Heavytriple's Journey to 500/600/700 at 198

@ryan
You make good points. I have no timetable for leanness, and I’ve been dieting since May. As dumb as this sounds, I’m going to continue cutting through my meet in December so long as I’m gaining strength. At that point I plan on reversing for a couple months and doing a longer accumulation phase. Annnnd I’ll be right back to cutting. I’m very happy with my progress, but I’m obsessed with getting truly lean. I feel too good about the way I look right now to stop while I’m still making good progress in strength and aesthetics.

@trivium
Really it’s both of the things you said. I bulked without regard to weight classes for years all the way up to 218, but I was fat and injury prone. I then realistically assessed my genetics, I.e. I looked at my relatives and parents and combined that data with my own feelings at different weights, and I came to the conclusion that I feel best around 200. And you can damn well hold a lot of muscle at a lean 200 at 5’10". On top of that, I really have no chance of competing at 220, so it all kind of fell into place.

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
@ryan
You make good points. I have no timetable for leanness, and I’ve been dieting since May. As dumb as this sounds, I’m going to continue cutting through my meet in December so long as I’m gaining strength. At that point I plan on reversing for a couple months and doing a longer accumulation phase. Annnnd I’ll be right back to cutting. I’m very happy with my progress, but I’m obsessed with getting truly lean. I feel too good about the way I look right now to stop while I’m still making good progress in strength and aesthetics.

@trivium
Really it’s both of the things you said. I bulked without regard to weight classes for years all the way up to 218, but I was fat and injury prone. I then realistically assessed my genetics, I.e. I looked at my relatives and parents and combined that data with my own feelings at different weights, and I came to the conclusion that I feel best around 200. And you can damn well hold a lot of muscle at a lean 200 at 5’10". On top of that, I really have no chance of competing at 220, so it all kind of fell into place.[/quote]

Just out of curiosity, what did you do about the injuries?

Not that I am as strong as you were when you were 218, but in the past year I have injured my right ACL, had a minor tear in my low back, messed up something small in my left shoulder, and now I feel that I may have reinjured my back. I was up to 220 at one point (pretty puffy/soft) when I hit my last set of PRs.

I have been going over form like a mofo, but I think it may have something to do with me trying to do too much in training sessions. They are at least two hours long (unless I start having pain) with an AMRAP set that I fail more often than I would like to admit.

What did you end up doing to minimze injuries, while still driving your numbers up?

I don’t mean to blow up your log, so I apologize for that.

It’s just that I am getting to the point where I am looking around T-Nation, and my own gym and seeing that none of the guys who are bigger/stronger than me train like I train.

[quote]trivium wrote:

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
@ryan
You make good points. I have no timetable for leanness, and I’ve been dieting since May. As dumb as this sounds, I’m going to continue cutting through my meet in December so long as I’m gaining strength. At that point I plan on reversing for a couple months and doing a longer accumulation phase. Annnnd I’ll be right back to cutting. I’m very happy with my progress, but I’m obsessed with getting truly lean. I feel too good about the way I look right now to stop while I’m still making good progress in strength and aesthetics.

@trivium
Really it’s both of the things you said. I bulked without regard to weight classes for years all the way up to 218, but I was fat and injury prone. I then realistically assessed my genetics, I.e. I looked at my relatives and parents and combined that data with my own feelings at different weights, and I came to the conclusion that I feel best around 200. And you can damn well hold a lot of muscle at a lean 200 at 5’10". On top of that, I really have no chance of competing at 220, so it all kind of fell into place.[/quote]

Just out of curiosity, what did you do about the injuries?

Not that I am as strong as you were when you were 218, but in the past year I have injured my right ACL, had a minor tear in my low back, messed up something small in my left shoulder, and now I feel that I may have reinjured my back. I was up to 220 at one point (pretty puffy/soft) when I hit my last set of PRs.

I have been going over form like a mofo, but I think it may have something to do with me trying to do too much in training sessions. They are at least two hours long (unless I start having pain) with an AMRAP set that I fail more often than I would like to admit.

What did you end up doing to minimze injuries, while still driving your numbers up?[/quote]
I’m not sure the length of the session is a big deal if a lot of that is rest.

I would say get your mobility in order. The best thing I did for myself was start reading everything I could about injuries that were similar to my own, their rehab, and how to go about preventing them in the future. Not to sound like a broken record, but Kelly Starrett’s stuff is great.

But it’s important to understand that you are your own therapist. You need to try on a lot of shoes, so to speak, and keep the ones that fit. My current mobility routine is the product of lots of trial and error, and everything I keep in it is meant to address my specific issues. Nothing is erroneous or wasted time. This requires self awareness on your part and a scientific approach.

The second and probably more important thing I did was get my diet in order. You will heal better and especially feel better when you are lean. More fat means more inflammation, and you don’t want to start that downward spiral. You’ve probably maxed out the benefit of the all out bulk at this point, so now it’s time to start figuring out your baseline calories, what foods agree with you, etc. the sooner you get that figured, the better. From there you can be precise in how you diet in different training phases.

I wouldn’t advocate attempting an accumulation mesocycle while cutting like I am now, but this is the bed I’ve made by letting myself get so fat in the first place.

9/26

Modified Sumo
505x1,1,1

Conventional
505x1

Bench
315x10
330x10 (PR)
315x10

Wide Neutral Pull-up
+20x10,10,15

Just had no urgency in there. Probably feeling the effects of lifting 6x while dieting.

9/28

Pause Squat
415x3x3

Stiff-DL
445x8

Had to jet after that…had a client move on me. Going to try 455x8x3 next time on sdl, which should be sufficiently miserable.

9/29

Bench
365x5,5,5,5,7
All paused, with the first 3 on the AMAP set being a little dicey. Definite PR though, and I think I had 8 if I was fresh. Huge volume PR at that weight, too.

Pull-up
+20x15x3

DB Pullover to Press
65x10x3
Supersetted with pull-ups

Bent Lateral
25x15x3
Constant tension, top 3/4 of movement

Can’t believe how easy 365 feels these days. Will do an AMAP at 375 next week, then back down and do volume at a lighter weight. Did a jog/walk mile after this. Man I’m out of shape. But I think I can get sub-7 minutes eventually.

10/1

Squat
445x3,2,3
Felt good. Got lazy with my technique on the second set and had a bad couple of reps. Could have forced a third, but instead I came back focused and did an easy 3 on the third set.

Wide grip DL
425x3
435x1,1,3

Sprints (4)

Had a weird issue on deadlift that I also had Saturday…kept feeling like I was going to pass out as I lowered the weight in a controlled eccentric. Determined I was taking too big a breath in a val salva to try and tighten my ever loosening belt. Took a small breath on that last set and had no issues, so I guess it’s time to drill a new hole.

I’m staring at the man in the 'mire-ror.

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
10/1

Squat
445x3,2,3
Felt good. Got lazy with my technique on the second set and had a bad couple of reps. Could have forced a third, but instead I came back focused and did an easy 3 on the third set.

Wide grip DL
425x3
435x1,1,3

Sprints (4)

Had a weird issue on deadlift that I also had Saturday…kept feeling like I was going to pass out as I lowered the weight in a controlled eccentric. Determined I was taking too big a breath in a val salva to try and tighten my ever loosening belt. Took a small breath on that last set and had no issues, so I guess it’s time to drill a new hole.[/quote]

The increased pressure can do a couple things. Interfere with blood return to the heart as well as add too much pressure and cause vasodilation and make your brain not get enough oxygen

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
10/1

Squat
445x3,2,3
Felt good. Got lazy with my technique on the second set and had a bad couple of reps. Could have forced a third, but instead I came back focused and did an easy 3 on the third set.

Wide grip DL
425x3
435x1,1,3

Sprints (4)

Had a weird issue on deadlift that I also had Saturday…kept feeling like I was going to pass out as I lowered the weight in a controlled eccentric. Determined I was taking too big a breath in a val salva to try and tighten my ever loosening belt. Took a small breath on that last set and had no issues, so I guess it’s time to drill a new hole.[/quote]

The increased pressure can do a couple things. Interfere with blood return to the heart as well as add too much pressure and cause vasodilation and make your brain not get enough oxygen[/quote]
Assumed it was something along those lines. It’s never been an issue because my belt has never been this loose.

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
10/1

Squat
445x3,2,3
Felt good. Got lazy with my technique on the second set and had a bad couple of reps. Could have forced a third, but instead I came back focused and did an easy 3 on the third set.

Wide grip DL
425x3
435x1,1,3

Sprints (4)

Had a weird issue on deadlift that I also had Saturday…kept feeling like I was going to pass out as I lowered the weight in a controlled eccentric. Determined I was taking too big a breath in a val salva to try and tighten my ever loosening belt. Took a small breath on that last set and had no issues, so I guess it’s time to drill a new hole.[/quote]

The increased pressure can do a couple things. Interfere with blood return to the heart as well as add too much pressure and cause vasodilation and make your brain not get enough oxygen[/quote]
Assumed it was something along those lines. It’s never been an issue because my belt has never been this loose.[/quote]

They are actually kinda cool phenomenon maybe not when lifting almost a quart ton

As to the question in my log. I know you are liking where you are at and really havent seen massive issues because of an extended diet since you most likely did it right… take a Reverse slow maybe 20c on lifting days and low day each day for a week and see how you feel and look. Another 20 next week if weight is semi stable and you look good. Weight or your look diminishes too much told for a week and reevaluate after a couple 2-4 bumps like that your up 320-640cals total for each day then slow down the bumps to 10 and 10. You can normally be a bit more aggressive at the start and then have to slow. Even raising cals 500 without fat gain then starting a re diet and slowly working back down will give you some added working room. Ideally you can get up 750-1000 with minimal fat for lots of extra room to come back

10/2

Incline Bench
330x5,5,6
Definite PR, there.

Push Press
235x5x2
Form got really bad on that second set, so I didn’t do a third.

Wide barbell row
355x10x3

10/3

Hang Clean
135x3x2
185x2

High-bar squat
415x5
415x5
375x5

Out. First set of squat was a struggle, so I basically summoned every bit of focus I had to get that second set and do it well. 5 was about all I had at 375 after that. High bar squats really improving, but man I’m gassing.

Thanks for the detailed responses man!

^^^Np, boss

10/4

Sumo DL
515x1,2

Conventional
505x1,2

Bench
335x10
335x10
315x10
First set was cake, other two not so much.

Pull-up
+40x12x3

10/6

Pause Squat
425x3x3

Smoked the second and third sets, first one was a little off with technique. Definite PRs. However, had no time for anything else. And the reason for that is because I had skyline the day before. NEVER HAVE SKYLINE BEFORE DOING HEAVY ACTIVITY. I’ll leave it at that. Will get the stiff deadlifts in weds.

Oh, and I went skydiving Sunday. NBD

Got a question for ya, since you are a pretty decent bencher: Do you have a good idea of how “strong” each of your primary muscle groups for the BP (anterior delts, pecs, triceps) are “separately”? I know it is not easy to single that stuff out but any ideas/guestimates? Like, e.g., shoulder presses (delts), triceps PD, etc…cheers.

^^^interesting question. Probably obvious from my avatar, but I’m very pec dominant. My pecs are pretty big and I don’t do anything for them but bench. I’ve done flyes with around 80 or something…been a long time. Db presses with 150s easily. I’ve strict pressed 252 a couple years ago when I trained it for a few months, but I’m not overly fond of it.

Db shoulder presses up to 120s, but that’s another lift I never train for an extended period. I’ve been doing circus db presses strict with 100+…that I like. Pressdowns are tough to generalize because they always feel different on different cable systems. But I do pullover extensions with 70s, which is a better triceps exercise anyway because the triceps extend the shoulder in addition to the elbow.

10/7

Bench
375x6,7 (PR)
375x5x3p
Mostly tng on the 6 and 7 sets, but big pr there. Previous best was 5.

Pull-up
+90x7
+40x12x2

Pullover/press
70s x8x3

LISS cardio

10/8

Squat
455x3,2
435x4
Solid. Much easier than when I peaked at that weight on my last mesocycle.

RDL/SDL
455x8x2

Sledgehammer
X20x4 (30s rest)

It was 3 sets of DL or HIIT, so I went with the latter. Closed my feet up a little and felt much better on squat. Depth still really needs work.

[quote]HeavyTriple wrote:
^^^interesting question. Probably obvious from my avatar, but I’m very pec dominant. My pecs are pretty big and I don’t do anything for them but bench. I’ve done flyes with around 80 or something…been a long time. Db presses with 150s easily. I’ve strict pressed 252 a couple years ago when I trained it for a few months, but I’m not overly fond of it.

Db shoulder presses up to 120s, but that’s another lift I never train for an extended period. I’ve been doing circus db presses strict with 100+…that I like. Pressdowns are tough to generalize because they always feel different on different cable systems. But I do pullover extensions with 70s, which is a better triceps exercise anyway because the triceps extend the shoulder in addition to the elbow.
[/quote]

Yeah, interesting but too hard to pin down exactly. However, from what you say it seems that your higher bench can be explained by being a bit stronger across all three muscle groups rather evenly. Cheers.

Do you train in the same gym as Pete Rubish? Noticed the same weird bench in one his vids…

^^^possibly. I would argue the converse, but there’s no way of really knowing. My bench has gone up more in the last year from minimizing assistance and increasing frequency than it ever has before, though.

10/9

Incline Bench
340x5x3
So hard.

Wide BB Row
365x10x3

Strict Press
185, 195, 205, 215x5

All my smack talking about strict pressing and here I am doing it again. Felt really good, too. I’ve gained strength on it since I last trained it 18 months ago, which furthers my belief that my bench is the primary driver of my oh strength. I did this because I didn’t have the energy to do push press lolllll. I was completely wiped.

10/10

Power Clean
205x2
215x2
225x2x2
Best hip snap I’ve ever had here.

High-bar Squat
425x5
455x3(medium bar)
425x5

Did 455 again because my depth was garbage on weds and I wanted to try it with a higher bar placement. Huuuuge improvement. Will stay with this bar placement since I get nothing out of going low bar except more forward lean.

DIET NOTE
I’ve been getting incredibly run down as I move away from the Sunday refeed lately, so I decided to add a second, more controlled refeed on thurs night. Added about 175g carbs in the form of kids’ cereal, AKA the world’s best thing in the history of ever. I can’t even explain how much this helped. That’s one of the reasons I did 455 again…haven’t had a chance to squat (heavy) carbed up in a long time

MOBILITY STUFF
Still working the crap out of my hip flexors. The left side is the real problem child. Added a loaded hold for 30s in the deepest squat possible. Need to start stretching the calves to help there, but the main issue is my immobility in external rotation of the femur. It’s definitely improving, but as is evident in the video, I’m a long a way from a convincingly deep squat. And currently the video is as low as I can physically go under load.

[quote]infinite_shore wrote:
Do you train in the same gym as Pete Rubish? Noticed the same weird bench in one his vids…[/quote]
Sure do. His wife is from here and he just relocated recently. He just bought some Ivanko plates because ours were too fat for him, haha. He was getting a few inches extra of whip in his deadlift bar before breaking the floor because the weights went so wide.

10/11

Modified Sumo
525x1,1,3
20-lb PR since I never pull triples.

Conventional
505x3
10-lb conventional PR

Bench
340x10
340x10
320x10
10R PR. These really suck, srs.

Pull-up
+45x10,12,15

Sled
230x4 rounds, 10 minutes of HIIT in total.

So clearly the second refeed was a big help. Felt better on DL in terms of energy than I have in months. This is a long damn training day every week, but I like having no time constrictions on my Saturdays in the gym.

1st MESO is now done. Hit rep PRs across the board in the short time frame. Have a good idea where I’m going with the next phase, but need to iron out some details.