T Nation

Help with Estrogen Control


#1

Hey guys my marrige is falling apart no sex drive and i never had aromatizeing problems on any of my past cycles i am now 30 years old i have been getting labs twice a week and my estadial was 140 on week 4 of sustonon 250 pharma grade im living in mexico and i started taking arimidex 1 mg eod got it down to 24 skipped a few doses of srimidex so i wouldnt crash and it shot up to 118 just got it down to 29 but really having trouble with erections its hard to balance e2 with arimidex yesterday i think i may have crashed my estro im taking sustonon 250 sunday tues and 125mgs on thurs why in past cycles never had problems with gyno or estrogene and had supermans cock throughout entire long cycles and now its horrible whats happening im frantic i am pleading for urgent help i took a viagra 100mg lastnight i think it saved the realationship because banged my wife for a good two hours but my poor wife thinks im not attracted to her


#2

did she know’s about your relation with steroids and testosterone ? if not you should tell her everything and explain her that your body can’t get back to normal and it may take some times !


#3

Ok I have always wondered this, so this is me adding to your thread yet maybe helping as well.

With arimidex as I understand it the arimidex attached to the aromatase enzyme for it’s half life so about three days, then the body breaks down the arimidex and the enzyme is free. That lovely thing called estrogen rebound can happen and as I understand it it is this. Your body is producing the enzyme and releasing it. The day you take your arimidex it starts to attach to the enzyme and continues to do so until your body breaks it down. So let’s use some abstract numbers. Your body produces 100 enzymes a day, you take enough arimidex to attach to 500 enzymes. So for the next three days all of your enzymes are attached to arimidex for a total of 300 enzymes. (I know this is not how half lifes work but for this question I think it is sufficient). So on day four all those enzymes attached to the arimidex are now free plus the 100 your body produces on day four for a total of 400 enzymes. All those enzymes attack the test and your estrogen goes sky high. BAM estrogen rebound!! And we bloat like blow fish and we can make our own titty fuck videos if we shave and crop the frame real close.

The question I have always had is does your bodys loop respond fast enough to know that all those enzymes for the three day half life are infact not lowering the test level? Does your body respond fast enough that on day two or three it produces 110 enzymes? If so wouldn’t we have to up our arimidex on a steady dosage of test over the length of a cycle? I have never had to up my dosage of AI except when I increased my level of aromatizing compounds. Yet we all know our bodies do respond to the higher level of test on a cycle versus just natural production. If our bodies produce more enzyme to lower that 400 mgs a week versus natural production why wouldn’t they just keep increasing the enzyme production that we render inactive with AIs?

I realize my example is very basic and half life really means that half of it is broken down and there are always fluctuating levels of this and that. Also I wonder if the enzyme itself has a biological shelf life, does it break down if doesn’t attach to something like an AI or test within a certain time frame?

With that said or asked maybe the original poster of this thread might not be at that lowered level of estrogen long enough for things to go back to “ready to go.” I know if I let my estrogen get to high and I start holding water then I dose AI that usually that night I wake up with ironwood but I still hold the water for a few days, maybe he is at the other end of the spectrum and needs a few days for the drive to kick back in the way I still hold water for a few days. Also I take AI at bedtime not for any reason I just do. That timing might effect something.

For the original poster I would say relax and just keep a steady light dose of AI. For myself at 625 mgs of test a week I would be over .5 mgs every other day, maybe a .25 mgs on the days in between the .5 mg days. For a total of 2.25 mgs of arimidex a week but that’s me and my UGL brand arimidex so and I tend to need higher a dosage of AI.

Whatever you do, RELAX it is not going to instantly be better in five minutes. It takes a little time of playing with it to make it work. (Get it, “playing with it to make it work”)


#4

Thabk u for responding im just now learinign how to use this posting forums thing yes she knows everything i am completly honest with her about ecerything


#5

Yes she knows i told her everything im always honest withmy wife its just soo damn weird because my skin right now seems to be retaining water andi had a hatt on all day and took it off and now i see red line marked on my forehead which would indicate high estradial but yesterday it had to be crashed because it was 29 on thurs and i took 1mg of arimidex thursday mroning and .5 mgs of adex friday


#6

Wow thank u so much bro i appreciate what u said and something to deff keep in mind im really freaking out i told the farmacia down theblock to order me aromasin because im looseing hipe with arimidex they didnt have it on stock but thurs it will be here or sooner i am an idiot though i took today 1 mg of arimidex and a shot of sustonon but i was also thinking about lowering my test weekly maybe that would help not aromatize because i never in my life on 500mgs of test had sex drive or errection problems which means i didnt have estrogene problems im thinkinh of taking sust sunday and weds and sustonon does give stable blood levels ive prooven it because allfour esters are starting to release the moment you inject just that they release at different rates thats why they made sustonon ive heard so many people try and say they arent stableon sust but its a lie my total has been 2500-2990 on mon and thurs shots of sust aspen redijects 250mgs and a free of atleast 18 always or higher. My question is do u think that lowering my test dose will lessen estrogenic sides


#7

Saying you didn’t have issues on 500mgs a week is not accurate, you didn’t SHOW signs of high estrogen. That’s all.

I want to reiterate, it takes a steady dose of ANY AI to keep estrogen under control. Some folks including myself, originally, think/thought you just periodically dose an AI to lower the estrogen when it gets to high. No, you continually dose AI to keep estrogen levels in a optimal window or level. So really at any level of test we can just figure out what dose of AI keeps the estrogen from getting to high.

I believe you were saying that sustanon can produce steady release levels, yes it can. Pretty much with any ester it takes about five half lives of a steady dosage intake for the hormone being released from the ester to even out or get to a fairly stable release rate. So with sustanon I believe you would have to wait for the five half lives of the deconate ester to finally have a consistent release rate from all the esters, as long as you have a consistent stable inject schedule.

You asked about if lowering your dosage could lower estrogen side effects, yes and no. It will lower the amount of test that is available for the aromatase enzyme to break down into estrogen. However that doesn’t mean your side effects go away. You need to get to a stable and consistent hormone levels all around, consistent injection, consistent release from ester, consistent AI dosage, ect… I have read that DHT based hormones have an “natural” anti estrogen quality. I don’t know if that is the same with just natural or basic DHT or only the modified DHTs. So lowering your sustanon intake will lead to lower DHT levels and that might be counter productive with what you are trying to fix right now.

Aromasin is a different class of AI, the way it attaches to the enzyme it renders it dead. It doesn’t eventually release from the enzyme allowing the enzyme to then attach to the test. So no risk of estrogen rebound with aromasin. Also you need to know aromasin’s half life is 8-9 hours, arimidex is three days. You are going to have to play with your dosage level and schedule. It needs to be a consistent dosage, I prefer the low to high method. Start with half or 12.5 mgs every other day and monitor your estrogen. I think with aromasin your better bet would be to add in 6 mgs on your days you don’t take 12.5 mgs if needed because your estrogen is still high. Then increase if estrogen is still too high.

Since you are in Mexico (I am on the border and go down all the time for stuff) you could try adding in Proviron/mesterolone. It is actually the one that people use to combat Deca dick that happens from the progesterone nature of deca. The Proviron is a DHT based androgenic, it’s not really an anabolic but it’s still in the family. It is known to have a very nice sexual performance increase side effect. Infact most people take it for the side effect! It does work and is readily available in Mexico. It will also help harden you up, burn fat, and increase definition along with it’s natural anti estrogen quality. The old timers used it for anti estrogen before AIs were available.

So I am clear I am suggesting the Proviron to be taken along with a steady dose of AI, weather it be aromasin or arimidex.

I would stick with your test dosage that you have been running this cycle, then dial the AI in to that dosage. If you lower it while trying to dial in your AI eventually that long estered test from the earlier sustanon shots will drop while you are increasing the AI dosage, you won’t know until after you crash your estrogen. I am not sure if I am explaining it clearly but just stick with the same dosage that you started with and dial the AI to that level. Changing two things at once will make it more difficult to find equilibrium.

Once you find the dosage of AI that keeps you in the low normal range of estrogen then from that point it might take a few days for your issues to go away. If your issues don’t go away right away don’t keep changing stuff, let your body adjust to the steady dosage that puts you in the low normal range.

And FYI I know from experience that in a Mexican town on the border known for good pharmaceutical prices I was paying around 17 dollars for ten 25mg tablets of name brand Proviron. I went to a larger city and that price went to like 26 bucks. Keep in mind the exchange rate and this was about a month ago. My girlfriend is from Mexico and they still didn’t give me a better price in the larger city, so don’t pay too much I know they will even over charge the locals if they can. To be fair the girlfriend said that the little border town known for good prices is just because they want all the business from people hoping the border for deals. The bigger city isn’t for the tourist bargain Hunter.

If you add in Proviron one 25mg tablet a day should be good.


#8

Thank you for that man i have very few people down wherr i am that help with this sort of thing all that you said was clear and easy to understand bro i actually live on the belize border of mexico and frequently bounce around from going shopping here or in playa del carmen or cancun but ive been down here for sooo many years that the price rape thing has ended a few years ago ive got one more question so a few years ago i bought a shit load of hgh and was injecting about 3-4 mgs. Not ius of hgh daily i figuered out how many mgs were in each iu and i did 5on 2 off regimen i got my hgh tested a month ago now and i was in the very low normal range is it possible for hgh use to fuck natrual production i did have some strange side effects for example my skin on my ankles was permenantly colored brown like ten shades darker than regular skin color also i had a ultrasound on my legs to see about circulacion issues and the doctor was like your perfect with circulation but have four extra veins in each leg did the hgh grow new veins i have heard that hgh can fuck with the valvues on the veins


#9
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    Look at that where i injected never in years has that happend to me its a little spot of blood wtffff i never have seen that before what i think happend is i had a faulty pin and when I immediately noticed it because it was like air was entering into it and i pulled it right out after realizeing air was going in any comments am i guna be alright im a little bugged out lol its weird to see that the only thing close i had last week was yellow spot where i injected which also has never happend to me before i normally always do shoulders but i think im going to ass again because im. Getting nervous

#10

you sound like a fucking emotional wreck. you should probably stop using steroids…


#11

Flip has a point, relax.
Gonna respond to the picture, not sure what exactly your issue is. For the air bubble, that thing about injecting even a tiny air bubble can kill you is BS. If a tiny air bubble in the vein could kill then every scuba diver would die. The reason they have to come up from depth slowly is so their body can slowly release the air bubbles from the blood. So injecting a tiny bubble into your muscle is ok. Now don’t go inject a 5cc air bubble just because you want that last drop of test to make it in. What can kill you is a large amount of air into your vein directly. How large? I don’t fucking know I am not a doctor.
What that spot looks like to me is, your needle was dull and you didn’t hold it steady as you injected. With you moving it even a tiny bit as you injected that tore up the tissue around the site so now there is blood trapped there. I’d say don’t inject there for a while and monitor it. If it doesn’t go away or gets bigger then go see a doctor.

I hope this goes without saying, ALWAYS USE A NEW NEEDLE!!! Never reuse a needle. A vast majority of infections are from using old needles and a tiny piece of old dead cells or something else being injected deep into the muscle.

For you HGH question, I am just now at the point of starting my HGH experience. I am still in the reading and reading everything I can. I am just starting to look for sources. One thing I can share is fairly consistently I have seen that once you get up to around 12-16 iu’s a day the sites say you need to be using insulin with that much HGH. With you going 3-4 mgs and it’s fairly consistent of 3iu’s per mg you were 9-12iu’s. So you skin color issue might be something people with diabetes experience. I don’t know how it all works but I am just saying that for you to have another avenue to research. Like what are the signs associated with diabetes treatment or to much or too little insulin. Since there is a connection of HGH and insulin you might find the answer looking at diabetes information. O don’t know just a thought.
For the extra veins, I have read that one of the limiting factors with people’s earlier cycles is there veins are not developed yet. So as you do more cycles your veins develop but I think they just get bigger and can carry more blood. Growing extra veins sounds like you are on the cusp of developing super human powers or something.
For the low natural HGH levels, I don’t know. I have read that using HGH doesn’t lower your natural production but I think that is for therapeutic dosage like 2-5 iu’s. With you using 3-4 mgs without insulin you might have done something. Also do you KNOW you had actual HGH? A lot of Chinese generics tend to be HGC not HGH.
Alright I have responded so my conscience is forcing me to say this. You need to go read and read and read. Maybe some of the stuff I said might point you in a direction that leads to your answers maybe not.

I hope you find the answers and your health is ultimately in check. Good luck.


#12

Yes i agree super emotional i think its gotta do with the estrogen balanceing im dealig with but ya. And yes the hgh was either genotropin or siazen i buy all the stuff i use from farmacias legit here in mexico i would normally buy most at farmacias especializadas thats the best chain here for specialty products they have them in every major city in the country farmacia especializada its called and over the counter you can buy whatever you want except what they call groupo unos which is like oxicodona and shit like morfina and straight up the angiologo which means vien soecialist did a uktrsound on my legs and said i have four veins in each leg when normal people have two lol weird shit he look at me lik wtf