T Nation

HCG Monotherapy for Secondary

Hello. Many of you know me - I’m 30 years old with suboptimal T and symptoms. Seems the problem is in my pituitary, LH and FSH are low. My prolactin is high and I’ve been taking caber almost a month very small dosages, so the prolactin goes slowly down.

I’m working now on improving my lifestyle but I think it won’t be enough to fix T. I tried small dosage of clomid but could not tolerate it well - gave me ED, anxiety and even lower energy. Which is strange because my estradiol is quite low.

I’m considering HCG monotherapy. I could not uderstand does it shut down HPTA and decrease pituitary activity?

What happens if I start it, cannot tolerate it well and stop?

I still do not have kids and this is why I wanna exhaust and try all other options before TRT. Also I’m worried from the hematocrit side effect of TRT.

About HCG I heard some people can have similar side effects like clomid more estrogenic in nature…

Also I guess there is a way to handle this but in what dosages it is sold in USA? In my country I find only 5000 UI dosages, and I see a standard protocol is 250 UI EOD.

Forum here is very quite.
I am an athlete I have lean body very well shaped, workout everyday and it’s not enough, so as you said it won’t be enough if you have issues.

I just started hcg alone, dr told me 2500iu twice a week thank for for this forum I went to 250iu !!! Yes remove omen zero one shot every other day (EOD) managed to increase T from 10 to 16 (9-27 range) yet estradiol went to 23, I have done some test on my self and noticed when I reach 15 libido increase like crazy. So I understand I need AI ( to lower estrogen) trying to get my hand on that still couldn’t find it.

Also monitor psa as I understood hcg may effect it just in case. Some people say varicocele could be the reason why our body having low testosterone. Do you have varicocele ?

I dont think i have varicocele.

My pituitary has slight deffect and seems to be not functioning properly enough. How, when and why it happened - seems nobody can tell.

But my negative feedback loop of the HPTA seems to be fucked up.

When I started clomid test immediately increased but the side effects were fucking me big time and I stopped it.

No one uses clomid it’s like the worst thing you can try I tried it long time back very bad side affect.
I am doing hcg for the first time now my only concern is prostate I hope psa doesn’t get affected by this i Read some people saying it may do, I will monitor and slowly increase it with time.

Ive read here about people who have improved on clomid. It works for some folks

Do you have any feedback from the HCG or it is too soon yet?

Unfortunately what Ive read is that it can often improve numbers but not fix the symptoms anywhere near the way testosterone will fix them

I just started, first week, I am not sure about if it fix numbers only, I have thread here “my trt/hcg journey” all numbers there.

I will stay using 250iu for the next week and take blood test weekly.

I think I can’t tell if it will improve or not until I fix my estrogen level as i noticed libido increase a lot when I reach 15pg.
Some say this is very low but dr rand McClain “check YouTube” says he keep his patient in 15-20 pg I am trying to get an appointment with him doing my papers.

I will keep posting here updates to see where would I go with this

I also think this estrogen is very low. Do you take AI? My estrogen is around 18-20 and I want to increase it altogether with the T.

So I can monitor your progress eventhough what you experience doesnt mean I will experience the same.

So you have not experienced anything since you started? Increase or decrease in libido, energy, mood?
Also do you know if this treatment is gonna shutbdown or decrease your natural LH production?

Ok, I just woke up with the strongest morning wood ever, :slight_smile:
After one week or hcg, regarding fsh and lh they went down after starting hcg usually I am around 5 both are 2 now. I will conti using it for the second week and report progress until now strong morning wood.

For the estrogen as I mentioned I have been below 20 maybe 18 all my life I am in very good shape workout everyday dr rand McClain says he always keep his patient between 15-20 check YouTube I have an appointment with him but after two month from now I will see what he says I never used anything no AI nothing first time I use something to o enhance T is this week which is HCG alone.

Im very skeptica to doctors who follow strict numbers. That seems absurd bro. Eveybody has different needs for test, estrogen and almost everything. The good doctors tackle the symptoms not the numbers.

This is good you have improved libido. You say lh and fsh are being suprressed. But have you not researched whether this treatment is commiting like TRT and is it possible to stop it and go to base numbers?

We will see he supposed to be one of the hot shots not a regular doctor.
Regarding lh and fsh I don’t really care if they shut down I can restart but I read that it’s not the hcg which shut them down it is the increase in estrogen and testosterone which does it so you have to be carful not to take high dose of hcg.
Question is will it shut down with time ? Or lh receptors stop responding ? That’s I don’t know

Ok I see.

Yes question is whether it will shut down in time like with TRT because with clomid for example they are not shutting down

Yes but clomid is not good this is what i read someone also said it damages DNA not sure about that but I am sure it’s not good

The increase in T and E levels will suppress LH/FSH levels, but I doubt with such a low dose like 250iu would suppress it to undetectable levels. If you go higher like >1000iu eod it’ll be more likely for LH/FSH to go below 1. Now if your balls were dead then hCG would have no affect on LH/FSH.

Me personally I felt way better on just hCG than trt or trt + hCG. Most people I know felt better with trt + hCG than just trt.

What was your dosage ? And how long have you been on it ? I am on 250iu EOD and reached 16 (9-27 range) testosterone
Worried about estrogen as it went up a bit to 23pg

I hear mostly the opposite feedback, many people feel better on TRT than TRT + HCG.

Also dr Keith Nichols has told me in his practice HCG alone rarely fixes most low t symptoms

Well my dose is a bit higher since I’m attempting a restart, going off 20ish months of trt and aas, so doing 1000iu e3d for a couple weeks, get blood tests and if it’s good I’ll taper and then go on serms. I tried going to serms without a post trt hCG phase, I did a couple 250-350iu shots after trt, thought since I used it during trt I didn’t need it but it didn’t go so well. Probably 1 more week or 2 at this dose and drop it down to 500iu e3d then 250iu, or might just drop it all and go to serms if my T is good. I can say that my balls are significantly bigger than they were a year ago before I added hCG, but most of the size came from when I started the high dose hCG. Had two ultrasounds so I actually know that they’re bigger, I take it as a positive sign that my balls work.

@vonko1988 On this forum I see that but other forums I know quite a few that said they felt even better adding hCG to trt, idk many on hCG mono so I can’t say if others like it more or less. For me when I was on just trt after a while I started getting low libido, soft boners, eventually morning wood disappeared, semen volume and pressure was bad, like a thick go that barely came out and sensitivity decreased, recovery after orgasm took hours instead of minutes. Adding hCG all of it improved, especially libido. Going off trt and with just hCG I have libido almost like I had when I was a teenager, my boners are so hard they hurt (in a good way lol). Only negative is I have less strength/endurance in the gym. If my restart/pct fails I’m going to try hCG mono-therapy, I could be the exception feeling better on hCG mono over trt mono, I just feel better when my balls are functioning, I can only assume some other hormones are lacking on trt mono for me.

I guess it is very subjectical. Some people feel good on clomid, but for many like me it is shitty experience.

Im willing to try HCG mono but I want to know exactly how suppressing it is for my LH/FSH production

Can’t really say how much it’ll suppress, if you take an AI that should lessen the suppression, or if you take a serm they won’t be suppressed.

For sure I would avoid AI at all costs even on TRT. AI is something that should be used only when REALLLY needed and not for prolonged amount of time. And I already have bad experience with clomid…

Yeah I would try to avoid if possible, but if you’re concerned with LH/FSH it can be of some help, but serms would be more effective, and you could try low dose tamoxifen instead. But I would just wait to see if the hCG significantly suppresses LH/FSH for you, which I imagine would be in the low normal range with just 250iu eod