T Nation

Help With Doctor


Hello all, first let me say that when it comes to hormones and traning advice I trust you guys more that my own doctor. Here's my situation:

I had my blood tested two years ago because I was chronically fatigued. Here are the results:

T TOTAL = 339: 250-1100
T FREE = 65.1: 46.0-224.0
T BIOAVAIL = 147.9: 110-575.0
FSH = 2.1: 1.6-8.0
LH = 2.3: 1.5-9.3

At the time I was 33 years old. The T total was within range, but I asked the doc for testosterone cream. Immediately upon taking it I felt normal. Then a few days later I felt like crud again. I think what happened was that my E2 levels started to rise. Here's my second hormone test:

Vitamin D3 = 31: NOT ESTABLISHED
Vitamin D2 = <4: NOT ESTABLISHED
TSH, 3rd Generation = 0.75: .40-4.50
T4, Free 0.8: 0.8-1.8
T3, Free = 321: 230-420
DHT = 17L: 25-75
T Total = 78: 250-1100
T Free = 17.3: 46.0-224.0
T BIOAVAIL = 35.6: 110.0-575.0
Estradiol = 20: 13-54

At this point I had stopped the T cream because I couldn't afford it. My own natural T production hadn't kicked in so that's why the low T levels. In any case I took a third test (after using the cream consistently for a few months) and my total T levels where in the 600s, but my E2 jumped to 33! I told the doc that I need Armidex to prevent aromatization of the T. But he says I don't need that because the E2 is still within normal range. I told him that it was normal, but not normal for ME. I strongly suspect that until the E2 goes down I won't feel much better.

Right now I'm very emotional and confused mentally. I think it's because of the high E2.

My question....is there anyone that has a science or medical bacround that can help me explain this to my doc? He feels that just because some regular person posted this information about hormones on here that it doesn't mean squat. If I could get some authority to type something out then it would really help convince him of my need for Armidex. At this point, if he doesn't give it to me I'm going to find a dcotor that will. I've lost four jobs already due to fatuge and mental confusion, and he doesn't seem to think that my issue is urgent.


You are now spread over 4 threads dealing with your case. That is really not appreciated.

Ask your doc why he thinks that the normal lab distribution has anything to do with well being. Ask him what level is most beneficial [optimal]. Then offer the within normal value of E2=22pg/ml. Then tell him to try it with you and learn by your response.

If you have trouble with the cost of T cream, inject, that is least cost. Creams create the highest level of T-->E2.

Rx Arimidex/anastrozole will be too expensive for you, if you can't pay for it, what good is the Rx. Many in this situation are forced to self medicate and use non-Rx.

Have you read the stickies. The protocol for injections sticky and estradiol sticky probably have everything that we have to give.


That's called cross posting, right? That's now what I'm doing. I took your advice, finally got insurance, and wanted to get my hormone issue resolved once and for all. However, I need someone with good credentials to recommend advice so I can take it to my doc.

You're super knoweldgeable KSMan, but unless you're a medical professional all my doc is going to tell me is that everyone responds differently, and that this is just your opinion. I think this would be a good time to teach my doc the stuff that you guys know, and make him a better doctor. But you know how these educated types are...unless you have three degrees at the end of your name they think it's all nonsense.


We can't fix stupid.

It is not cross posting, but making it difficult to provide proper advice queries. We need your case in one thread.


So what do you suggest? Just pick another doc? What kills me is that everyone is different. You may respond a certain way when your hormones are out of whack, and I may respond another way. A few months ago when I did my last blood test he looks at my T levels and is like, "Well, everything looks fine." Then on my way out of his office he says, "Hey wait! Are you on HRT?"

I was like, "Um...yeah, you put me on it. Hello?" He looks at my chart and goes, "Oh yeah...that's right." Maybe I'm the stupid one and should take that as a hint and find someone else. What I did a few weeks ago was to get an appointment with an endocrinologist. It should be coming up a week from now. I just thought I could enlighten my primary doc since he's one of those Life Extension types that seems to be open to other things.


Print out the stickies (at least a couple of them) and take in to your doc. You're paying for the visit, have him read it. Print out Crisler's protocol, have him read it. It's from an "educated type", a doctor, that should convince him. It can be found at allthingsmale.com I believe.

He said what you need to emphasize most - just because you are in range, doesn't mean you feel OK. "Everyone is different", like he said. Just because someone else feels OK at the top or the bottom of the range doesn't mean you will, especially concerning E2.