Yep, just keep working with it. Did you happen to get a DHEA-S level? I ask because I toggle between a month of Hcg monotherapy followed by a month of Androgel, and I seem to get higher T levels during Hcg months where my DHEA-S levels came back higher. They were never below or above normal, and I don’t have enough testing points to confirm a relationship to how I personally respond, but it’s enough to prompt me to now for the first time be taking a DHEA supplement while on Hcg. Thanks.
This intertesticular aromatization thing never made sense to me. If you’re taking just enough HCG to produce healthy T levels, it should be no different than high enough LH levels to product healthy T levels. Reduce dose until you get to the minimum dose to produce the desired effect.
You’re bringing down E2 levels with an AI. It really doesn’t matter where the aromatization happens. You may be stopping aromatization in some tissues where it’s necessary and healthy, but it’s not like it’s insanely out of whack and you have to take large dose AI. Take just enough HCG to get the desired effect and you shouldn’t have to worry about enough AI to cause issues elsewhere.
I’ve done T with barely enough HCG to keep my balls full and dangling, and HCG only. At the same T levels, I required the same AI dose.
E2 - LH vs. HCG
25mg Clomid 2x Weekly, 10mg Aromasin ED = 33 pg/ml
125IU HCG ED, 25mg Aromasin 3x weekly = 27 pg/ml
T levels were nearly identical. I used slightly more Aromasin while on HCG and got slightly less E2.
Point is that HCG should a similar effect to healthy LH levels.
Interesting stuff, dhickey. Most of the time people are using Adex as their A.I. where as it seems you prefer Aromasin. These do act in a somewhat different manner. What influence do you think this has on your findings?
I used Aromasin because it is reported to work with Clomid a bit better. I’m back on anastrozole, primarily because it’s cheaper. I still have some Aromasin left. I might compare and contrast with my current protocol.
I’ve probably got this wrong, but this is my understanding of the A.I. mechanisms at work.
Arimidex blocks the enzyme that causes fat to aromitize testosterone into estrogen by blocking the receptors directly.
Aromasin binds to the enzyme that causes aromitization and makes it inactive until it’s metabolized.
I’m not sure what difference it makes in practice, but it may have some effect. If I’ve got this wrong, I’m happy to have someone set me straight. It’s just how I’ve got it organized in my head.
So I guess I’m an over-responder to everything.
For the last couple months I’ve been on a consistent schedule.
600 iu HCG per week
125mg test Cyp per week
1/2 mg liquid adex per week
The HCG and test are 2 shots a week. The adex is 3-4 drops per day.
I’ve been feeling pretty damned good. My workouts are going well. Recovery is like it’s never been. I’m putting some good muscle on. I have noticed some sore joints, but not too bad. Libido has been strong and performing well.
Honestly, I’ve been kinda suspecting I was running a bit high. Everything was just a little too good. At one point I got a bloody nose and my blood was very red. Just a clue.
Anyway, my bloods came back a tick over 2000 ng/dl. E2 was 11. H crit was 49. I have a ton of free test. Oops.
I’m taking 10 days of no test or adex, just HCG on the normal schedule. I figure that should allow my body to burn through 1 1/2-life of the test and then I’ll start back up.
I’m going to cut the test in 1/2 and drop the adex. We’ll see where that puts me in a month or two.
I know someone said 125 mg might be a little much, but I didn’t expect quite that strong of a reaction. My test is from a UGL, so it could be over-dosed. That’s not unheard of.
I am surprised my estrogen was that low with no strong reactions. Oddly, maybe, I think I feel better at 11 than 29. It’s probably more a function of the test, though.
Anyway, just thought I’d check in.