saw this posted on FB, very sad
Just wish she hadn’t blamed non-believers…
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]four60 wrote:
This story sucks on so many levels and if this is true ( the killing them for a nationality or belief) its sick.
But I hate the whole concept behind Hate crime laws. It’s like the crack laws of the 80’s/90’s.
If I sell cocaine powder to you to snort it’s not as bad as selling it in a crystal rock form more jail time.
Killing you because you cut me off in traffic is not as bad as killing you because I don’t like the book you use to acknowledge God?
Oh and one will get the Feds attention [/quote]
I agree with you on that.
[/quote]
Agree as well
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]Marzouk wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]Marzouk wrote:
Maybe she was the aggressor? Did they find a bag of skittles there?[/quote]
Dude…
[/quote]
Damn, i felt like i was back at school then getting shouted out of a teacher.
She was from my neck of the woods, I was being heavily sarcastic based on the face that the police haven’t declared this a hate crime.
I mean wtf has to happen to be a hate crime? Seriously. I would like to know. [/quote]
My issue was with the skittles thing… Ok, I get it was a joke… But the skittles crap had nothing to do with the Trayvon Martin case either, it was meaningless propaganda to muddle the issue and it was the start of a lot more obfuscation and such from both sides.
As for the hate crime thing, who knows why they haven’t put it that way. Might be that the message is just there to mislead.
I don’t care whether it was due to hatred or not, I want the party responsible to run head-first into a very solid wall made out of elemental justice.
[/quote]
Its pretty obvious that they skittles is constantly mentioned in Trayvon case to solidify in peoples minds that he was a child.
As for the hate crime, brutal killing is brutal killing and should be punished no matter what the motivation.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
This is horrible. I hope they catch and fry the bastard who did this to that poor woman. I don’t understand some people’s attitudes toward immigrants. My girlfriend and I have both experienced this attitude (I am Russian originally and she is Indian), not to this extent though and it is very upsetting, especially considering that I am now a US citizen and she is close to being one. We have both been told many times that we “should go back to where we came from.” [/quote]
There exists a certain kind of people/way of thinking which is responsible for this… I don’t think there’s anything there to understand. They do not think like we do, and this is not limited to hatred for immigrants… No do I think is it really necessarily about the stated “offence” of being an immigrant, not living according to Sharia law, or taking their jobs or whatever the hell it is.
[/quote]
I still hold out hope that we can sway people to stop being crazy(ideologies/extremist beliefs), but I always think before I judge people. A large part of “these people” are like that because of the way they were brought up, and can we really blame them? Especially people born in the middle east, since they seem to get the brunt of the “crazy” portrayal.
There was a video posted online a while back that showed a small tribe somewhere burying a child alive because they thought this would rid their village of bad luck. Again, that’s their belief. I’m not saying these things should be tolerated, clearly it is wrong on so many levels, but they probably think we are crazy for celebrating Christmas or drinking bottled water.
I can go on and on about traditions and ideologies by country/ethnicity… My opinion, believe what the hell you wanna believe but don’t force anything on anyone. At least not to the point where you hurt them and or take their lives.
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
There were definitely people posting that tried to argue that racism and racial profiling are extremely rare occurrences these days, which is not a position I hold. Just seeing the way people look at and talk to my girlfriend is enough to prove to me that that is not true.
[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
There were definitely people posting that tried to argue that racism and racial profiling are extremely rare occurrences these days, which is not a position I hold. Just seeing the way people look at and talk to my girlfriend is enough to prove to me that that is not true.[/quote]
Thank you. It gets a little tiring seeing people act like we are just seeing things…as if no one here was posting as if racism was so long and dead everyone is just making it up now.
This woman was put through this for no reason…because someone didn’t like her religion, skin color or whatever.
The shit is still here. It may be WAAAAY better than when my grandmother was drinking from black only water fountains, but it still affects many people.
I don’t think there is anything more insulting than implying people are just seeing things.
Quite a number in that thread wrote that being offended means other people need to handle your emotions for you.
That is a load of crap. If this woman’s family is offended, they need to be handled?
[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
There were definitely people posting that tried to argue that racism and racial profiling are extremely rare occurrences these days, which is not a position I hold. Just seeing the way people look at and talk to my girlfriend is enough to prove to me that that is not true.[/quote]
My bad then, those threads moved so fast and all I really must have overlooked them.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
Of course it still happens but I also think that it can blind people from seeing the everything involved and not just the hate.
People on both sides become defensive instead of impartial to facts.
For instance race or religious belief can be part of the crime without being the main cause.
Also a statement is not a fact. It still needs to be proven true. But when heated it can be stated as a truth by a third party.
[quote]four60 wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
Of course it still happens but I also think that it can blind people from seeing the everything involved and not just the hate.
People on both sides become defensive instead of impartial to facts.
For instance race or religious belief can be part of the crime without being the main cause.
Also a statement is not a fact. It still needs to be proven true. But when heated it can be stated as a truth by a third party.
[/quote]
You put that very well, and I agree. What you described is much of what bugged me about those other threads on the Trayvon Martin case etc.
Yeah, this really pisses me off.
I’m not surprised though.
If the story was on CNN the comments section would be filled with bigots congratulating the killer.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
There were definitely people posting that tried to argue that racism and racial profiling are extremely rare occurrences these days, which is not a position I hold. Just seeing the way people look at and talk to my girlfriend is enough to prove to me that that is not true.[/quote]
Thank you. It gets a little tiring seeing people act like we are just seeing things…as if no one here was posting as if racism was so long and dead everyone is just making it up now.
This woman was put through this for no reason…because someone didn’t like her religion, skin color or whatever.
The shit is still here. It may be WAAAAY better than when my grandmother was drinking from black only water fountains, but it still affects many people.
I don’t think there is anything more insulting than implying people are just seeing things.
Quite a number in that thread wrote that being offended means other people need to handle your emotions for you.
That is a load of crap. If this woman’s family is offended, they need to be handled?[/quote]
You’re welcome. People tend to see what they want to see on this matter. In fact, before I started dating my girlfriend 3 years ago I may have agreed with those posters. It kind of changes the way you view things when you have to see that shit happen every day, especially to someone you care about.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]four60 wrote:
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Yet there are people who try to force the belief down our throats that racism and hate motivated crime is nothing but a distant memory.[/quote]
This isn’t in response to the other thread, is it? I dunno man… Because if it was, I think you might just have misunderstood some posters… Or I missed some posts, also possible.
If you mean in general, then I guess you’re right.
[/quote]
Of course it still happens but I also think that it can blind people from seeing the everything involved and not just the hate.
People on both sides become defensive instead of impartial to facts.
For instance race or religious belief can be part of the crime without being the main cause.
Also a statement is not a fact. It still needs to be proven true. But when heated it can be stated as a truth by a third party.
[/quote]
You put that very well, and I agree. What you described is much of what bugged me about those other threads on the Trayvon Martin case etc.
[/quote]
It’s a major reason I won’t go into part 2 of that thread.
We have no new facts on the case. What we know is from the 911 tape (fact) the kid went to the store and was walking back(fact) and Zimmerman shot the kid(fact), we have signs of a struggle (fact).
Anything other than that are statements from sad family members or statements from Zimmerman. Not one of those are facts just statements waiting to be proven or not.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Thank you. It gets a little tiring seeing people act like we are just seeing things…as if no one here was posting as if racism was so long and dead everyone is just making it up now.
This woman was put through this for no reason…because someone didn’t like her religion, skin color or whatever.
The shit is still here. It may be WAAAAY better than when my grandmother was drinking from black only water fountains, but it still affects many people.
I don’t think there is anything more insulting than implying people are just seeing things.
Quite a number in that thread wrote that being offended means other people need to handle your emotions for you.
That is a load of crap. If this woman’s family is offended, they need to be handled?[/quote]
I think a lot of people just lack perspective on the subject. Like me, for example, I grew up in mostly white suburbia and just a few years ago I believed racism and hate crimes to be a thing of the past.
Then I got engaged to and subsequently married an Egyptian muslim. My perspective quickly changed as I witnessed relatives gawking at my wife’s father simply because he is rather dark in skin color. Some family members won’t even speak to me because I married a muslim. And others, while trying to appear genuine, talk to my wife like she is an alien from another planet.
The list goes on and on but before that I was clueless. I didn’t think the hate still existed like that. I thought we as a whole were free of it. I was really wrong.
I pray to god that when my wife goes to work every day some fucktard doesn’t do what happened to the poor woman in the news story, to my wife. People don’t understand that fear until they live with it.
[quote]krazykoukides wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Thank you. It gets a little tiring seeing people act like we are just seeing things…as if no one here was posting as if racism was so long and dead everyone is just making it up now.
This woman was put through this for no reason…because someone didn’t like her religion, skin color or whatever.
The shit is still here. It may be WAAAAY better than when my grandmother was drinking from black only water fountains, but it still affects many people.
I don’t think there is anything more insulting than implying people are just seeing things.
Quite a number in that thread wrote that being offended means other people need to handle your emotions for you.
That is a load of crap. If this woman’s family is offended, they need to be handled?[/quote]
I think a lot of people just lack perspective on the subject. Like me, for example, I grew up in mostly white suburbia and just a few years ago I believed racism and hate crimes to be a thing of the past.
Then I got engaged to and subsequently married an Egyptian muslim. My perspective quickly changed as I witnessed relatives gawking at my wife’s father simply because he is rather dark in skin color. Some family members won’t even speak to me because I married a muslim. And others, while trying to appear genuine, talk to my wife like she is an alien from another planet.
The list goes on and on but before that I was clueless. I didn’t think the hate still existed like that. I thought we as a whole were free of it. I was really wrong.
I pray to god that when my wife goes to work every day some fucktard doesn’t do what happened to the poor woman in the news story, to my wife. People don’t understand that fear until they live with it.[/quote]
I’m sorry that your wife is being treated this way, but thank you for posting this. Your last sentence is a sentiment that I’ve been trying to get across for a very long time now.
This is a local story for me so I find it of particular interest. We’ve got a huge Iraqi population here in the county (one of the biggest in the nation) and the thought that a person would single out this particular woman to be a target isn’t necessarily the only scenario to be considered. So when the authorities say that they are investigating all possibilities they are also looking into whether it was family or even someone within the community itself.
james
[quote]atypical1 wrote:
This is a local story for me so I find it of particular interest. We’ve got a huge Iraqi population here in the county (one of the biggest in the nation) and the thought that a person would single out this particular woman to be a target isn’t necessarily the only scenario to be considered. So when the authorities say that they are investigating all possibilities they are also looking into whether it was family or even someone within the community itself.
james
[/quote]
I can remember watching one of those crime shows on Investigation Discovery where a child staged a hate murder to collect inheritance and insurance money on one of his parents. I can’t remember the details, I will try to find an article.
edit: Couldn’t find what I was looking for, but here is a case where a muslim man staged a hate crime to murder his wife:
Here’s a case where a black man raped and murdered a white college girl, then wrote “KKK” and “white power” on her walls:
A black Penn State football player murders another black student, writes “die n***er” in blood:
[quote]atypical1 wrote:
This is a local story for me so I find it of particular interest. We’ve got a huge Iraqi population here in the county (one of the biggest in the nation) and the thought that a person would single out this particular woman to be a target isn’t necessarily the only scenario to be considered. So when the authorities say that they are investigating all possibilities they are also looking into whether it was family or even someone within the community itself.
james
[/quote]
Not saying that it didn’t happen but once something gets tagged as a “Hate Crime” it sends the focus away from the actual crime. I get why the laws came about I don’t agree with how they function.
It’s like that chick who scared her face and blamed a race attack or the woman who strapped her kids in the car and blamed it on Race attack.
The people involved can give statements but people need to step back before jumping on a statement as a fact. Especially when the person giving the statement might be close to the crime.
And it also has the 2nd effect of poisoning the jury pool.
[quote]four60 wrote:
The people involved can give statements but people need to step back before jumping on a statement as a fact. Especially when the person giving the statement might be close to the crime.
And it also has the 2nd effect of poisoning the jury pool. [/quote]
Spot on four60.