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Help With Sumo Form - Vids Included

Ok so basically I’m not a great deadlifter. Best pull’s 220kg at 90 (conventional) and now that I’ve started to compete in insgle ply gear I’ve decided to try and make the mover to sumo to maximise the benefit from it, and because I’ve strong enough legs (220kg squat at 90).

So… Any help or tips on the following vids would be appreciated!


I am far from an expert but you seem to use your lower back more than your butt. How does it feel to you? If that is the case, my completely uninformed suggestion would be to move your hips forward at the beginning of the lift and the drive upward rather than pulling frm above. Does that make sense to you? (Word of warning: I am a completely recreational lifter;-)

TQB

Sumo deadlifts are more for our legs than your back, Try to keep your upper body as up right as you can legs at about paralel. Thats how Ive seen people lift in suits at least so without that “spring” out of the bottom it might be completle different.

It looks like your trying to pull conventional just with a wider stance. Thats what I used to do when I did sumo, my solution was to stop trying sumo.

Your only real problem is how you break it from the floor.

Your first motion is to lift your hips. This rounds your back and makes it a wide stance conventional, like n3wb said.

I think your problem is caused by your set up. You use a rocker, which works great for conventional but sucks for sumo.

I pull sumo. When I set up, I line up my feet, look up and take a deep breath.

I keep head up, arched and breath held while descending to grab the bar. I never look down and never actually look at the bar and never release the arch in my back.

This way I set my position in the bottom for the initial pull. If you are in tight gear, it also lets you pull your hips down so the gear pops out of the hole.

Then the only motion you should think about is driving your head up. Everything else will follow. You will stick at the floor, not your knees. If you stick at your knees, your hips lifted first.

Hope this helps and if the explanation doesn’t seem clear, let me know.

[quote]n3wb wrote:
It looks like your trying to pull conventional just with a wider stance.
[/quote]

Agreed. Too much pivot in your back for sumo. Drop the hips more, keep your back straighter and push up with your legs.

[quote]robo1 wrote:
n3wb wrote:
It looks like your trying to pull conventional just with a wider stance.

Agreed. Too much pivot in your back for sumo. Drop the hips more, keep your back straighter and push up with your legs.[/quote]

Yup drop the hips drive them forward squeeze those glute and push keens out your knees seem to be coming in a bit and pressing up. push them OUT and the hips will go under you

Try some wide stance Pull throughs really use your ass and hips to do the move

Phill

Try and spread the floor apart with your feet next time. Lower the weight until you can do this and then start moving up again.
It will bring your legs into it more.

Can you get your feet closer to the plates? Just clear it by an inch. You look very strong. I think you have the right idea.

beef

i was going to say other than lookin like using too much back… i think you could stand to go wider on stance. i know the wider i go (almost at plates) the more upright my back is meaning i use a lot more leg drive. you seem tall enough that you should be wider than that. plus it reduces distance to pull the bar to lockout… try it out and see how it works.

another thing- i remember an article like maybe 1yr ago by Dave Tate talking about sumo deads and how he likes to have his toes almost facing the plates, that way it forces him to drive with his hips. you could try that out too. good luck, and your looking strong. keep at it

Hanley- I don’t pull sumo, but I think you have good form. When I do pull sumo on the rare ME day, I have similar form.

I think you need to just GFS (get fucking strong). LOL. Just kidding because I know you are. Hammer the Zercher deads (or Zercher pin pulls if ur a fatty like me). I’ve pulled 365 for 5 off a low pin so try to beat that. I don’t remember your conv form, but I don’t know if you would be suited for conventional (I am but I still love sumo).

Stay away from pulling heavy too often and work on speed, form, etc. Use 35 plates on DE day so you pull an extra few inches. Feel free to ask me any other questions you have! Good luck man! You are coming along!!!

Thanks for the advice so far y’all… I think alot of the things that are being said are things I already sorta know, but just wanted other eyes on it to make sure I wasn’t just seeing what I want to see!

The problem is I’m TRYING to break the floor with my legs but it doesn’t always work. Every now and again I hit it perfectly and the bar just pops up. But more often than not I don’t. Hence using Sheiko to try and drill in the good form.

I think I get impatient when trying to break the floor and jsut pull it as fast as I can in a wide stance convo style instead of letting my legs do the work. Once I start learning how to pull in a suit it’s something I’ll HAVE to do if I want to pull big weights (I’m ordering at Metal V-type squatter when they’re back in stock on EFS).

As for going wider and turning my feet out… Turning my feet out DEFINATELY helps (ie trying to get my heels under the bar) but it absolutely KILLS my hips. They just can’t handle it yet. I’m hoping that gradually turning my feet out over time will sort that on becaue the pop I get off the floor when it all comes together is unreal.

Same story with trying to go ultra wide, my hips aren’t strong enough and my knees end up buckling too. Currently the widest I can go and still hold SOME form is shines just outside the rings.

I like DL_5000’s idea… as in GFS. Since I’m working with a sheiko template the top deadlift sets are all in the 80% range so I’m just trying to get htose up anyway I can and am working on the form side with the prior sets.

My IT band’s starting to act up on both sides at the moment. I’m attributing it to all the squat and sumo work. So hopefully it’ll clear up over the next few days and I can get back at it again next week and try out all the tips.

[quote]Hanley wrote:
Thanks for the advice so far y’all… I think alot of the things that are being said are things I already sorta know, but just wanted other eyes on it to make sure I wasn’t just seeing what I want to see!

The problem is I’m TRYING to break the floor with my legs but it doesn’t always work. Every now and again I hit it perfectly and the bar just pops up. But more often than not I don’t. Hence using Sheiko to try and drill in the good form.

I think I get impatient when trying to break the floor and jsut pull it as fast as I can in a wide stance convo style instead of letting my legs do the work. Once I start learning how to pull in a suit it’s something I’ll HAVE to do if I want to pull big weights (I’m ordering at Metal V-type squatter when they’re back in stock on EFS).

As for going wider and turning my feet out… Turning my feet out DEFINATELY helps (ie trying to get my heels under the bar) but it absolutely KILLS my hips. They just can’t handle it yet. I’m hoping that gradually turning my feet out over time will sort that on becaue the pop I get off the floor when it all comes together is unreal.

Same story with trying to go ultra wide, my hips aren’t strong enough and my knees end up buckling too. Currently the widest I can go and still hold SOME form is shines just outside the rings.

I like DL_5000’s idea… as in GFS. Since I’m working with a sheiko template the top deadlift sets are all in the 80% range so I’m just trying to get htose up anyway I can and am working on the form side with the prior sets.

My IT band’s starting to act up on both sides at the moment. I’m attributing it to all the squat and sumo work. So hopefully it’ll clear up over the next few days and I can get back at it again next week and try out all the tips.
[/quote]

Are you taking Flameout or a fish oil supp for your hips bro? Do some hip flexor stretches. I find the stretches allow me to go deeper in the hole without nearly as much pain. These might be 2 might be good for you.

IF you already know what you’re problem is you can now work on just fixing it. So you’ve already fought half the battle. Keep up the good work Hanley

[quote]Hanley wrote:
My IT band’s starting to act up on both sides at the moment. I’m attributing it to all the squat and sumo work. So hopefully it’ll clear up over the next few days and I can get back at it again next week and try out all the tips.
[/quote]

Hanley, looking good, I think the advice you already got is right on. I pull conventional because my back is light years ahead of my legs, but I’m going to be adding in sumo pulls during my next phase and I have a feeling I’ll be in the same boat as you.

Watch that IT band. Foam roll it, stretch it, ice it, whatever it takes. If that gets inflamed it is a serious pain in the ass to get rid of.

And here’s this weeks effort http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwYAsNR6lkQ

I think it’s showing some improvement.

You might think about wearing a loosish suit straps down or light briefs to help with the hip pain.

Deads look pretty good, I agree with dl5000 you just need to get stronger. I pull the same way sumo, basically a wide stance conventional pull. If I remember right, that is pretty much the way spud pulls too so remember that though it might not be “the right way”, it might be what works for you.

[quote]mattwray wrote:
You might think about wearing a loosish suit straps down or light briefs to help with the hip pain. [/quote]

The hip pain has subsided somewhat. I think it’s mostly getting used to it and the sheiko cycle that’s causing it!