Hard Drug Interactions with AAS

Exactly. Right on spot!

I wouldnā€™t do either on cycleā€¦ Thatā€™s just personal preference.

Both are bad decisions to make

Iā€™ll give mechanisms as to why cocaine is 10x worse acurely

Cocaine

  • sodium channel blockade, potassium channel blockade, increased calcium channel current (all predispose one to lethal arrhythmia, these channels aid within regard to allowing the heart to maintain itā€™s natural rhythmā€¦ itā€™s a bit more complicated with thisā€¦ such as potassium channels control the process of cardiac repolarization, but you get my jist)
  • catecholamine release (massive amounts), epinephrine, norepinephrine etc inducing vasoconstriction, binding to beta adrenergic receptors inducing an increase in HR, body temp, blood pressure, platelet aggregation etcā€¦ sympathetic nervous system upregulation
  • cocaine increases platelet a granule (plays a large role within clotting etc)
  • induces endothelial dysfunction
  • prolongs the QT interval (torsades de pointes has been reported)

Vasoconstriction decreases oxygen supply to the myocardium but increased HR/contractility increases oxygen demand, this leads to ischema (inadequate oxygen supply), cardiac myocytes to die, be replaced with fibrotic tissue later predisposing the user to lethal arrhythmia (from repeated use obviously). Vasoconstriction + platelet aggregation can form clotting, cause something called coronary vasospasm, which is when coronary arteries narrow to the point of causing MIā€¦ cocaine can cause this via thrombosis + vasoconstriction in those without heart disease

With AAS

  • AAS also up regulate the sympathetic nervous system, beta adrenergic receptors (making us MORE sensitive to the effects of epinephrine, norepinephrine)ā€¦ rodent models indicate they exacerbate the HR increase induced from cokeā€¦ will also exacerbate proarrythmiac effects as epinephrine elicits such an effect (epinephrine primarily binds to beta 1 and beta 2 adrenergic receptors, norepinephrine primarily activates only the beta 1 adrenergic receptor). AAS also generally increase BP, induce endothelial dysfunction etc (more mechanisms but computer about to dieā€¦ must make this quick)

Itā€™s more than (this increases HR and BP)ā€¦ itā€™s about the directly proarrythmiac effect mediated by cocaine (should say prolonged coke use enlarges the heartā€¦ dilated cardiomyopathy is a common complication amongst those who tough it it/afford to be able to use coke for years on end)ā€¦ alcohol also enlarges the heart when abused over many yearsā€¦ not quite as quickly as coke will though. AAS attenuate the proarrythmiac effect induced from coke, thatā€™s why itā€™s a particularly bad idea, when COMBINED with alcohol, itā€™s an even worse idea.

Will you die? Probably not, but itā€™s a small risk. The scientific words sound scarier than they actually are (still a TERRIBLE idea), but if you read the literature regarding cardiotoxic, neurotoxic mechanisms induced via AAS youā€™d think ā€œone shot of test and Iā€™ll be a braindead, heart disease ridden individual on his death bed?ā€

Just giving an honest, non biased answer here as Zeek told me to do prior (no fear mongering)

Cocaine? I donā€™t know what dose dependent effects are. Literature lumps in 5mg as being the same as 500mg. Given the prospect of compulsive redosing I doubt youā€™ll just take one line

Generally it dramatically increases HR to the point of resting tachycardia + all the other mechanisms at play itā€™s really, really hard on the body

If you have to do something irresponsible (whichā€¦ You donā€™t, Iā€™ve dropped the prospect of going out in favour of working out many times) couldnā€™t you do something else?

Sorry, but this rhetoric is out the window if youā€™re using high dose AAS at the time. Systematic toxicity + one hard night of drug useā€¦ Revert back to inducing systematic toxicity

He probably wonā€™t die, but it isnā€™t a good decision at allā€¦ Thereā€™s a pretty big difference between having a few lines off vs on cycleā€¦ And both situations are hard on the bodyā€¦ But off cycle pales in comparison to on cycle use

Gear + coke + booze is literally how people die in their 30sā€¦ I believe @studhammer knows 1-2 people who have died this way

Yep, just one actually. Late twenties probably, rumor was that he had a heart attack while doing coke.

Have another friend that was a walking pharmacy, never met a steroid he didnā€™t like, couple that with horrendous eating habits and he had a heart attack at 45. He was a single father. Left behind an 18 year old daughter.

How about some espresso to get hype then some hash to take the edge off, Morocco style?

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Well, thatā€™s very sadā€¦ sorry for youā€™re loss.

Still, wouldnā€™t use coke + AAS, bad idea (I wouldnā€™t use coke at allā€¦ ever) but thatā€™s individualistic preference, no judgement towards those who do (unless youā€™re an addict who steals from/hurts others)

yeet. I was going to say cannabis dose dependently increases heart rate and blood pressure + caffeineā€¦ then I thought, ā€œbut cocaineā€¦ā€ thatā€™s going to increase HR/BP a whole lot more than a spliff ever could

You donā€™t present any good information on here yet you criticize unreal for his way of actually presenting information. And your argument is his age? Come back if you can either write from experience or knowledge. Letā€™s see if you got the brains and the patience to even dig through some studies so you can write something useful

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Somebody doesnā€™t need ā€œexperience or knowledgeā€ to know that mixing alcohol and cocaine doesnā€™t go well, especially for somebody on AAS. That should be common sense unless youā€™re either stupid or playing dumb.

I donā€™t need to cite sources or prepare a thesis for me to state something that should be common knowledge. Nor does anyone need to dig through any studies to know that combining illegal drugs with anything is stupid. And to compare cocaine to weed or underage drinking is pretty stupid too.

Actually I indirectly know a few who have DIED from underage drinking alone, one other who slipped, cracked open the back of his head on a sidewalk and went into a coma. Whilst cocaine is comparatively more dangerous. Iā€™ve yet to ever see someone OD on that alone.

This pretty much sums up my opinion pertaining to drug abuse. DAILY cannabis usage, aside from medicinal usage (not the ā€œyouā€™ve got a headache, go crazyā€) is problematic, I can link about 100 studies showcasing it isnā€™t good for you.

Though Iā€™d disagree ketamine and methadone are less harmful than weed (as this is talking about abuse). Before you say this graph is BSā€¦ itā€™s taken from a study published within the lancet, a widely revered, most prestigious medical journals to date.

Of course I think that figure is correct. Also consider thereā€™s more access to alcohol, especially when compared to cocaine. Of course there will be more deaths from more people using it. Youā€™ve read the science behind cocaine use? based on symptoms and dosing alone, which would you say can be more fatal?

A kid who tells other kids to use steroids has no business lecturing anyone on how bad weed is. Again, I donā€™t need 100 studies to show that adult weed-smoking is somehow harmful compared to cocaine or teenage steroid use.

But I donā€™t do thisā€¦ terrible, moot argument. Once again an attack on the basis of my age.

Cannabis isnā€™t ā€œbadā€ either, I smoke it about once monthly, itā€™s fun

But youā€™ve got use and abuse, daily use is abuse

Daily adult weed smoking is more harmful than we give it credit for.

Cocaine, though itā€™s been stipulated cannabis alone when used frequently leads to deleterious cardiac alterations

Depends what demographic youā€™re engrained within. When I was 17 (alcohol being strictly regulated, albeit accepted). It wouldā€™ve been easier for me to get cocaine (actually this isnā€™t trueā€¦ Adults seem to be okay with 16+ and binge drinkingā€¦ My parents werenā€™t though, thus for ME it wouldā€™ve been easier as I didnā€™t have any 18+ friends at the time)

Iā€™ve also never encouraged teenage steroid use, get out of here with that ā€œdevils advocateā€ arguement/bullshit. I ALWAYS state itā€™s bad. But occasionally youā€™ll get a kid who honestly wants to use in a manner far more responsible than some of the 22-25 y/olds on here

You telling a kid that adults being irresponsible just to ā€œplay devils advocateā€ convinced him otherwise after adults gave him some good recommendations.

I guess I abuse. Itā€™'s no different than your faux-medical self medication that you prolly got off a fake doctor on this site.

Whenever you state that its bad, you love to add in ā€œbut I do itā€, or ā€œbut teenagers are smart and can make their own choicesā€. Hence why these contradictions make me bring up this guy:

I didnā€™t tell anyone to play devils advocate, fuck off with this bullshit argument youā€™ve presented about 1,000 timesā€¦ I learnt this phrase the other day

Youā€™re arguments are filled with ā€œstraw manā€ rhetoric

What self medication. Iā€™m prescribed TRT from an endocrinologist? Half of youā€™re posts (more than half) on the Pharma section fo this forum stem JUST to irritate people.

Right, you never told anyone to play devils advocate. You played devils advocate. Itā€™s right there in one of the many threads where kids are askin about steroids.

Oh didnā€™t know you were prescribed because you also talked about ā€œyour own irresponsible useā€ in that thread, but you also claim that what youā€™re doing isnā€™t really TRT in the TRT Credentials thread.

I did thisā€¦ twice

Once about two years ago

A second time six months ago or so. It wasnā€™t intended as encouraging teenage steroid use. I was merely implying that some kid using 400mg isnā€™t doing as much harm as a 22 y/o using 700mg tren 500mg test 50mg dbol and so on. Iā€™ve ALWAYS discouraged steroid use, teen or not

Either way, Iā€™m done with this argument.

Yup, Iā€™m prescribed 150mg weekly, I take 200-220mg weeklyā€¦ sue me, Iā€™m on such a massive cycleā€¦ Iā€™ve had to deal with a myriad of health issues throughout my life, I was diagnosed with hypogonadism when I was sixteen

What was the point of making that statement though? Of course adults can be irresponsible. Look at the dude who made THIS thread.

Taking more than youā€™re prescribed is self medication. But Iā€™m sure you know more about your hypogonadism and myriad of health problems than your own endocrinologist. Thereā€™s no way he would have TRT credentials like you doā€¦

doctor :troll: