Getting Bigger

[quote]george79 wrote:
Guys, i am grateful for your interest and replies and my apologies to softballhead for having hijacked the thread a bit.

You can take my word that it took 6 years of training for my bench to hit 180. The first time i lifted i couldn’t even bench the bar. I weighed 115lbs at that time. Now, at 164lbs, i’ve started training for strength using Christian Thibaudeau’s Pendulum Powerlifting. [/quote]

How tall are you? When you claim to have been gaining “nothing but fat” in the past from eating more, was this determined through body fat tests or some judgement call you were making? How old are you? What is you average daily intake like? You ahve to realize that those are probably the weakest gains I have ever seen someone claim, especially if they are claiming to have been training SERIOUSLY for more than half a decade.

disc hoss, isnt that the same program pavel published in muscle media a long time ago

nevermind disc hoss, i just read it in your post. I think its an awsome program as well. but I would include some chins,

Yeah, this is Pavel’s baby. I like also using a cycle with pulls as you suggested and substituting dips for bench press. When doing this, one should add a few sets of back squats to keep the lower body going well. For the hardgainer, getting the most bang for the buck and keeping the catabolic hormones in check via abbreviated training that stimulates the max testosterone is absolutely essential. It used to be common place to see the advice of gaining in the core of the body and then once a substantial amount of progress was made, then hitting the detail work of delts, arms, calves, neck etc… In fact C. Thibaudeau used this philosophy indirectly as he focused on power lifts and Oly lifts for years until he decided to compete. It was this foundation that allowed him to achieve rapid progress in the “show” muscles. You’ve got to pay some dues. Systematically. And without diet, you can kiss it goodbye before it ever shows up.

Disc Hoss

Do what Disc Hoss said…

This is pretty close to idiot-proof; you WILL grow…

I also think it’s important to consider, as has been suggested, eating a larger bulk of your calories in the post-workout window. Often, people labeled ‘hardgainers’ don’t assimilate nutrients efficiently…put the food away when it will go to use…i’d say aim to eat at least 60% of your daily calories in your post workout shake and the two or three meals that should follow ON THE HOUR…

Best of luck

[quote]Ramo wrote:
Do what Disc Hoss said…

This is pretty close to idiot-proof; you WILL grow…

I also think it’s important to consider, as has been suggested, eating a larger bulk of your calories in the post-workout window. Often, people labeled ‘hardgainers’ don’t assimilate nutrients efficiently…put the food away when it will go to use…i’d say aim to eat at least 60% of your daily calories in your post workout shake and the two or three meals that should follow ON THE HOUR…

Best of luck[/quote]

I am reluctant to believe many people who claim to be “hardgainers”. Statistically, there should be about as many true “hardgainers” as there are people who can reach the Olympia stage. The bulk of the population will fall somewhere in between. If, like the other poster stated, they are only eating just over 3,000 cals a day and claiming “hardgainer” status, they are jumping the gun. I couldn’t have gained a pound in high school only eating 3,000cals a day.

6 years to bench 185! Dude, give up. Go run marathons or something.

Ramo, Chong Li would whip Tong Po’s ass anyday :slight_smile: Still a pretty cool avatar, though…

On a more serious note:
“I am reluctant to believe many people who claim to be “hardgainers”. Statistically, there should be about as many true “hardgainers” as there are people who can reach the Olympia stage. The bulk of the population will fall somewhere in between. If, like the other poster stated, they are only eating just over 3,000 cals a day and claiming “hardgainer” status, they are jumping the gun. I couldn’t have gained a pound in high school only eating 3,000cals a day”

Word to all the moms out there. “Hardgainer” is a term that was adopted by someone who was afraid of eating more than was required because he/she was scared of “getting fat”. Eat more than your BMR and stress the muscles to the point where they are FORCED to rebuild, and you will gain LBM. Laws of thermodynamics, simple as that.

CC, tong po may be a badass, but he couldn’t touch a ninja…those guys are totally sweet…they flip out ALL the time!

[quote]Ramo wrote:
CC, tong po may be a badass, but he couldn’t touch a ninja…those guys are totally sweet…they flip out ALL the time![/quote]

. . . without even thinking twice about it!

softball i hope u never have to start garfing down 5000kcal/day bc thats just gross. i agree diet is important, but be careful before blindly increasing calories to rectify your issue. Instead:
-make sure you’re getting plenty of sleep
-make sure to time your meals well
-technique and intensity during workouts i think is paramount; with proper technique u can fatigue a muscle fibre in a fraction of the time
-lastly, i dont agree with consuming 2g of protein/lb of bodyweight; whether or not you believe the research out there on impact of varying amounts of protein on hypertrophy, i would start off at 1.8g/kg of bodyweight (if you really believe you’re a hardgainer); actually long distance runners need far more protein than do bodybuilders since the former break down muscle for gluconeogenesis

anyway i dont usually post so just my 2 cents

[quote]pvg wrote:
softball i hope u never have to start garfing down 5000kcal/day bc thats just gross. i agree diet is important, but be careful before blindly increasing calories to rectify your issue. Instead:
-make sure you’re getting plenty of sleep
-make sure to time your meals well
-technique and intensity during workouts i think is paramount; with proper technique u can fatigue a muscle fibre in a fraction of the time
-lastly, i dont agree with consuming 2g of protein/lb of bodyweight; whether or not you believe the research out there on impact of varying amounts of protein on hypertrophy, i would start off at 1.8g/kg of bodyweight (if you really believe you’re a hardgainer); actually long distance runners need far more protein than do bodybuilders since the former break down muscle for gluconeogenesis

anyway i dont usually post so just my 2 cents[/quote]

Yes, 4 months wasn’t quite late enough to respond. Beyond that, 5,000cals a day is “gross”? Goodness, I don’t want to shock with the amount of calories I normally eat because you may begin to vomit uncontrollably. That truly makes me wonder how much progress you are making if 5k cals a day strikes you as something everyone should avoid.