T Nation

HGH - 10iu EOD or 5iu ED?


#1

Managed to get 5 x 100iu genuine Hygetropin that's currently sitting in my fridge and going to get my hands on another 5 boxes next week.

Thinking of adding it to my current cycle that'll take me up to my next national PL meet (current international champ) - started yesterday:
Sust 250mg/wk
Tren E 400mg/wk up to 600mg then switching to 750mg Tren A 6 weeks out from comp
500mg EQ/wk got plenty so may up it to 750-1g after a few weeks
60mg Dbol ED 6 week kick start
Halo 40mg ED 4 weeks out from comp
Clen and t3 on and off to boost fat loss even got some DNP but will run that off season.
Running caber/aromasin etc

Current best comp lifts at 220lb class are SQ-710lb/BP-460/DL-750lb

Through this prep I'm going to be attempting to shift about 5-7% bf while upping strength gains. Nutrition is dialled in and gone from around 16%-12/13% last 4 weeks naturally while keeping strength up (following the Renaissance diet)

All I'm asking for is people's opinions off adding growth to aid fat loss and keep my recovery (tendons, ligaments and sleep) good while adding a few more lb of good lean mass? Competed at 210lb at about 16% by last comp after a water cut and want to go into this comp around 220lb leanest I can be while keeping performance up.

10iu eod or 5iu ed?

My plan is 10iu EOD either first thing In the morning or last thing at night? Opinions? Cheers

Boysie888


#2

Have you done HGH before? The sides aren’t all that nice when starting. At 2ui daily I experienced considerable stomach cramps and horrible joint pains. I’d start at a lower dose and go up.


#3

Nice lifts man impressive!

I’ve read eod dosing mimics more of a natural release of gh. If you do go eod, I would break up the 10iu into smaller doses multiple
Times a day.

There’s a few good gh threads in the best of the steroids sticky


#4

No mate I havent, what do you suggest starting at? I’ve read a few times that tapering doesn’t offer any benefit (if you get sides at 5iu you aren’t going to NOT get them if you taper I think they meant) I can split the doses fine tbh so I guess maybe starting at 5 eod for few weeks then 7.5 eod until I hit the 10iu mark?


#5

[quote]BUDs wrote:
Nice lifts man impressive!

I’ve read eod dosing mimics more of a natural release of gh. If you do go eod, I would break up the 10iu into smaller doses multiple
Times a day.

There’s a few good gh threads in the best of the steroids sticky[/quote]

Cheers mate, only want to get better!

Yeah exactly my thought about eod, I could do am, lunch or pwo, pm if needs be! Not afraid of he ole needle only issue is keeping it refrigerated throughout the day? Work as a strength coach with private clients so find myself all over the place all day.

Looking at the insulin portable coolers (battery powered tiny fridge) but they’ll set me back a fair amount! But if it’s the only option I’ll take it. Got a usb charger and 12hr battery life so could keep it in the car.


#6

[quote]BUDs wrote:
Nice lifts man impressive!

I’ve read eod dosing mimics more of a natural release of gh. If you do go eod, I would break up the 10iu into smaller doses multiple
Times a day.

There’s a few good gh threads in the best of the steroids sticky[/quote]

Cheers mate, only want to get better!

Yeah exactly my thought about eod, I could do am, lunch or pwo, pm if needs be! Not afraid of he ole needle only issue is keeping it refrigerated throughout the day? Work as a strength coach with private clients so find myself all over the place all day.

Looking at the insulin portable coolers (battery powered tiny fridge) but they’ll set me back a fair amount! But if it’s the only option I’ll take it. Got a usb charger and 12hr battery life so could keep it in the car.


#7

[quote]Boysie888 wrote:
No mate I havent, what do you suggest starting at? I’ve read a few times that tapering doesn’t offer any benefit (if you get sides at 5iu you aren’t going to NOT get them if you taper I think they meant) I can split the doses fine tbh so I guess maybe starting at 5 eod for few weeks then 7.5 eod until I hit the 10iu mark? [/quote]

A lot of people taper to be able to deal with the sides.

I’d say go for the dose you want maybe split into when you wake up and after training IM. See if you can handle the sides, if you can you’re golden, if you can’t lower the dose.

Like I said I tried to start at 4ui daily and I had crazy cramps and joint pains and had to go back down to 2 and gradually taper back up to 4.


#8

Noob is right. We talked about and shared this a couple weeks back. Tbh, especially as a powerlifter, aint no way in hell you’re gonna be able to run doses like that and compete well. I am almost 12 weeks in and my joints still ache off 4iu. I started at 4iu and it shook me up pretty bad. Dropped down to 2 5 on 2 off and ran that for 5 weeks then tapered up .5iu every 10 days after that.

I was up at 5iu but it was just too much. running 4iu 6 on 1 off now and just now starting to see the benefits and less of the sides as time goes on. My shoulder ligaments and tendons were so tight i nearly had impinged shoulders from the rotator cuff and bursa pulling against my AC joint. I went from benching 375 (powerlifting form) to benching 185 STRICT form, MTUT, because it literally will force you to focus on your mobility and supportive tissue.

I have lost about 2% body fat with no cardio, and look much more dense and full. It is worth it, but honestly if you are gonna be running GH as a competitor, take a year off and do it then. Cause it will set you back before it brings you forward.


#9

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:
Noob is right. We talked about and shared this a couple weeks back. Tbh, especially as a powerlifter, aint no way in hell you’re gonna be able to run doses like that and compete well. I am almost 12 weeks in and my joints still ache off 4iu. I started at 4iu and it shook me up pretty bad. Dropped down to 2 5 on 2 off and ran that for 5 weeks then tapered up .5iu every 10 days after that.

I was up at 5iu but it was just too much. running 4iu 6 on 1 off now and just now starting to see the benefits and less of the sides as time goes on. My shoulder ligaments and tendons were so tight i nearly had impinged shoulders from the rotator cuff and bursa pulling against my AC joint. I went from benching 375 (powerlifting form) to benching 185 STRICT form, MTUT, because it literally will force you to focus on your mobility and supportive tissue.

I have lost about 2% body fat with no cardio, and look much more dense and full. It is worth it, but honestly if you are gonna be running GH as a competitor, take a year off and do it then. Cause it will set you back before it brings you forward.

[/quote]

Christ! I hadn’t ever heard this! I’ve done two shots at 10iu prebed over the last 5 days (10iu EOD) and obviously I’m not planning I feel anything yet except Last few nights I’ve been sleeping well, better than usual. Doing 10iu SubQ for the ‘bleed effect’ that comes with subQ GH shots. The second I get any feeling of stiffness/CTS I’ll knock it back greatly. I have genuine Hyge so the quality should be pretty good.

I’ve been reading a lot about E3D protocols etc and tempted to give that a go. 10iu E3D apparently mimics the way young teens (when GH is produced in highest concentrates) 7 out of 21days. If I start to feel stiff I may knock it down to E3D same dose.

Fridge storage is limited as currently living with the misses family while we save up for a deposit on a house (got out of renting as it was butt fucking my bank account)

If that doesn’t control sides I’ll sack it in and probably start after comp (comp in 3 months)


#10

[quote]nooberific wrote:

[quote]Boysie888 wrote:
No mate I havent, what do you suggest starting at? I’ve read a few times that tapering doesn’t offer any benefit (if you get sides at 5iu you aren’t going to NOT get them if you taper I think they meant) I can split the doses fine tbh so I guess maybe starting at 5 eod for few weeks then 7.5 eod until I hit the 10iu mark? [/quote]

A lot of people taper to be able to deal with the sides.

I’d say go for the dose you want maybe split into when you wake up and after training IM. See if you can handle the sides, if you can you’re golden, if you can’t lower the dose.

Like I said I tried to start at 4ui daily and I had crazy cramps and joint pains and had to go back down to 2 and gradually taper back up to 4.[/quote]

Sorry to get back to you late mate.

Like I said in the post above I’ve done two 10iu EOD shots prebed subQ for bleed effect. May try this for a month or two (if I don’t end up crippled with sides) and then maybe E3D (AM-IM/PWO-IM/PM-SubQ. See if I can feel any difference etc.


#11

[quote]nooberific wrote:
Have you done HGH before? The sides aren’t all that nice when starting. At 2ui daily I experienced considerable stomach cramps and horrible joint pains. I’d start at a lower dose and go up.[/quote]

U should consider this bro… with hgh you need to work up a bit of tolerance. Start at a low dose 2iu and bump it up weekly. 10 iu is a lot if doing that in a day you would probably break it up. Morning, post workout, before bed. For fat loss its great 1st thing in morning then hit cardio. For this 4iu is plenty. As far as pinning goes i have never seen a huge diff between sq & im… hygertropin is pretty good…decent stuff & reasonable price. Get your tolarence up so u dont suffer. Headaches and joint pain suck if blast 2 much


#12

Some food for thought in this thread. In for more replies.

I just started GH today (hyge) 4iu/day. In Shadow’s thread he mentioned doing it ED/split in the AM and pre-wo for fat-loss OR pwo and before bed for more of a gains focused approach. I’ll probably try both, but I’m interested in this intermediate time off between inj. Whether it’s EOD or 4 weeks on/2weeks off etc.


#13

K well first off, unless you are 35+ years old, introducing exo GH within 6 hours before bed is a bad idea and really throws off your bodies natural release and pulses.

The “bleed” effect is garbage and very outdated. You are lucky to absorb 30% of that GH while the rest floats around and attaches in all the wrong places or gets pissed out. IM or IV is the only way to get your money’s worth.

And yes, you are right on with the E3D idea. I am switching to that as we speak. Been running 4iu for 2 months after running 2iu for the first month on to get my levels elevated. However I have run into some issues with some gyno flare up, and am really starting to understand the e3d protocol much better. Twice the benefit, with a fraction of the sides if any. I would highly suggest this after running 2iu ED for 4 weeks to get your body accustomed to the exo GH.

I hope you mean by fridge storage that you still have it refrigerated, but just not in vast quantity…


#14

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:
K well first off, unless you are 35+ years old, introducing exo GH within 6 hours before bed is a bad idea and really throws off your bodies natural release and pulses.

The “bleed” effect is garbage and very outdated. You are lucky to absorb 30% of that GH while the rest floats around and attaches in all the wrong places or gets pissed out. IM or IV is the only way to get your money’s worth.

And yes, you are right on with the E3D idea. I am switching to that as we speak. Been running 4iu for 2 months after running 2iu for the first month on to get my levels elevated. However I have run into some issues with some gyno flare up, and am really starting to understand the e3d protocol much better. Twice the benefit, with a fraction of the sides if any. I would highly suggest this after running 2iu ED for 4 weeks to get your body accustomed to the exo GH.

I hope you mean by fridge storage that you still have it refrigerated, but just not in vast quantity…
[/quote]

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.


#15

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.

[/quote]

Too hard to do research for yourself? SubQ is only directed for males over 40 and 50 to mimic the pulse and “trickle” effect of an aged pituitary. Why tf would you do that if your goal is to gain and lean out? Shit there is so much info on this forum from BBB regarding this stuff, idk how subQ is still even an option.


#16

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.

[/quote]

Too hard to do research for yourself? SubQ is only directed for males over 40 and 50 to mimic the pulse and “trickle” effect of an aged pituitary. Why tf would you do that if your goal is to gain and lean out? Shit there is so much info on this forum from BBB regarding this stuff, idk how subQ is still even an option. [/quote]

BBB is a convicted felon who has all but been run off this forum/delegated to the Rehab section. ShadowPro- an IFBB pro and Olympia Competitor disagrees with you.

You can’t just spout whatever you want without references and then proclaim “Prove me wrong”; It doesn’t work that way here. If you have a legitimate study that demonstrates your claim then PROVIDE IT. Otherwise go shove the back end of a hairbrush up your ass because nobody is going to care what you have to say.


#17

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.

[/quote]

Too hard to do research for yourself? SubQ is only directed for males over 40 and 50 to mimic the pulse and “trickle” effect of an aged pituitary. Why tf would you do that if your goal is to gain and lean out? Shit there is so much info on this forum from BBB regarding this stuff, idk how subQ is still even an option. [/quote]

BBB is a convicted felon who has all but been run off this forum/delegated to the Rehab section. ShadowPro- an IFBB pro and Olympia Competitor disagrees with you.

You can’t just spout whatever you want without references and then proclaim “Prove me wrong”; It doesn’t work that way here. If you have a legitimate study that demonstrates your claim then PROVIDE IT. Otherwise go shove the back end of a hairbrush up your ass because nobody is going to care what you have to say. [/quote]

You discredit BBB, but did you stop to think and say hey, is shadow pro really a pro? Olympia pro for that matter?

How do you know?

You saying you don’t trust an Internet face such as BBB, but yet are convinced of another Internet face in shadow pro?


#18

[quote]BUDs wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.

[/quote]

Too hard to do research for yourself? SubQ is only directed for males over 40 and 50 to mimic the pulse and “trickle” effect of an aged pituitary. Why tf would you do that if your goal is to gain and lean out? Shit there is so much info on this forum from BBB regarding this stuff, idk how subQ is still even an option. [/quote]

BBB is a convicted felon who has all but been run off this forum/delegated to the Rehab section. ShadowPro- an IFBB pro and Olympia Competitor disagrees with you.

You can’t just spout whatever you want without references and then proclaim “Prove me wrong”; It doesn’t work that way here. If you have a legitimate study that demonstrates your claim then PROVIDE IT. Otherwise go shove the back end of a hairbrush up your ass because nobody is going to care what you have to say. [/quote]

You discredit BBB, but did you stop to think and say hey, is shadow pro really a pro? Olympia pro for that matter?

How do you know?

You saying you don’t trust an Internet face such as BBB, but yet are convinced of another Internet face in shadow pro?
[/quote]

Yes, ShadowPro has been vetted by the Mods/Admin here at T-Nation. They have vouched for him and know who he is. I believe T-Nation is even planning on carrying his book after it’s published. So yeah, lol, I trust him. He’s done a lot to help me and he is the biggest credit to this forum right now.

I don’t ever see BBB posting in the AS section now. Last I saw it was all in the rehab section and everything always boiled down to, “Go see a physiotherapist in person for a correct analysis.”


#19

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

[quote]BUDs wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

[quote]ChrisArm wrote:

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

Please provide your source for such a claim; I would like to read this study that claims you will only “absorb” 30% and the rest is “pissed out”.

[/quote]

Too hard to do research for yourself? SubQ is only directed for males over 40 and 50 to mimic the pulse and “trickle” effect of an aged pituitary. Why tf would you do that if your goal is to gain and lean out? Shit there is so much info on this forum from BBB regarding this stuff, idk how subQ is still even an option. [/quote]

BBB is a convicted felon who has all but been run off this forum/delegated to the Rehab section. ShadowPro- an IFBB pro and Olympia Competitor disagrees with you.

You can’t just spout whatever you want without references and then proclaim “Prove me wrong”; It doesn’t work that way here. If you have a legitimate study that demonstrates your claim then PROVIDE IT. Otherwise go shove the back end of a hairbrush up your ass because nobody is going to care what you have to say. [/quote]

You discredit BBB, but did you stop to think and say hey, is shadow pro really a pro? Olympia pro for that matter?

How do you know?

You saying you don’t trust an Internet face such as BBB, but yet are convinced of another Internet face in shadow pro?
[/quote]

Yes, ShadowPro has been vetted by the Mods/Admin here at T-Nation. They have vouched for him and know who he is. I believe T-Nation is even planning on carrying his book after it’s published. So yeah, lol, I trust him. He’s done a lot to help me and he is the biggest credit to this forum right now.

I don’t ever see BBB posting in the AS section now. Last I saw it was all in the rehab section and everything always boiled down to, “Go see a physiotherapist in person for a correct analysis.” [/quote]

Guess you’re not a deep thinker.


#20

[quote]Uncreative123 wrote:

You can’t just spout whatever you want without references and then proclaim “Prove me wrong”; It doesn’t work that way here. If you have a legitimate study that demonstrates your claim then PROVIDE IT. Otherwise go shove the back end of a hairbrush up your ass because nobody is going to care what you have to say. [/quote]

I actually can. I am not an attorney sworn to anything. I know what I know, and I know what works for me and millions of other. It may not be the ONLY right way, but it is certainly one of the best ways. I didn’t beg anybody to believe me, but it doesn’t hurt to point out the fact that there are thousands of posts by a guru on this forum supporting what I am saying.

In context you are also saying Gavin Kane, and hundreds of other pro’s and doctors are full of shit, but that another internet face like BUDs said is the almighty, so his word is God’s. You are something else.