T Nation

Go Sheriff Joe

[quote]dcb wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
OK, first, we designate a specific territory as a penal zone (I’m personally voting for LA to win - but a large island would work best - hey is anyone using Cuba for anything important?) and then we build a wall around it.

Everyone convicted of a crime and sentenced to prison gets dumped into the penal zone and it is entirely up to them to survive.

Society does not have to pay for feeding, clothing, schooling, medical care, counseling, etc. The convict serves his time and if he survives, he can show up at the only gate and be released back into normal society.

No death penalty, no slave labor, no cruel or unusual punishment, no costs, no problem -I love it.

Reminds me of this one time in Bogata when we took this female albino llama and a male platypus and put them in the same cage for a few weeks . . .then we had llamapus’s everywhere . . . or would they be plallamas - not sure.

It’s been done…um, in Hollywood at least:


Kurt Russell is Snake Pliskin
[/quote]

nice. he totally does look like snake.

Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

[quote]tGunslinger wrote:
Beowolf wrote:
Mhatch wrote:
Speaking of Tent City and pink underwear… I’ve always been of a mind where prisoners should be made to work. You want to eat? Get your ass out in a self contained farm(hypothetical) that each prison should have. If there is a surplus, the food goes into the U.S. market. We should cut out all the cell phones, tv, basketball, weights, and start making a prison term what it is meant to be a punishment.

You realize we have a Constitutional amendment banning slavery yes?

[i]Amendment XIII

Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.

Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation. [/i]

[/quote]

Exactly. Prison should be punishment. And at the very least they should be self sustaining; even better, they should contribute to the communities around them. All that manual labor will keep them in line/tired. They will actually learn useful skills.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one. [/quote]

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.

[quote]orion wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.
[/quote]

Well said.

[quote]orion wrote:
Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.
[/quote]

win

[quote]orion wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.
[/quote]

I didn’t say a damn thing about state violence, working for your food does not equate to violence. I am simply against it being a free ride and a huge drag on society. Do you not think there is a reason some criminals will purposefully “attempt” to escape shortly before their release or commit a crime after their release to get incarcerated again? It’s an all expenses paid vacation, where the main worries are protecting your cornhole and trying not to piss people off.

[quote]Mhatch wrote:
orion wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.

I didn’t say a damn thing about state violence, working for your food does not equate to violence. I am simply against it being a free ride and a huge drag on society. Do you not think there is a reason some criminals will purposefully “attempt” to escape shortly before their release or commit a crime after their release to get incarcerated again? It’s an all expenses paid vacation, where the main worries are protecting your cornhole and trying not to piss people off.[/quote]

When do you plan on taking a trip to this hot vacation spot??

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
Mhatch wrote:
orion wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.

I didn’t say a damn thing about state violence, working for your food does not equate to violence. I am simply against it being a free ride and a huge drag on society. Do you not think there is a reason some criminals will purposefully “attempt” to escape shortly before their release or commit a crime after their release to get incarcerated again? It’s an all expenses paid vacation, where the main worries are protecting your cornhole and trying not to piss people off.

When do you plan on taking a trip to this hot vacation spot??[/quote]

No shit LOL. One of the places I saw was a former Naval base during WW2. And no effort was made to upgrade anything. People think that these places are fun. They stink, very loud, filthy, and are just all around shitholes.
Those who try to escape are so institutionalized that they cannot picture life outside or prison. They have no idea of how to survive in the real world.

BTW, I caught a glimpse of a box of food in the freezer. As I got closer to it, I read it said fried fish patties. On the side of the box it read, “Best by 1997.” This was now 2004.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Mhatch wrote:
orion wrote:
MaximusB wrote:
Something people have to realize about prison, 95% of those locked up eventually come out. Do you want them to come out with the prison mentality of always being on their guard, not trusting anyone, and handling things in barbaric ways? I am not saying prison should be easy or hard, but from my experience it doesn’t work and makes guys worse in most instances.

I can only speak for Fed prison, but it sucks big time. 300 minutes a month for phone calls limited to 15 minute calls at a time. This is done so things like “phone check” can no longer happen. Gangs used to own the phone, and if you wanted to make a call, you had to pay.

Working out on the yard is not such easy living. There is always tension with more than a handful of guys with blades on them at any given time. For me being white, it royally sucks because I have to hang with other white guys. Problem is, some white guys are either Aryan Brotherhood, Nazi Lowriders, Skins, or Woods. I am NONE, but I have to deal with guys like Crazy Irish, Shitty, Swoop, and Mad Wolfy. You NEVER walk the yard alone. This is how it was at the FCI Medium.

In the chow hall, you have to make sure you sit at your appropriate table, or you might get a fist in the back of the head. Don’t reach over someone else’s tray for the salt or pepper. You ask, or you risk pissing someone off.

I could go on and on, but the bottom line is this. If you treat someone like an animal, don’t be surprised when he behaves like one.

Obviously you have not noticed that for some people on this board the cookie cutter approach to just about any problem, be it drugs, crime or terrorism, is more state violence.

Should that not work for any reason it was not that some problems simply cannot be smashed out of existence but because limp wristed liberals did not let them get brutal enough.

I didn’t say a damn thing about state violence, working for your food does not equate to violence. I am simply against it being a free ride and a huge drag on society. Do you not think there is a reason some criminals will purposefully “attempt” to escape shortly before their release or commit a crime after their release to get incarcerated again? It’s an all expenses paid vacation, where the main worries are protecting your cornhole and trying not to piss people off.

When do you plan on taking a trip to this hot vacation spot??

No shit LOL. One of the places I saw was a former Naval base during WW2. And no effort was made to upgrade anything. People think that these places are fun. They stink, very loud, filthy, and are just all around shitholes.
Those who try to escape are so institutionalized that they cannot picture life outside or prison. They have no idea of how to survive in the real world.

BTW, I caught a glimpse of a box of food in the freezer. As I got closer to it, I read it said fried fish patties. On the side of the box it read, “Best by 1997.” This was now 2004.
[/quote]

LOL…about the fish patties. Sounded perfect for a nutritious…and oh so delicious food loaf.

everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

[quote]Mhatch wrote:
dcb wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
OK, first, we designate a specific territory as a penal zone (I’m personally voting for LA to win - but a large island would work best - hey is anyone using Cuba for anything important?) and then we build a wall around it.

Everyone convicted of a crime and sentenced to prison gets dumped into the penal zone and it is entirely up to them to survive.

Society does not have to pay for feeding, clothing, schooling, medical care, counseling, etc. The convict serves his time and if he survives, he can show up at the only gate and be released back into normal society.

No death penalty, no slave labor, no cruel or unusual punishment, no costs, no problem -I love it.

Reminds me of this one time in Bogata when we took this female albino llama and a male platypus and put them in the same cage for a few weeks . . .then we had llamapus’s everywhere . . . or would they be plallamas - not sure.

It’s been done…um, in Hollywood at least:


Kurt Russell is Snake Pliskin

It’s also been done in Death Race(kind of) with Jason Stathom.

[/quote]

which was a re-do (sort of) of David Carradine in Death Race 2000. An old movie nobody ever knows…

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:

When do you plan on taking a trip to this hot vacation spot??[/quote]

I am a law abiding citizen so therefore I have no worries about attending this vacation spot.

[quote]Mhatch wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:

When do you plan on taking a trip to this hot vacation spot??

I am a law abiding citizen so therefore I have no worries about attending this vacation spot.[/quote]

Hmmm…something of value is very important to you. I wonder what that could be??

[quote]MaddyD wrote:
everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

[/quote]

First of all - its spelled sheriff. . .

Sheriff Arpaio does indeed run a county jail- but you would need to provide some statistics to prove that the majority of prisoners in the fifth largest county in the us (larger than some states) are merely innocent victims of some evil plan . . .

Secondly - they county runs several jails - and where the sentence is served depends on the type of conviction and length of sentence.

Third - (are you keeping up?) you really need to read up of the crime stats and types of convictions before you spout such silly nonsense about the majority of jail population being speeders or people who don;t pay fines.

Fourth - you’ve never been in a jail,have you? - great expert opinion there - you should become one of those talking head experts on CNN or MSNBC. You’d be perfect!

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
MaddyD wrote:
everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

First of all - its spelled sheriff. . .

Sheriff Arpaio does indeed run a county jail- but you would need to provide some statistics to prove that the majority of prisoners in the fifth largest county in the us (larger than some states) are merely innocent victims of some evil plan . . .

Secondly - they county runs several jails - and where the sentence is served depends on the type of conviction and length of sentence.

Third - (are you keeping up?) you really need to read up of the crime stats and types of convictions before you spout such silly nonsense about the majority of jail population being speeders or people who don;t pay fines.

Fourth - you’ve never been in a jail,have you? - great expert opinion there - you should become one of those talking head experts on CNN or MSNBC. You’d be perfect![/quote]

Source: FBI site and Press Release

CRIME RATES CLIMB IN ARPAIO?S JURISDICTION

FBI statistics reveal startling increases since last election

(PHOENIX) Oct. 23, 2008: Violent crime, murder, aggravated assault, auto theft and other major crimes have increased dramatically since 2004 in county areas patrolled by the Maricopa County Sheriff?s Office under Joe Arpaio. According to the FBI?s annual report entitled ?Crime in the United States?* released in September, unincorporated areas of the county have seen crime increase in almost every category.

Democratic Candidate for Maricopa County Sheriff Dan Saban says the FBI?s latest report provides strong evidence that Joe Arpaio has been ineffective in making Maricopa County safer.

?These FBI statistics show we need to stop sending sixty-man SWAT teams to raid the library and put those sixty deputies back on patrol,? said Dan Saban. ?More than 18,000 serious crimes took place on Arpaio?s watch last year while he staged made-for-TV immigration profiling events. He?s chasing burned-out tail lights when he should be catching criminals.?

The following chart demonstrates the increase in crimes reported by the Maricopa County Sheriff?s Office and compiled by the FBI, under the heading ?Crimes Known to Law Enforcement.? These statistics do not include crimes reported to other police agencies in Maricopa County; they show only crimes reported where MCSO has sole jurisdiction. (Note: table would not copy into email. Please see attached document for full contents of table)

Between 2004 and 2007 under MCSO jurisdiction: Violent Crime is up 69%; Murder is up 166%; Robbery is up 74%; Aggravated Assault is up 71%; Property Crime is up 26%; Burglary is up 25%; Larceny is up 31%; and Auto Theft is up 13%.

Saban added, ?While statistics never tell the whole story, crime drops in neighborhoods where deputies are visible. Criminals know the MCSO under Arpaio is slow to respond to citizens? calls for help. As sheriff, I will reallocate resources to fight and prevent crime, I?ll put more deputies on the patrol, and I?ll work to make the County safer.?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=139x5743

[quote]orion wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
MaddyD wrote:
everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

First of all - its spelled sheriff. . .

Sheriff Arpaio does indeed run a county jail- but you would need to provide some statistics to prove that the majority of prisoners in the fifth largest county in the us (larger than some states) are merely innocent victims of some evil plan . . .

Secondly - they county runs several jails - and where the sentence is served depends on the type of conviction and length of sentence.

Third - (are you keeping up?) you really need to read up of the crime stats and types of convictions before you spout such silly nonsense about the majority of jail population being speeders or people who don;t pay fines.

Fourth - you’ve never been in a jail,have you? - great expert opinion there - you should become one of those talking head experts on CNN or MSNBC. You’d be perfect!

Source: FBI site and Press Release

CRIME RATES CLIMB IN ARPAIO?S JURISDICTION

FBI statistics reveal startling increases since last election

(PHOENIX) Oct. 23, 2008: Violent crime, murder, aggravated assault, auto theft and other major crimes have increased dramatically since 2004 in county areas patrolled by the Maricopa County Sheriff?s Office under Joe Arpaio. According to the FBI?s annual report entitled ?Crime in the United States?* released in September, unincorporated areas of the county have seen crime increase in almost every category.

Democratic Candidate for Maricopa County Sheriff Dan Saban says the FBI?s latest report provides strong evidence that Joe Arpaio has been ineffective in making Maricopa County safer.

?These FBI statistics show we need to stop sending sixty-man SWAT teams to raid the library and put those sixty deputies back on patrol,? said Dan Saban. ?More than 18,000 serious crimes took place on Arpaio?s watch last year while he staged made-for-TV immigration profiling events. He?s chasing burned-out tail lights when he should be catching criminals.?

The following chart demonstrates the increase in crimes reported by the Maricopa County Sheriff?s Office and compiled by the FBI, under the heading ?Crimes Known to Law Enforcement.? These statistics do not include crimes reported to other police agencies in Maricopa County; they show only crimes reported where MCSO has sole jurisdiction. (Note: table would not copy into email. Please see attached document for full contents of table)

Between 2004 and 2007 under MCSO jurisdiction: Violent Crime is up 69%; Murder is up 166%; Robbery is up 74%; Aggravated Assault is up 71%; Property Crime is up 26%; Burglary is up 25%; Larceny is up 31%; and Auto Theft is up 13%.

Saban added, ?While statistics never tell the whole story, crime drops in neighborhoods where deputies are visible. Criminals know the MCSO under Arpaio is slow to respond to citizens? calls for help. As sheriff, I will reallocate resources to fight and prevent crime, I?ll put more deputies on the patrol, and I?ll work to make the County safer.?

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=139x5743
[/quote]

wow - talking points from a democratic challenger to the Sheriff . . . and you proved there is a lot of real crime in Maricopa and thus the need for effective jails. Was that your intent?

Oh, I know - you are proving that all of his tough actions haven’t been tough enough to deter crime. So you want him to be more rough with the prisoners? Outstanding - I know Sheriff Joe will be pleased that his detractors now want him to step up the toughness!

Wait - I thought these were just innocent victims - how could you support tougher actions against all of these poor unfortunate victims who don’t deserve to wear pink jumpsuits and eat PB&J sandwiches?

BTW - if he was not effective at his job, I doubt the good citizens of Maricopa would keep electing him sheriff time and time again . . . but maybe you think all of those citizens are just ignorant racist rednecks . . . .

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
MaddyD wrote:
everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

First of all - its spelled sheriff. . .

Sheriff Arpaio does indeed run a county jail- but you would need to provide some statistics to prove that the majority of prisoners in the fifth largest county in the us (larger than some states) are merely innocent victims of some evil plan . . .

Secondly - they county runs several jails - and where the sentence is served depends on the type of conviction and length of sentence.

Third - (are you keeping up?) you really need to read up of the crime stats and types of convictions before you spout such silly nonsense about the majority of jail population being speeders or people who don;t pay fines.

Fourth - you’ve never been in a jail,have you? - great expert opinion there - you should become one of those talking head experts on CNN or MSNBC. You’d be perfect![/quote]

Don’t know how I missed that post…I would of set Maddy straight before you did. Ironically,Maddy also thinks that peanut butter is the main protein source in jails…as posted in Supplement forum. He has no business discussing any of this stuff.

[quote]IrishSteel wrote:
MaddyD wrote:
everyone is talking prison this and prison that.

do any of you realize that sherrif joe runs a county jail?

a jail where most of the inmates are unsentenced meaning they are still presumed innocent? and are awaiting court because they are too poor to get bonded out of jail.

also the ones that are not innocent meaning they have been sentanced either go to a state run DOC facility where the real criminals are held and which is not under his control,or they are in there for terms of a few months based on non payment of fines. these are the horrible criminals that you speak of, people that are caught speeding, its funny to me when Sherrif Joe and his supporters talk out of both sides of their mouths on issues.

its crazy I see everyone saying he is so tough on crime, yet very few of his inmates are legaly criminals.
if you get rid of the non payment of fines people,and you get rid of the ones awaiting court you would have empty county jails.

lets also not forget county jail is not prison, maricopa county does not nor never will house felons in their jail system

it is an intake unit for the DOC. and a money making machine for the county sheriffs office nothing more.

First of all - its spelled sheriff. . .

Sheriff Arpaio does indeed run a county jail- but you would need to provide some statistics to prove that the majority of prisoners in the fifth largest county in the us (larger than some states) are merely innocent victims of some evil plan . . .

Secondly - they county runs several jails - and where the sentence is served depends on the type of conviction and length of sentence.

Third - (are you keeping up?) you really need to read up of the crime stats and types of convictions before you spout such silly nonsense about the majority of jail population being speeders or people who don;t pay fines.

Fourth - you’ve never been in a jail,have you? - great expert opinion there - you should become one of those talking head experts on CNN or MSNBC. You’d be perfect![/quote]

a simple search you will find that the people in his jail system are called “detaniees”

did I say it was “an evil plan” no I did not
I said that these were UNSENTENCED, meaning that they are awaiting court.
and in america you are “innocent until proven guilty” so that said these people are not even criminal yet as far as the letter of the law goes.

now to get a few things straight.
I know the difference between jail and prison having been a guest of both and also having had lived at one time in maricopa county and spending time inside of maricopa county jails.
I have seen the madison street jail before it was shut down due to health violations and inmate deaths
I have been to the new 4th ave jail (I spent the night on a mistaken charge from the past)
I have also been to towers jail which is where I went while I was awaiting transfer to Department of corrections.
I also spent a couple days in the lower buckeye jail and inside tent city in 120 degree heat. which BTW both are the same place Tent city is in an old parking lot of Lower buckeye jail

whenever you are arrested your time is spent being transported from jail to jail you are never in one place for more than a few days, because of regulations or I have been told anyways.
the old madison street jail was dubbed “the horseshoe” because the inside was built in the shape of a horseshoe.
you would start at one end and they throw you in a holding cell built for 10 people crammed with about 30 people. it was basically you stood shoulder to shoulder for hours at a time.
then your name gets called you get finger printed and you go to another room next to it and stand.
you get called again and again hours apart until you make your way to the other end of the jail and you are out the door. if you are to stay for more than a week you are transported to another jail. typically sent to tents because tents is the Min security for housing of the unsentenced inmates.and drunk drivers and other non violent offenders
Towers jail and lower buckeye jail is for the ones that are staying a while.

convicts go to Eyman, winslow ,or some other az DOC facility, sorry i am tired I only named the 2 yards I was on. there is 13 of them in all and I think 2 are womens prisons.again this is off memory and I am tired sorry
I do not want to go back because I am grown and I have more to lose but on the other hand I really don’t care if I go back or not. I am not scared of jail or prison nor am I intimidated by it or what happens inside of it.
life outside jail is harder for me than it would be in jail or in prison.
Prison time was actually quite nice for me,get good meals,no worries about rent,kids,bitching wife ect
you get to watch television and spend your days working out (well they got rid of the weight piles in Arizona) or playing cards in prison you are treated with more respect then you ever will in county jail.
why do you think its so easy for a person to get institutionalized,

I know the difference between being detained and arrested.
I also know that jail is where you go before you are convicted and prison is where you go after, Im sorry your too much a retard to know these differences.

I understand there are criminals in jail, hell I was one.
the point I was making was that most people mix up jail and prison.
they think you had handcuffs on its all the same.
it is not all the same.
was I saying anything at all about treatment of inmates, NO I was not
personally I think that if jail was worse than it is,you would have less people going back. I am all for being tough on criminals.
but what I am not for is a political figure lieing about things to get money for his own paycheck. which is all Sheriff Joe is , he is a political figure and he is after his own interests.

and let me re state.
Convicts typically get sent to state prison, the maricopa county jail system is an intake machine for the DOC.
its not like that in different states im sure but it is for Arizona.

and on a final note, not everyone on the internet is an “internet tough guy”
with the invention of affordable computers and internet in every home much like television, yes it is true even the ghetto has the internet.

and ex cons,current criminals and gangsters are sometimes smart enough to learn how to use a computer.

and yes, in jail peanut butter is traded ALOT.
the vegan meals that they give for religious reasons contain peanut butter and not bolonga.

this is a very valuable commodity
so set me straight, please set me straight.
I have no idea what I am talking about and have no need talking about this stuff.

EDIT:
the reason why he gets re elected time and time again is because Arizona will always vote republican.
if its right,wrong for indifferent they will always vote for the person on the republican ticket.

[quote]MaddyD wrote:
IrishSteel wrote:
MaddyD wrote:

the reason why he gets re elected time and time again is because Arizona will always vote republican.
if its right,wrong for indifferent they will always vote for the person on the republican ticket.
[/quote]

Ok you un-convicted non-felon type person . . .

I’m still not sure what point you are trying to make.

Is he too tough on criminals or not tough enough?

Is his jail policies too-lax or not lax-enough?

Is he torturing innocent civilians or is he simply processing prisoners for the state?

Are the citizens of AZ completely stupid or just stupid enough to vote for an incompetent sheriff because he’s republican?

Are you a bad bad internet boy, or just a wanna-be bad internet boy?