T Nation

Help with Son's Bulking Diet

[quote]Mister T. wrote:
Hey, if he’s having trouble getting down those 4000 calories in food form, shakes are a great way to go. This is one of Berardi’s as I remember it; I use it often and it’s awesome for between meals:

2 cups iced green tea (brew the green tea in a pot, then let cool and refrigerate). You can use water but GT tastes way better IMO.
1 cup yogurt
a couple tablespoons of peanut butter
frozen fruit
a scoop or two or three of protein powder
handful of spinach (dead serious, it’s a very subtle taste)

A tablespoon or so of olive oil in this shake adds some extra quality fat calories, if you’re so inclined.[/quote]

Peanut butter and green tea sounds disgusting for some reason I’m inclined to try it now, lol.

[quote]Chi-Towns-Finest wrote:

[quote]Mister T. wrote:
Hey, if he’s having trouble getting down those 4000 calories in food form, shakes are a great way to go. This is one of Berardi’s as I remember it; I use it often and it’s awesome for between meals:

2 cups iced green tea (brew the green tea in a pot, then let cool and refrigerate). You can use water but GT tastes way better IMO.
1 cup yogurt
a couple tablespoons of peanut butter
frozen fruit
a scoop or two or three of protein powder
handful of spinach (dead serious, it’s a very subtle taste)

A tablespoon or so of olive oil in this shake adds some extra quality fat calories, if you’re so inclined.[/quote]

Peanut butter and green tea sounds disgusting for some reason I’m inclined to try it now, lol.
[/quote]

Dude I’m serious, it’s good. Like I said, you can sub water for green tea, but it doesn’t taste nearly as good.

I think he should minimize dairy and grains opting for a dieting consisting mostly of fats and proteins, and use carbs in the workout window (but i am sure my views will be met with a lot of hate mail).
Either way fats and proteins should be ass “clean” as possible and if anything make sure that every three weeks you get a bodycomp assessment, it will help tremendously with what direction the diet should be taking (i.e. feeding him too much, too little etc)

The only thing I would add is, don’t go from 2,000 to 4,000 overnight. Increase it over a few weeks.

If people think I’m out of line with this suggestion, please say so… that’s just what I did when I made a similar caloric jump. I’ve heard if you shock your system you can blow up a bit while getting used to it, however I’ve never made such a drastic jump in one day myself so I can only parrot what I’ve heard on the matter.

Does anyone have shake/liquid calorie ideas that do not involve dairy? Is it possible? lol

[quote]thogue wrote:
Does anyone have shake/liquid calorie ideas that do not involve dairy? Is it possible? lol[/quote]

It’s pretty easy just don’t use a milk-based protein powder, theres always rice and pea protein.

a very easy one is crushed ice, bananas, peanut butter, protein powder and water in a blender. Also add splenda to taste if you want it sweeter.

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:
I think he should minimize dairy and grains opting for a dieting consisting mostly of fats and proteins, and use carbs in the workout window (but i am sure my views will be met with a lot of hate mail).
Either way fats and proteins should be ass “clean” as possible and if anything make sure that every three weeks you get a bodycomp assessment, it will help tremendously with what direction the diet should be taking (i.e. feeding him too much, too little etc)[/quote]

Only thing with this is being he is only 15, still growing etc I don’t think it would be a good idea to cut out all dairy, as I think he would need the calcium etc, but maybe I’m way off base with that line of thinking?

[quote]JaX Un wrote:
you are a good parent helping your son with his goals.[/quote]

Yeah especially the 4.30am starts, but don’t worry I keep reminding him when you are a super star rugby player you better not forget about your mother, lol.

[quote]scj119 wrote:
The only thing I would add is, don’t go from 2,000 to 4,000 overnight. Increase it over a few weeks.

If people think I’m out of line with this suggestion, please say so… that’s just what I did when I made a similar caloric jump. I’ve heard if you shock your system you can blow up a bit while getting used to it, however I’ve never made such a drastic jump in one day myself so I can only parrot what I’ve heard on the matter.[/quote]

I don’t think you are off base here, as when I went looking for the calorie calculator on Beradi’s
website I read an article that said the same thing, he said to go up in 250cal lots for a week see how your going and if progressing well then bump up another 250cal, unless I read the article wrong, but glad I came across it otherwise I would have.

[quote]Ihi wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:
I think he should minimize dairy and grains opting for a dieting consisting mostly of fats and proteins, and use carbs in the workout window (but i am sure my views will be met with a lot of hate mail).
Either way fats and proteins should be ass “clean” as possible and if anything make sure that every three weeks you get a bodycomp assessment, it will help tremendously with what direction the diet should be taking (i.e. feeding him too much, too little etc)[/quote]

Only thing with this is being he is only 15, still growing etc I don’t think it would be a good idea to cut out all dairy, as I think he would need the calcium etc, but maybe I’m way off base with that line of thinking?[/quote]
dairy is actually not that great of a source of calcium, you get more than enough if your diet is rich in animal fats, nuts and vegetables. If you are going the dairy route though try and find un pasteurized sources (i.e. raw milk,cheese, yoghurt). During the pasteurization process the milk’s make up changes completely and the proteins are no longer able to be utilized by the body creating a lot of problems (irritation and subsequently mucus etc) and can actually hinder nutrient absorption. I am sure that down under you should be able to find a good safe place to purchase such products.

[quote]Ihi wrote:

[quote]Brian14 wrote:
Here is something that is currently helping me: Make high calorie protein shakes. An easy recipe is:
2 cups whole milk
scoop of protein powder
1 banana
4 tablespoons peanut butter
1 tablespoon chocolate syrup

That right there has 1000 cals and 60g of protein. Have him drink that twice a day and thats an easy 2000 calories.[/quote]

sweet as good suggestion, he would love something like that, because wasn’t quite sure how I was going to get 4000+ cals into him a day. Holly shit that’s a lot of calories, but obviously he needs it. And this is something he will make him self easily. thanks[/quote]

We tried this for him to have last night, minus the choc syrup but he only put in 1 teaspn of p.butter, he felt even that amount was a bit overpowering, but maybe if we add the syrup it will even the taste out a bit, and only problem was he had it a bit to close to his jujitzu and could feel it slossing around in his stomach so we will need to make sure he has a decent time for it to settle a bit.

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:

[quote]Ihi wrote:

[quote]rehanb_bl wrote:
I think he should minimize dairy and grains opting for a dieting consisting mostly of fats and proteins, and use carbs in the workout window (but i am sure my views will be met with a lot of hate mail).
Either way fats and proteins should be ass “clean” as possible and if anything make sure that every three weeks you get a bodycomp assessment, it will help tremendously with what direction the diet should be taking (i.e. feeding him too much, too little etc)[/quote]

Only thing with this is being he is only 15, still growing etc I don’t think it would be a good idea to cut out all dairy, as I think he would need the calcium etc, but maybe I’m way off base with that line of thinking?[/quote]
dairy is actually not that great of a source of calcium, you get more than enough if your diet is rich in animal fats, nuts and vegetables. If you are going the dairy route though try and find un pasteurized sources (i.e. raw milk,cheese, yoghurt). During the pasteurization process the milk’s make up changes completely and the proteins are no longer able to be utilized by the body creating a lot of problems (irritation and subsequently mucus etc) and can actually hinder nutrient absorption. I am sure that down under you should be able to find a good safe place to purchase such products.[/quote]

Thanks we have a new organic store that has opened here I might go and check it out see what they have, they have advertised that if they don’t have it they will get it in for you, so might have luck there, as I have never seen raw milk in the supermarket.

And thanks for everyone’s suggestions and inputs, I am usually over on the figure athlete site, but I have read a bit on here and have seen people torn to strips, ouch, so was a bit nervous as I don’t have a lot of knowledge on bulking up diets as you can all tell, but your’ve all been really helpful. :slight_smile:

He will not get fat. If he is still willing to eat, let him eat. A 15 year old boy that is training regularly is a furnace with no upper thermostat limit.

Also, if he does somehow start to get fat, just dial back the calories, it’s a fixable problem. You won’t know the limit till you reach it (and I bet it’s higher than you think).

Yes, people get torn to pieces here, but it’s mainly people who post once wanting someone to design an entire nutrition and training program for them on their first post. From what I’ve seen, those who have a real interest in self improvement and who have taken the time to read a couple threads here are treated pretty respectfully.

On a side note, is it league or union?

I don’t really have anything to contribute but you as a parent should be damn proud as your boy is better looking (muscularity wise) than a lot of 20 year olds that I know of.

Also, it’s rare and refreshing to see a parent that is willing to be open-minded and seek advice in areas they don’t know much about, especially when it comes to their children. Typically when even approached about protein powders or supplementation, the usual response is, "ZOMG, isn’t that, like, teh roids and it’ll damage his kidneys/liver/heart/vital organ!?!?!?!?

x2 on JaxUn’s note about being good parent.

This doesn’t need to be complicated. The 1 gallon of whole milk a day program packs pounds on anyone.

[quote]SMF wrote:
This doesn’t need to be complicated. The 1 gallon of whole milk a day program packs pounds on anyone.[/quote]

That’s great if you wanted to be bloated all day, it’s getting a little out dated – at least in my opinion. I wouldn’t even touch the milk they have in the states.

Just trying to keep it simple. It doesn’t bloat everyone, and all of the basics are outdated now (squats, bench, deads). Fine, jar of natural peanut butter a day. 3 shots of olive oil a day. Just get in the extra calories and keep it simple. He’s 15.