T Nation

"Guide to Responsible Steroid Use" Video. Interesting Info, Thoughts?

Dr Mike Isratel talks about PEDS.

Some takeaways that I found counter to what I normally hear:

  • He does not believe in the traditional “cycles”
  • 12 weeks isn’t enough for anything (or so he seems to hint at this)
  • Orals are best for newbies. Anavar 1 month cycle if you aren’t serious about doing this long term
  • If you want to do injectables go with 300mg Test, never above, and stack with Primo or Masteron as a good beginner/mild combo
  • You will lose most of your gains

Would love to know what some of you think of this interview and some of the stuff he says.

I find this comment the most interesting since I though almost all aas shut your natural T production down and you should never take one without T.

As a rule you shouldn’t run just an oral. But if you’re going to do it then anavar is probably the least bad choice. It’s suppressive, but probably won’t cause total shutdown unless it’s run very high and for longer than this guy suggests.

yeah he suggests 1 month if you want to look good for the ‘beach’ or a ‘festival’ he kind of trolls the techno bros a bit in this interview which is funny

Dylan Gemelli posted a video where he suggested no more than 350 mg / week of testosterone.

There relationship between dose and muscle gain doesn’t scale linearly. This (frequently cited) study found that over twenty weeks, 300 mg of testosterone per week would add 5.2 kg, versus 7.9 kg for 600 mg. I’ve never used more than a TRT dose, so I don’t know how the side effects would increase.

For example sustanon 500mg per week provides about 350mg testesterone

I didn’t have any negative side expect for few weeks night sweating

I dont count elevated e2 as It is unavoidable

I somewhat disagree with a few philosophies this individual has to say

Firstly, literature shows a single shot of nandrolone, and even testosterone can significantly suppress the HPTA, 15mg ox/day for 3 DAYS shuts down more than 50% of the users exogenous testosterone production.

Furthermore, keeping gains from anabolic steroids

Literature has demonstrated differences do exist between AAS/non AAS users with regard to the structure and type of muscle fibres in various regions, granted they were talking about pretty high doses. Finally, if one isn’t beyond the limit as to what natural physiology would allow them to attain, in theory, with adequate hormone levels, diet and training, one should be able to maintain what would exist up to ones genetic peak.

I cycle on 250mg test (e/c) or so, I trt at a dose that keeps me around 1200ng/dl on average (and feel great) however my free T always stays like 1.1-1.5x the top of the ref range) (no issues with HCT or anything) I’ve never noticed a loss of gains post cycle, however that may be due to the fact that my “trt” regiment is mildly pharmacological in nature.

Whether or not an oral is good for cycling, I’ve subtly stated on numerous occasions the no orals rhetoric isn’t entirely true (yet don’t push it due to lack of personal experience and I don’t want to get into an argument), certain orals (given their characteristics) appear entirely possible/practical for one to use on their own. The argument of one shutting their natty T production down doesn’t matter, as one is shutting down their natural testosterone production when using synthetic testosterone anyway. Anabolic steroids are merely modified versions of testosterone and/or DHT (19-nortestosterone is a c19 demethylated variant of testosterone). Thus certain anabolics derived from testosterone (orals) may have the adequate positive effect on neurotransmitters, muscle mass, bone density etc, to be used without testosterone. Is it a good idea? not particularly… c17AA Orals are way harsher on the body in general than injectables

People need to stop listening to these YouTube people like Greg, Dylan, Burton, Kai. Especially if you have no experience with AAS listening to these people is a horrible idea.

Im not saying they don’t have good info because they do. Problem is for every peice of good info they give out they give out an opinion usually based on professional level bodybuilding. Unless you are well educated in AAS hearing these things can lead you in a horrible direction.

And this is coming from someone who doesn’t agree with the test only for the first 5 cycles and people should only use test unless they are competing so that should say something.

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Listening to Dylan Gemelli regarding steroids would be like listening to Donald Trump about marital fidelity. Dylan is well-qualified to discuss other things, like how much Axe Body Spray to use, or the proper way to hide gay-for-pay from your fiancé. But if you look to him regarding gear advice then you are responsible for whatever happens next.

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Has Dylan Gemelli done G4P?

If he hasn’t he probably directs it.

I don’t know. It was just a joke.

This was the best answer possible!

If I remember correctly he does mention this.

But he isn’t just some youtube guy. He is a PHD, and is a pretty well known guy by this point in bodybuilding/fitness circles. I think his experience with AAS is limited though.

Did the 500mg Test standard protocol com from the fact that most vials are in 250mg form? Where did the 500mg usual cycle come from?

Wow, your screen name suits you. 500mg comes from the weekly dose. 250 mg vials hold an oil that contains 250 mg of test/mL. So for 500/week, one would pin 2 mLs per week

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I think that was his point, but I have no idea.

Most vials are 250mg/ml so two pins would equal 500 and I think he is saying that may be the reason why 500 is the number.

My Test from the Pharm comes in 200mg/ml and if this was the norm, would the standard cycle then be 400? Two shots of 200mg?

I have no idea, but am curious as to how 500mg per week became the default cycle. I was on 500 a week and my test was >5000, clearly excessive.

But, I felt great!

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Um, ok. So it’s convenient to say 500mg vs something like 400mg or 600mg.

Exactly my point. I want to know the origin, and since 250mg seems to be the most common form, that may give us a clue. Reasonable assumption, no?

I know that 200mg/ml is common in the states but I don’t even think they have this in Canada? right?