T Nation

Gains Off Cycle

I made a similar post on another forum, but the mindset is definitely different there…most of the guys never come off to begin with.

  1. When you come off cycle do you find that you lose gains (if so, how much), are able to maintain, or actually keep gaining?

  2. Do you believe that getting significantly past your natural genetic potential with AAS will allow you to hold onto more muscle naturally if you come completely off? For example if you could naturally get to 210lb at 10% bf and with AAS you get to 240lb at 10% bf maybe if you go completely off you can now hold 225lb at 10% bf.

  3. Do you think that with proper cycling and PCT its necessarily true that your baseline T levels will get lower with every cycle? I’ve heard differing opinions on this.

I assume that if you hadn’t even hit your natural genetic potential yet, say 200lb at 10%, then even if coming completely off you’d be able to still make gains eventually, after the possible initial post cycle drop off. Thoughts?

  1. You can do, but if you train smart and eat properly then you should keep 90%. A lot of the weight you lose can be water weight (depending on the cycle) so the scale isn’t necessarily the best indicator of how much you’ve kept.

  2. Possibly. Impossible to say really but certainly sounds plausible. The problem with that question is you probably have no idea what your genetic potential is in the first place, so how can you be sure you’ve surpassed it?

  3. No. It is not true; it does not definitely happen. However, it is a risk you take every time you cycle.

How do you expect to keep gains after your remove an exogenous hormone from your body that produced them in the first place. Over time you will lose all your gains if you dont cycle again as the body maintains homeostasis.

*all gains that are beyond your genetic potential that is

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

  1. You can do, but if you train smart and eat properly then you should keep 90%. A lot of the weight you lose can be water weight (depending on the cycle) so the scale isn’t necessarily the best indicator of how much you’ve kept.

  2. Possibly. Impossible to say really but certainly sounds plausible. The problem with that question is you probably have no idea what your genetic potential is in the first place, so how can you be sure you’ve surpassed it?

  3. No. It is not true; it does not definitely happen. However, it is a risk you take every time you cycle.[/quote]

I dont entirely agree with point 1 here. Although your training and diet play a role once you come off, I feel the question of keeping gains rests with the recovery of your HPTA. The longer it takes for your test levels to come up, the more you will lose.

SB

[quote]Decinator wrote:
How do you expect to keep gains after your remove an exogenous hormone from your body that produced them in the first place. Over time you will lose all your gains if you dont cycle again as the body maintains homeostasis. [/quote]

[quote]Decinator wrote:
*all gains that are beyond your genetic potential that is [/quote]

So basically in your opinion if eventually going completely off you’ll just have reached your genetic potential faster

[quote]Singhbuilder wrote:

[quote]rds63799 wrote:

  1. You can do, but if you train smart and eat properly then you should keep 90%. A lot of the weight you lose can be water weight (depending on the cycle) so the scale isn’t necessarily the best indicator of how much you’ve kept.

  2. Possibly. Impossible to say really but certainly sounds plausible. The problem with that question is you probably have no idea what your genetic potential is in the first place, so how can you be sure you’ve surpassed it?

  3. No. It is not true; it does not definitely happen. However, it is a risk you take every time you cycle.[/quote]

I dont entirely agree with point 1 here. Although your training and diet play a role once you come off, I feel the question of keeping gains rests with the recovery of your HPTA. The longer it takes for your test levels to come up, the more you will lose.

SB[/quote]

yeah I’ll accept that the longer it takes to recover the more gains you’ll lose. I suppose some people shut down harder than others.