T Nation

Getting Testosterone Up Without TRT?


So my backstory - I’ve taken 3-4 steroid cycles all over 2 years ago. I’ve felt fine over the past 2 years (good sex drive, energy, generally happy etc) up until I recently took finasteride. It made me depressed and my sex drive just died. I quit it immediately (1 month ago) and went to the doctors to get my test levels checked. They came out very low (wasen’t told exact figures yet) and I was sent for a more complete check (T, LH, FSH, SHGB etc).

Now I don’t know if it’s down to the finasteride but I definitely felt good prior to it and crap afterwards. My depression has gone still stopping but my sex drive has not returned properly … I’m a functioning person but have little to no libido.

TRT isn’t really an option yet as it’s so early days with the doc and I’d be very hesitant even if offered as I want children.

My question is are there any ways to get my levels back for the long-term without TRT. I know if I took clomid/nolva my levels would shoot up but i’m unsure if they’d stay there.

Looks like your doc is testing you to see if you are primary or secondary.
If your balls still work there are drugs to boost T production.

Look up Post-Finasteride Syndrome. Your doc should have warned you about this.

Table 1: Reported symptoms of Post-Finasteride Syndrome 1

Sexual Symptoms Physical Symptoms Mental and Neurological Symptoms
Decreased or complete loss of sex drive Female-like breast development and enlargement Severe memory/recall impairment
Erectile dysfunction, impotence Chronic fatigue, listlessness Slowed thought processes
Loss of morning and spontaneous erections Muscle atrophy, weakness Impaired problem solving, decreased comprehension
Sexual anhedonia, loss of pleasurable orgasm Decreased oil and sebum production Depression
Decreased semen volume and force Chronically dry, thinning of skin Anxiety
Penile shrinkage and numbness Melasma Suicidal ideation
Peyronie’s disease Tinnitus Emotional flatness and anhedonia
Scrotal shrinkage and numbness Increased fat deposition, obesity and elevated body mass index Insomnia
Decrease in body temperature
Reduced HDL cholesterol, raised fasting glucose and triglycerides
Attempted suicide
Completed suicide

Clomid is a short term solution as men feel terrible on it and often complain of low libido, clomid blocks estrogen in the brain. If things haven’t gotten better in 2 years, I doubt without intervention things will improve on their own.

TRT may be the only long term solution as it seems finasteride has caused HPTA dysfunction and the damage is likely irreversible to an extent where 100% recovery is unlikely without intervention. Post Finasteride Syndrome has been around for at least a decade and your doctor is to blame for failing to warn you of the dangers.

You may already be infertile do to finasteride.

Which drugs would those be ? Thanks

A more complete breakdown:
After stopping finasteride (around the time of my blood test), I had NO sex drive and a complete inability to have sex/get hard - forced masturbation on a flaccid dick would lead to watery semen. I felt very depressed, no emotions and very little drive. My prostate also felt weird. This is the complete opposite to my pre-finasteride self.

The last week or so, I haven’t really felt depressed … potentially a little anxious though. Dick gets hard if I need it to and semen is thick/white but libido is still low … I have to get myself in the mood forcibly which is not my usual self. Drive is still lacking but not as bad as before. My thinking is also clearer but at the same time, I am substantially more irritable. No strange feelings in my prostate any longer.

All in all, I have seem a definite improvement in quality of life since my previous blood test but I wouldn’t even say I’m 50% improved. I guess the results of my blood test I took this week should shed more light on the situation.

My question here would be, can (potentially) finasteride induced low testosterone resolve itself with time?

I’d love to feel like a bull in a china shop which is me 3 months ago…

Is it worth me blasting clomid at arimidex/Nolvadex for a month? I have a lot on hand.

HCG injections can also work. They work better for some than others.

For me HCG has me feeling really good, but then I get a drop off (I think due to LH and FSH suppression).

I haven’t heard of many sides from HCG either.

Is this a permanent fix?

I really wish to seek a cure rather than an ongoing treatment, I’m not fond of Clomid/Nolva/Arimidex, HCG and/or jabs for the rest of my life.
I don’t mind the idea of jabs if needed but certainly not till I’m done having children which is likely a decade away at least.

A restart can work but there is no cure - hcg does not restart your natural system hcg is HPTA supressive. SERMS like clomid and nolvadex can help, then there are other compounds like triptorelin which some people have had success with - an italian doctor brought a bodybuilder with 20+ years of steroid use HPTA back online with it. Theres also Enclomiphene which is clomid without the estrogen side effects at 12.5mg ED I had T levels in the 700s half life is 11 hours so you’ll need to dose daily and its an option for longterm treatment the company is still waiting on FDA approval but you can find it by googling research chemicals enclomiphene. Look up Christopher Walker he claims to have restarted his endocrine system and has 1,000+ ng/dl natural T levels (keyword:claims)

Mike12 covered what I was thinking of. Enclomiphene I don’t know how hard it is to get a doctor to treat you with this you might have to do it on your own.

I hear you on wanting a cure. We’d love that but
in your case you have to deside which is more important high T lvls with no sperm production that would be TRT. Trying Enclomiphene or Clomid to boost T and sperm count.

We still don’t know if you are primary or secondary. All these recommendations assume your ball still work and can produce sperm 1st and T second. You don’t need high T to make babies.
If you really want babies in your future you might have to look into sperm freezing once you know you have a good production. That means stay the F away from TRT even with HCG.
Just my opinion, I am no doctor I don’t even try to play one on the internet.

Thx - i’ll Wait and see what the doc says once I have my results back. … Clomid is a temporary fix though right ? Levels drop after cessation?

I do think my levels may rise naturally (or with SERMS) with time. It’s happened 4-5 times with finasteride before and the few cycles I’ve done. The difference this time is I’ve bloods with show low T. There’s definitely a upward trajectory with less symptoms over time at the moment.

Yes and the side effects vary so don’t let that scare you away. If it turns out your pituitary gland is acting up there are even more drugs to signal your balls to do their job. I hope you will report back what the doc and blood test says.

So last time my test was 5.5 in a range of 8-30. This time it came back as 11.2 in a range of 8-30 again. Everything else also seemed ‘normal’ in the ranges checked by the doc and he basically just sent me home.

I told him 11 isn’t exactly normal if the range is 8-30 given I’m 25yo. He didn’t really respond to that comment.

The blood test does go along with my change in mood which is somewhat improved from the time it was 5.5 to the time it was 11. However, I by no means feel normal and my libido is still not great.

Given the doctor doesn’t really care - do you guys think I could benefit from a PCT of clomid/arimidex?

Just as a quick add-on, LSH/FH were both in range but on the low end.

If I do a PCT style Clomid and arimidex/nolvadex blast, will it have any long-term benefits on my T levels, or will it just elevate them during and shortly after use?

I’d like to find a long-term resolution to how I feel because this isn’t too fun.

The answer to that is it might or might not. If you previously had really good levels, but some event caused a HPTA crash, then a restart might occur (although they are not always successful). If you just have low levels genetically, it will probably go down as soon as you stop.

I’ll also say, a lot of people are scared of the injections at first. Once they increase their levels though, they look forward to them.

With that said, be careful if you want children. If you do TRT you can almost always regain fertility (if it was present before TRT). However, getting it back can be a miserable process.

Here is some info on recovery of fertility in men who don’t produce sperm due to AAS. I believe something like 97% were able to become fertile after a 6 month period.

Thanks - I think I’m going to wait a month and retest with another GP as this guy was awful who I met today. If the situation hasent improved … I’ll bring up the discussion to increase my testosterone.