T Nation

He Should Have Gotten Life!

[quote]jp_dubya wrote:
orion wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
Is there anyone that is really opposed to this guy forfeiting his life for this crime?

Sure, me.

The death penallty costs more than life time imprisonment and I do not trust government with that kind of power.

It does? How so and how much so?[/quote]

http://www.fnsa.org/v1n1/dieter1.html

"or the states which employ the death penalty, this luxury comes at a high price. In Texas, a death penalty case costs taxpayers an average of $2.3 million, about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years.(3)

In Florida, each execution is costing the state $3.2 million.(4) In financially strapped California, one report estimated that the state could save $90 million each year by abolishing capital punishment.(5) The New York Department of Correctional Services estimated that implementing the death penalty would cost the state about $118 million annually.(6)

Whether the death penalty constitutes a reasonable effort to prevent crime is considered from an economic standpoint. Resources directed toward this form of selective, legitimized killing of human beings are not available for crime prevention methodologies proven for their effectiveness. The death penalty not only fails as a solution to the problem of violence in the United States but, because of the excessive costs of implementation, capital punishment interferes with a spectrum of preventive programs that have been demonstrated to work well."

[quote]billy martin wrote:
LET THE PUNISHMENT FIT THE CRIME. PUT HIM THROUGH EVERYTHING SHE WENT THROUGH THEN KILL HIM AND RECESITATE HIM AND REPEAT THE PROCESS OVER AND OVER.OR IF THEY JUST HANG THESE SICK FUCKS FROM A POLE IT MAY MAKE PEOPLE THINK TWICE.[/quote]

This guy raped a little girl and buried her alive.

What makes you think he could be stopped by a threat of violence? If he is a true psychopath, he lives in a universe where he does not expect anything else.

It is like threatening a fish to throw him into the water.

A legal system can not be tuned to be just in a single case, it must be just for a broad spectrum of cases. Death penalty is irreversible.
But it is your legal system so it doesn’t bother me that much.

[quote]orion wrote:
billy martin wrote:
LET THE PUNISHMENT FIT THE CRIME. PUT HIM THROUGH EVERYTHING SHE WENT THROUGH THEN KILL HIM AND RECESITATE HIM AND REPEAT THE PROCESS OVER AND OVER.OR IF THEY JUST HANG THESE SICK FUCKS FROM A POLE IT MAY MAKE PEOPLE THINK TWICE.

This guy raped a little girl and buried her alive.

What makes you think he could be stopped by a threat of violence? If he is a true psychopath, he lives in a universe where he does not expect anything else.

It is like threatening a fish to throw him into the water.

[/quote]
Never said it would stop him…he would be killed but in a way that would fit his crime times 3. get the ropes and the telephone poles ready…“lets start cleaning”.

[quote]orion wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
orion wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
Is there anyone that is really opposed to this guy forfeiting his life for this crime?

Sure, me.

The death penallty costs more than life time imprisonment and I do not trust government with that kind of power.

It does? How so and how much so?

http://www.fnsa.org/v1n1/dieter1.html

"or the states which employ the death penalty, this luxury comes at a high price. In Texas, a death penalty case costs taxpayers an average of $2.3 million, about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years.(3)

In Florida, each execution is costing the state $3.2 million.(4) In financially strapped California, one report estimated that the state could save $90 million each year by abolishing capital punishment.(5) The New York Department of Correctional Services estimated that implementing the death penalty would cost the state about $118 million annually.(6)

Whether the death penalty constitutes a reasonable effort to prevent crime is considered from an economic standpoint. Resources directed toward this form of selective, legitimized killing of human beings are not available for crime prevention methodologies proven for their effectiveness. The death penalty not only fails as a solution to the problem of violence in the United States but, because of the excessive costs of implementation, capital punishment interferes with a spectrum of preventive programs that have been demonstrated to work well."

[/quote]

Yes. Perpetrators have rights and, despite a mountain of evidence against them, they should have every right to use every possible legal appeal, to cause taxpayers to spend millions of dollars. Afterall, it is the evil society that made them do their heinous crimes; individual choice is a myth.

[quote]kaaleppi wrote:
A legal system can not be tuned to be just in a single case, it must be just for a broad spectrum of cases. Death penalty is irreversible.
But it is your legal system so it doesn’t bother me that much.
[/quote]
An eye for an eye…If they don’t have respect for life then we won’t respect theirs.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
orion wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
orion wrote:
jp_dubya wrote:
Is there anyone that is really opposed to this guy forfeiting his life for this crime?

Sure, me.

The death penallty costs more than life time imprisonment and I do not trust government with that kind of power.

It does? How so and how much so?

http://www.fnsa.org/v1n1/dieter1.html

"or the states which employ the death penalty, this luxury comes at a high price. In Texas, a death penalty case costs taxpayers an average of $2.3 million, about three times the cost of imprisoning someone in a single cell at the highest security level for 40 years.(3)

In Florida, each execution is costing the state $3.2 million.(4) In financially strapped California, one report estimated that the state could save $90 million each year by abolishing capital punishment.(5) The New York Department of Correctional Services estimated that implementing the death penalty would cost the state about $118 million annually.(6)

Whether the death penalty constitutes a reasonable effort to prevent crime is considered from an economic standpoint. Resources directed toward this form of selective, legitimized killing of human beings are not available for crime prevention methodologies proven for their effectiveness. The death penalty not only fails as a solution to the problem of violence in the United States but, because of the excessive costs of implementation, capital punishment interferes with a spectrum of preventive programs that have been demonstrated to work well."

Yes. Perpetrators have rights and, despite a mountain of evidence against them, they should have every right to use every possible legal appeal, to cause taxpayers to spend millions of dollars. Afterall, it is the evil society that made them do their heinous crimes; individual choice is a myth.

[/quote]

yes, perpetrators have rights too, but that is not the point.

The point is that you have to be really sure and if it has to be the death penalty and that costs money.

That money is wasted on lawyers, uses scarce resources like the time of judges and could be spent more efficiently otherwise.

I really question the determination of the pricing estimates.

It’s like asking PETA to do a cost based comparison between a vegetarian diet and a non-vegetarian diet.

I’d need to see a TON of detail before I’d start to believe it.

[quote]vroom wrote:
I really question the determination of the pricing estimates.

It’s like asking PETA to do a cost based comparison between a vegetarian diet and a non-vegetarian diet.

I’d need to see a TON of detail before I’d start to believe it.[/quote]

I think the cost of execution all stems from the condemned’s ability to appeal. Legal fees are extremely exorbitant and I would imagine each year of imprisonment to be cheaper than paying the system for his defense year after year–not to mention the expense of carrying out a humane execution.

I think this would probably not be the case if the condemned was taken directly to the gallows from the courthouse after sentencing. A rope and a pole are relatively cheap–but then again with a system where so many people are wrongly convicted it would be unfair.

I would rather see him in gen. population without protective custody. Death is the easy way out

[quote]Rocky101 wrote:
I would rather see him in gen. population without protective custody. Death is the easy way out[/quote]

If you read the detailed story of what the guy did to that little girl…blood everywhere, her calling for her mom, her little voice pleading ‘Please let me go home!’, clutching her little toy dolphin while being buried alive…
(all related by the Couey cretin)

…that’s why he should get life; and as you say, in gen population.

I’d almost envy the con who gets to ram the wooden end of a toilet plunger up this guy’s ass. The more the better, the harder the better.

I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow. If he goes into general population, he’ll be killed. I he got released, he’d be killed. Actually, his best chance for living the longest is on death-row. Ironic, huh? Me personally, I’d sentence him to life in a cell block full of gay, psychotic ass-rapists. I figure, he’d rather die then get ass-raped on a daily basis; I know I would. Lethal injection is to kind for this motherfucker. They should release him to the girl’s family. Now that would save the tax payer’s some money.

[quote]pat36 wrote:
I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow. If he goes into general population, he’ll be killed. I he got released, he’d be killed. Actually, his best chance for living the longest is on death-row. Ironic, huh? Me personally, I’d sentence him to life in a cell block full of gay, psychotic ass-rapists. I figure, he’d rather die then get ass-raped on a daily basis; I know I would. Lethal injection is to kind for this motherfucker. They should release him to the girl’s family. Now that would save the tax payer’s some money.[/quote]

To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!

[quote]pat36 wrote:
I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow.
[/quote]
I feel the same way. I hate the idea of execution because it just seems so Medieval. On the other hand, we have guys dying on the other side of the planet who are so much better than this person it would be hard for me to feel any grief for his “suffering”.

I think execution isn’t really a punishment because all it does is reinforce self-pity. The death penalty is just a way to rid the country of psychopathic killers and retards. Real punishment, as you suggest, would involve residence in general population and a good lesson in “Social Darwinism”.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!
[/quote]
Are you the type that would buy $1000 worth of lottery tickets hoping for a “winner”? That is just CREEPY.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
pat36 wrote:
I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow. If he goes into general population, he’ll be killed. I he got released, he’d be killed. Actually, his best chance for living the longest is on death-row. Ironic, huh? Me personally, I’d sentence him to life in a cell block full of gay, psychotic ass-rapists. I figure, he’d rather die then get ass-raped on a daily basis; I know I would. Lethal injection is to kind for this motherfucker. They should release him to the girl’s family. Now that would save the tax payer’s some money.

To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!

[/quote]

If I had to do it, I’d rather do it with my bare hands. Which then my preference would be to break every bone in his body and chuck him back in his cell to heal. Death is to kind for this motherfucker. There is no hell hot enough in my opinion.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!

Are you the type that would buy $1000 worth of lottery tickets hoping for a “winner”? That is just CREEPY.[/quote]

Wanting to be the one to execute a monster who did such things to a little girl is ‘creepy’? Hell, I’d consider it an HONOR.

[quote]pat36 wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
pat36 wrote:
I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow. If he goes into general population, he’ll be killed. I he got released, he’d be killed. Actually, his best chance for living the longest is on death-row. Ironic, huh? Me personally, I’d sentence him to life in a cell block full of gay, psychotic ass-rapists. I figure, he’d rather die then get ass-raped on a daily basis; I know I would. Lethal injection is to kind for this motherfucker. They should release him to the girl’s family. Now that would save the tax payer’s some money.

To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!

If I had to do it, I’d rather do it with my bare hands. Which then my preference would be to break every bone in his body and chuck him back in his cell to heal. Death is to kind for this motherfucker. There is no hell hot enough in my opinion.
[/quote]

If I won that lottery I’d hand my ticket to the girl’s father along with a bat. Justice in my opinion.

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Wanting to be the one to execute a monster who did such things to a little girl is ‘creepy’? Hell, I’d consider it an HONOR.
[/quote]
Personally, I don’t like the idea of ending someone’s life no matter what the circumstances. Defending one’s own life, though necessary at times, doesn’t always have to involve death either.

[quote]hedo wrote:
pat36 wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
pat36 wrote:
I really don’t see why money is an issue in the discussion. I, myself, am agaist the death penalty, but so few people are actually executed that it is a low concern for me. Trust me, I am not going to protest for this asshole and I won’t shed a blue tear when he gets his. Anywhere he goes it’s pretty much a death sentence anyhow. If he goes into general population, he’ll be killed. I he got released, he’d be killed. Actually, his best chance for living the longest is on death-row. Ironic, huh? Me personally, I’d sentence him to life in a cell block full of gay, psychotic ass-rapists. I figure, he’d rather die then get ass-raped on a daily basis; I know I would. Lethal injection is to kind for this motherfucker. They should release him to the girl’s family. Now that would save the tax payer’s some money.

To help pay for his execution, they should sell lottery tickets — winner gets to flip the switch or push the button. That would be SWEET!

If I had to do it, I’d rather do it with my bare hands. Which then my preference would be to break every bone in his body and chuck him back in his cell to heal. Death is to kind for this motherfucker. There is no hell hot enough in my opinion.

If I won that lottery I’d hand my ticket to the girl’s father along with a bat. Justice in my opinion.

[/quote]

In Saudi Arabia, the father of a victim has the right to step forward during the execution and demand the sword. If he botches the swing repeatedly, the pro will finish the job.
I read in a report about SA’s best known Headsman (they wrote he’s famous for his elegant technique, no kidding) that he’s generally reluctant about this right, cause relatives tend to “make it messy”.

I wonder if they do it on purpose!?
Some guys here will probably know that I’m against death penalty for reasons Orion already summed up (too costly, too many mistakes) but I give Saudi Arabia props about the Ceremony.
In my ideal state, where there are no judicial mistakes, the (cheap) death penalty would be exactly this: beheading.

I’m against any sort of machinery killing people. For me, that’s wrong in essence. If society thinks someone has to die, they better do it with their own hands. No gassing, poisoning, or guillotining.