bar squat it would kill my back, hurt so much I would not be able to squat for week or so. I started low bar squatting really pulling in my back and holding the bar at the collars, so my entire arm span was across the bar.

I literally went from a 300 pound squat to 400 pounds just because for some reason high bar KILLED me, but alot of big lifters to high bar, alot do low bar. It is what ever works for you but for my low bar is 10000x’s better for my body.[/quote]

Hi bar destroys my knees for some reason. Same with front squats. I never feel a thing with low-bar, however. Right as rain. I suspect it is a mobility thing, where as I hit bottom in the hi bar, the bar path was falling behind the foot due to my calves and inner legs blocking me, and the result put a lot of strain on my knee. I think hi bar takes a lot of lower body mobility, and I agree with most everyone here about just using the position that’s right for you.

There is about a hundred pound difference between my parallel low bar and deep high bar squat. I switched to high bar to give my shoulders a break and found I enjoy the new challenge of getting my high bar to catch up to my low bar. Especially since my days of PR’s in the low bar are long gone.

[quote]asooneyeonig wrote:
i have long legs and short torso and low bar makes me look like im doing a squatmorning. its worse with a narrow stance. i still train the low bar as i find when i go back to high bar i stay much more upright. i dont always have access to a safety squat bar so i basically use it in replacement of that.

so ya. body type can effect the type of squat you do. [/quote]
I’m not sure I follow you here. A safety squat bar makes the squat like a very high bar squat, not like a low bar squat.

[quote]OBoile wrote:
I’m not sure I follow you here. A safety squat bar makes the squat like a very high bar squat, not like a low bar squat.[/quote]

with long legs and short torso a low bar nearly folds me in half. i have to lean over more to compensate for leverages which hits my posterior chain harder. a safety bar squat, with the weight cambered 4 inches forward, also throws me forward. both lifts force that posterior chain to work harder so i dont fall forward.

so when i got back a high bar with a wide stance, which for my i am more upright anyways i can easily keep my chest up.

does that make more sense?

[quote]asooneyeonig wrote:

[quote]OBoile wrote:
I’m not sure I follow you here. A safety squat bar makes the squat like a very high bar squat, not like a low bar squat.[/quote]

with long legs and short torso a low bar nearly folds me in half. i have to lean over more to compensate for leverages which hits my posterior chain harder. a safety bar squat, with the weight cambered 4 inches forward, also throws me forward. both lifts force that posterior chain to work harder so i dont fall forward.

so when i got back a high bar with a wide stance, which for my i am more upright anyways i can easily keep my chest up.

does that make more sense?[/quote]
Not really, no. I have a safety squat bar. Its much more of a quad dominant exercise than a regular squat for me and everyone else that’s tried it.

You’re far more vertical with a SSB, like a front squat. Both of these movements will try to pull you forward, but there is considerably less ROM with the posterior chain in both of these cases.

[quote]OBoile wrote:
Not really, no. I have a safety squat bar. Its much more of a quad dominant exercise than a regular squat for me and everyone else that’s tried it.

You’re far more vertical with a SSB, like a front squat. Both of these movements will try to pull you forward, but there is considerably less ROM with the posterior chain in both of these cases.[/quote]

i guess i missunderstood this article

and i guess we front squat differently. i always go rock bottom on a front squat and that requires, for my body at least, more hip movement and immensely more knee movement. it still hits my posterior chain and from that article i would think it does as it also can improve your deadlift.

im not trying to argue, just trying to understand this better as we obviously have different train of thought likely from different information.

another example would be the high box, narrow stance safety bar squat. i have learned that is a nice supplement to the deadlift. which unless im wrong, deadlifting is primarily a posterior chain exercise. well sure, the quads help to break off the floor but overall a secondary muscle.

both gyms i go to have a safety squat bar. what i have learned about it is from wendler, simmons, and several lifters at both gyms. its generally consistent on what i hear. being a quad dominant movement is not something i have heard before. not saying it is or not, it just is something new that doesnt seem to fit into the other information i have.

What I found with the SSB squat is that it doesn’t use my hips or hams a ton, but uses my entire back to keep that thing in the right position and uses about the same amount of quad as a front squat.