T Nation

Gyno Fairy Visits Again


Welp its back.

Looks like my body is back to being fucked up again on its own.

Just to give an overview

AAS History
8 weeks of Var use last year. Did wonders and I felt like me again. Before that nothing.

Training history:

5 years steady.

Problem over view:

Last year I started getting symptoms of gyno. Which was confirmed by my Dr. He said stop taking creatine and supplements(insert flame the DR here). He wanted me to for a long series of blood tests to get a picture of my hormone profile. I can't take the time off work so he can milk each visit. So when the symptoms subsided I let the issue rest.

Lately its been back with a fury since I stepped up my training. Now the little fairy is back tickling my nipples and making them hard and kinda sore.

My symptoms
Ichy hard nipples
Mood Swings
Libido Crash (this is the one I hate the most, I love sex)
Acne Breakouts
Mild Depression

I know he is going to ask for another blood profile check. Which I am more then willing to do. I have printed out some info on AI's and SERM's and even selected which drugs I would like him to give. ADEX and Nolva. Or just Nolva to attack the breast tissue. We can add Adex later. But since I have would still have to take the blood tests would being on Nolva too soon be like jumping the gun? I hate this sensation and I want this to all stop. Specially if it becomes perm.. avoiding surgery is what I am totally going for here.

Also I read Adex is not as effective when on Nolva. Can anyone confirm this?


I was reading the Arimidex drug profile off the application i have on my iPhone (Epocrates rX) and according to the drug interactions, Use of Tamoxifen should be avoided when on Arimidex. The combo of Adex and Nolva may result in decrease of anastrozole levels.

here's the online version:



In my case, nolva admin. quickly solved any gyno problems. adex was run along with it so when it does take effect the gyno was subdued. Elimante aromatization, you minimize the evil gyno fairy.


What compounds are you using presently? I would use nolva, or if none on hand, an AI as quick as possible until the flareup subsides.


Nothing in my body... not one fucking thing. Just food training and sleep. I wish I had something going on then I would know how to approach this. I just hope its not cancer or something messed up.

If I use, I use once a year depending on what my goals are.


Your E2 must certainly be high. It would be good to get an E2 lab done. I would still start on the nolva or AI simply based on the symtoms.

You may be one that does well on a constant low dose of Adex or Letro even off cycle. Bill Roberts maintains low dose Letro even when off cycle. He says it keeps estro in check and bolsters free t.


I read that before. Thats why I am considering it. I want the drugs now not wait for 2 weeks for some stupid test to come back. If he doesn't do anything for me I am going to order it online or something.


I retract my previous statement. Truly unconstructive and uncalled for. I was merely venting my frustations with certain...things or places. I completely apologize. It was truly unlike myself. I usually offer some sort of positive input or some sort of comical reference but never aimed meant to be abrasive.


Growing: That was uncalled for.

DB: You can get quick delivery. Same day or next.


What up dude?
If I were you I would cop some letro via one of the research chem choices you trust, and give that a go. I am one who seems to possess high e levels, and I think Bill Roberts is one in the know, and his word speaks volumes as we all know, and as has been previously stated, he runs letro even when off to maintain his e in check.

Adex never worked worth a damn for me..It had to be run excessively high to get any benefit, and even then, the benefit wasn't to my satisfaction at all. Letro kicks ass, despite most of the press on it, many guys are able to, and use it, very effectively without going too high and jacking up joint lube and causing discomfort etc. Sure you'll have to experiment with your dosage, but imo, it was worth it to me.

Seems like it may help you. You having these symptoms without running any gear at all is just crazy..I would get your hormones tested, and get the letro while you're at it...then proceed with help from some of the top guys here fixing things up.

Good luck man.


Well I went to see my DR ..no prescriptions. I even had tons of literature about gyno and researched drugs. He said I don't know what to tell you. Lets do a blood test and send the results to an Endo. That was a relief. Finally a good Dr one the case.

If I had done some gear I would be like ok I know what to do but when it comes out of the blue from hard training and protein drinks then something is wrong.

If I don't get anywhere with the Endo I am going to get some letro and run that and tweak the dose till I am feeling like me. Normal me. Even if I have to HRT myself.

So sick of this emotional bullshit roller coaster. Getting weepy over a kids cartoon is retarded I know it but I can't help it. FAWWWWK!!


No worries man its all good!


Don't want to freak you out, but given your limited use of AAS, I would definitely make sure you get checked out. A buddy of mine had the same issues and ended up having testicular cancer that spread to his brain and lungs (quickly); your symptoms might also indicate a pituitary adenoma.

Again, not trying to freak you out, but definitely don't accept some MD saying, "I don't know what's going on, come back in a couple of months." Good luck with everything.



Glad you will have an endo looking at this. Make sure you don't let gyno set in even if you have to order express. Also, some endo's are really backwards too. I hope that is not your case. You have a much better chance that with a standard GP. Keep us posted...


Well yesterday and today are not that bad but I can feel it in me still something is off. I have read lots on what gyno can be a symptom of. Thats why I am seeing a DR and not just rushing out and getting some Nolv to combat it.

Just going to sit back and wait for the lab work to come back. Hopefully its not too long.


Wow, at least he's willing to help. When I had my first panel pulled up I came up under the normal ranges. That doctor told me, "Well you're not good but you're not bad." Followed by an ackward moment of silence. Some doctors hear the word "hormome" and immediately dismiss it as a source of treatment either through a phobia or their mistrust in the patient. Have you tried daily SERM admin?


Nope never. Cause there should be no reason for this to happen. That is why I am confused and having a Dr looking into it. If I did this to myself then I would know what to do.

The vets here teach really well.

But I have a small AAS use history of a mild substance. And the condition pre-existed before use. It actually got better while on. Go figure.


Do you remember or have a link to the dosages he recommended for low dose letro ?

Id be very interested in this, I know how to appropriately dose letro, but not for my natural production.



I have this snippet from Nov. 2008 but not the one where he clearly outlined Low-dose Letro usage even while off cycle. Sorry about that. I guess searching his posts would be very time consuming.

BR excerpt from Nov. 2008:

"There seems a lot of fear-mongering with letrozole that supposedly for some men a tiny dose will obliterate their estrogen levels, but has anyone actually had a problem with one-third mg/day? "



I tried searching a bit, but the amount of posts is daunting. I would PM Bill. In my experience he is more than willing to share his knowledge.