T Nation

Help with Fat Loss in 4 Weeks

Bodybuilding
#1

hey guys I want to look more lean in four/six weeks time. i currently weigh 80 kg and guessing around about 15 percent or so body fat.
my training consist of gymnastic ring training and weight training 3/4 times a week and i’m just about to increase my cardio

any advice for me?

I’m thinking about trying carb cycling for beginers? ( http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance_nutrition/a_beginners_guide_to_carb_cycling )

or this diet, get shredded in 2 weeks? ( http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/2_weeks_to_shredded&cr= ) but change it slightly to match 4 or 6 weeks

what do you think will be best? =)

look my other post aswell if you have time they ink together. 0http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/diet_performance_nutrition_supplements/help_first_cutting_diecarb_cycling

#2

92e42_ORIG-IMG00009_20120314_2214.jpg1600×1200 352 KB

my back aswell

#3

You’re already starting out fairly lean, so as your insulin sensitivity’s going to be pretty good. Here’s a few things I’d suggest:

  • I’d definitely keep some carbs in, no matter what other gym rats tell you. Be certain to place them strategically (ie. before your training).

  • Still train with weights for size (hard and heavy!)

  • Use HIT AND Steady State when they will best serve your goals. I had to do some serious amounts of cardio this past prep, and as long as I keep the HIT work short, and the SS work low intensity, there wasn’t any negative issues such as muscle loss. HIT after some carbs on non-weight work days, and SS either morning, or PWO (always with at least some BCAAs or MAG-10 in your system)

  • Don’t go too low calories for more than a day or two in a row, and don’t think you need to starve yourself.

  • Refeeds are NOT excuses to eat crap! Eyes on the prize. If 300 grams of carbs will do the job, there’s no reason for 600!

  • Fish Oils and Slow digest protein before bed (I take minerals as well to help me sleep)

S

#4

x 2 on what Stu said.

#5

cheers stu forthe info and timmcbride00 for the times 2 lol

so here what i’m going to do

i have calculated my macros for shelbys carbs cycling for beginners, and for Christian Thibaudeau so can you choose the best approach along with any adjustments.

shelbys carbs cycling
high day medium low
protien 180 gs 720 kcals 225gs 900 kcals 225 900 kcals
carbs 540 gs 2160 kcals 295gs 1180 kcals 180 720 kcals
fat as little as possible 63gs 567 kcals 88 800 kcals
total kcals 2880 2647 2420

Christian Thibaudeau’es carbs cycling
high day medium low
proteins 180 720 kcals 180 720 kcal 180 720 kcals
carbs C 275 1100 kcals 220 880 kcals 165 660 kcals
fat 122 1098 kcals 122 1098 kcals 122 1098 kcals
kcals 2918 kcals 2698 kcals 2478 kcals

which protocol do you think is best for me?

so my week will be this, monday Wednesday friday will be my low carbs days. which i will do steady cardio mainly in the mornings. my medium days will be Saturday and sundays, which Saturday is a day off or bag work, sundays is gymnastic strength training day
my two high days will be Tuesdays which is legs and Thursdays which is back

please let me know what i need to change

#6

also the supplements i take are just protein and waxy maze for my peri shake. I’m going to start on cretine again soon

#7

Wow, too much detail for me, I never plan my diet that much, lol.

I just gradually reduce carbs and use refeeds as necessary. Natural carb cycling by not having any periworkout nutrition on days off.

That said, the idea of high carb days are to 1) fuel tough workouts and 2) help keep metabolism going strong.

However, you are looking to get as lean as possible in 4 weeks, so I would consider ditching the high carb days. You are not really going to experience a sluggish metabolism after 4 weeks of dieting (or even 6), so I would really focus on keeping the carbs lower and taking them in around your workout (as Stu mentioned).

Take in more on tougher days or days but don’t go crazy high if you are looking to maximize your results in such a limited time frame.

Basically, my philosophy would be, the longer you give yourself, the smaller the change to your existing diet, and the shorter your time frame for expected results, the more drastic the change.

Hope that helps.

#8

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
You’re already starting out fairly lean, so as your insulin sensitivity’s going to be pretty good. Here’s a few things I’d suggest:

  • I’d definitely keep some carbs in, no matter what other gym rats tell you. Be certain to place them strategically (ie. before your training).

  • Still train with weights for size (hard and heavy!)

  • Use HIT AND Steady State when they will best serve your goals. I had to do some serious amounts of cardio this past prep, and as long as I keep the HIT work short, and the SS work low intensity, there wasn’t any negative issues such as muscle loss. HIT after some carbs on non-weight work days, and SS either morning, or PWO (always with at least some BCAAs or MAG-10 in your system)

  • Don’t go too low calories for more than a day or two in a row, and don’t think you need to starve yourself.

  • Refeeds are NOT excuses to eat crap! Eyes on the prize. If 300 grams of carbs will do the job, there’s no reason for 600!

  • Fish Oils and Slow digest protein before bed (I take minerals as well to help me sleep)

S[/quote]
How many grams of fish oil do you take in?

#9

Personally, I pop 2 Flameouts with most of my daily meals (not my pre-workout stuff though). Before bed, I throw down a few CLAs with my Mineral Support. Of course I’m banking on not just the fat partitioning properties of the fish oils, but also for my aging joints, so not everyone will need as many as I’ve come to rely on.

S

#10

haha i know mate i would prefer not to do all that messing around.
so timmcbride00 would you say dont count calories or have know roughly? then just eat meat, fat and veggies for my meals and then have carbs around training on weight training days and on my steady state cardio days have none/ very little carbs(morning) and a refeed every 4 days?

after i have shed some fat i just want to maintain for a while with carb cycling with high days etc and then bulk in the winter when my injuires should be gone =)

p.s sorry for all the questions as you can tell im a beginner to all this as you can would of guessed lol

cheers

#11

[quote]kruddy123 wrote:
haha i know mate i would prefer not to do all that messing around.
so timmcbride00 would you say dont count calories or have know roughly? then just eat meat, fat and veggies for my meals and then have carbs around training on weight training days and on my steady state cardio days have none/ very little carbs(morning) and a refeed every 4 days?
[/quote]

I’ve been discussing how I’m going to stay in shape on my upcoming honeymoon with my buddy Phil (WNBF and MuscleMania Pro), and his simple advice was to focus on lean protein and veggies for most of my meals, indulge on a few occasions, and try to get some training in if possible.

When I’m in the full throes of a contest diet, aside from my training window, I focus mostly on Protein, Healthy fats, and veggies. This allows me to benefit during my workout from the influx of carbs (Finibars + SWF), but allow my body to run off fatty acids at other times of the day. Also, on ‘off’ days, the caloric shift from not having the peri-workout nutrition automatically drops my daily #s without much calculating.

As for a refeed, just pick one day of your split for a ‘high’ day and throw in an extra scoop of SWF, or even a cup of oats post workout. Keep the rest as normal ‘baseline’ or ‘medium’ days, and your off days as ‘low’ days, without the workout nutrition. It’s really not as complicated as some people perceive it to be.

S

#12

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:

I’ve been discussing how I’m going to stay in shape on my upcoming honeymoon with my buddy Phil [/quote]

Really? Shouldn’t you take Cat on your honeymoon instead of your buddy Phil? Just a suggestion… ; )

#13

[quote]kruddy123 wrote:
haha i know mate i would prefer not to do all that messing around.
so timmcbride00 would you say dont count calories or have know roughly?
[/quote]

I know what I take in for 2 reasons, 1) I have tracked my intake for years and 2) I am boring, even if I stopped tracking, I would pretty much know my carbs/calories because I eat the same thing day in and day out. When I find something that works and I enjoy, I stick with it.

[quote]kruddy123 wrote:
then just eat meat, fat and veggies for my meals and then have carbs around training on weight training days and on my steady state cardio days have none/ very little carbs(morning) [/quote]

You got the idea, can’t go wrong with that plan when you are looking to get lean. Adjust carbs based on workout performance, fat loss, etc.

[quote]kruddy123 wrote:
and a refeed every 4 days?
[/quote]

Why? Don’t make this overly complicated.

You are looking to get as lean as you can in 4 to 6 weeks. You may not even need a “refeed” so to speak. Sure a higher carb intake may be justified on leg day for example, but as I mentioned earlier, with such a short duration diet, you aren’t going to be having issues with a sluggish metabolism, thus no real need for a refeed.

Refeeds, IMO, are for when you are deep into a fat loss phase and are stalled out and truly lacking motivation. For just 4 to 6 weeks, you should make it through with no problems without the need for a refeed.

#14

nice work guys, i am confident in starting my diet on moday =)

im thinking breakfast eggs and oats, then the rest of my meals will be chicken and sald with flax seed oil/olive oil, and then steak and green veggies for my others,

is pork steaks o.k to eat? (im thinking no)

also when im busy to eat i will have a protien shake with oats in.

i am going to start on 2700 kcals per days then adjust as needed

my bedtime meal is goig to be a casien shake,

i will take leucine when i wake apart from morning cardio (shelby says dont have aminos on fasted cardio) and around training.

#15

You definitely aren’t going to need a refeed when you’re just dieting for 4-6 weeks. Totally pointless unless you are already very lean.

If you’re going to eat steak it should be a lean cut like top sirloin or flank steak. If you want to save money just get lean ground beef, 90%+, and drain the fat off.

#16

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
You’re already starting out fairly lean, so as your insulin sensitivity’s going to be pretty good. Here’s a few things I’d suggest:

  • I’d definitely keep some carbs in, no matter what other gym rats tell you. Be certain to place them strategically (ie. before your training).

  • Still train with weights for size (hard and heavy!)

  • Use HIT AND Steady State when they will best serve your goals. I had to do some serious amounts of cardio this past prep, and as long as I keep the HIT work short, and the SS work low intensity, there wasn’t any negative issues such as muscle loss. HIT after some carbs on non-weight work days, and SS either morning, or PWO (always with at least some BCAAs or MAG-10 in your system)

  • Don’t go too low calories for more than a day or two in a row, and don’t think you need to starve yourself.

  • Refeeds are NOT excuses to eat crap! Eyes on the prize. If 300 grams of carbs will do the job, there’s no reason for 600!

  • Fish Oils and Slow digest protein before bed (I take minerals as well to help me sleep)

S[/quote]

Sorry to be a pest but I have had a question for a whille… I’m sure you have answered this elsewhere so feel free to direct me there if you prefer.

I was really just wondering why you think carbs PRE workout are the most important time? Is this something personal or do you have a basis for it?

Thanks in advance for the info.

#17

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
You definitely aren’t going to need a refeed when you’re just dieting for 4-6 weeks. Totally pointless unless you are already very lean.

If you’re going to eat steak it should be a lean cut like top sirloin or flank steak. If you want to save money just get lean ground beef, 90%+, and drain the fat off.[/quote]

This is why I love the George Foreman grill.

#18

[quote]arramzy wrote:

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
You’re already starting out fairly lean, so as your insulin sensitivity’s going to be pretty good. Here’s a few things I’d suggest:

  • I’d definitely keep some carbs in, no matter what other gym rats tell you. Be certain to place them strategically (ie. before your training).

  • Still train with weights for size (hard and heavy!)

  • Use HIT AND Steady State when they will best serve your goals. I had to do some serious amounts of cardio this past prep, and as long as I keep the HIT work short, and the SS work low intensity, there wasn’t any negative issues such as muscle loss. HIT after some carbs on non-weight work days, and SS either morning, or PWO (always with at least some BCAAs or MAG-10 in your system)

  • Don’t go too low calories for more than a day or two in a row, and don’t think you need to starve yourself.

  • Refeeds are NOT excuses to eat crap! Eyes on the prize. If 300 grams of carbs will do the job, there’s no reason for 600!

  • Fish Oils and Slow digest protein before bed (I take minerals as well to help me sleep)

S[/quote]

Sorry to be a pest but I have had a question for a whille… I’m sure you have answered this elsewhere so feel free to direct me there if you prefer.

I was really just wondering why you think carbs PRE workout are the most important time? Is this something personal or do you have a basis for it?

Thanks in advance for the info.[/quote]

Cant speak for Stu but for myself I absolutely think pre-workout is the way to go. Timing will depend on a number of factors (what kind/source of carbs, what kind of training, insulin sensitivity or response to carb meals–do they make you sleepy?, do you train firsr thing in the morning or later, etc), however I firmly believe I have seen better results this way.

In laymans terms the scientific basis for this is twofold: 1) catecholamines are released during hard exercise. They blunt insulin sensitivity and therefore affect carb utilization. They remain elevated in the blood for some time after exercise has stopped (the PWO period) 2) the timing makes much better intuitive sense–why wait for 45 minutes for you body to digest a PWO shake to get carbs in you when you can have them in your bloodstream ready to be utilized ALREADY when you start your training?

Again I would say this depends on type of training (for instance, how many soccer moms do you know training hard with weights and intrrval runs? I know almost zero) and the level of performance you want to push. Obviously nobody wants to be just “average” but many people work out in an average fashion and those people by and large don’t need to worry about timing issues. People pusning boundaries or two a days or camps (or bb shows :slight_smile: ), those people need more attention to specific detail.

#19

lean ground beef i will get some, and i would of never of thought to use george foreman grill for that =)

cheers

#20

Or you could run RFL