T Nation

Gaining 10kg

I’d like to bulk up and so I’ve set myself a goal of gaining 10 kilograms. How long should I aim for when trying to gain 10kg? 1,2,3,4 months?

Right now I’m pretty thin. I stand at 181cm/6 feet and weigh a pathetic 60kg/132 pounds.

I’m a big newbie and so far this is my training program:

SUNDAY: REST

MONDAY:
Lateral Deltoids - Upright rows, cruxifix raises.
Posterior Deltoids - Bent over lateral raise
Trapezius - Shrugs
Pecs - Bench press
Biceps - Concentration curl, Curls

TUESDAY:
Triceps - Kickbacks, extensions
Anterior Deltoid - Shoulder press
Abs - Crunches, Vertical leg crunch, Hello Dollies, Oblique crunches

And I alternate those days.

I also have begun using FitDay.com to track my eating patterns.

I’m not sure what I should be eating more to bulk up though. Carbs?

Any advice would be appreciated.

First off work the legs.

Second, since your a beginner use compound exercises.

Squats, Rows, Presses, Deadlifts.

Eat protein and carbs(lots of protein and carbs).

Diet
Protein and veg at every meal. While bulking make up your extra calories with oatmeal, sweet potatoe, brown rice, etc. Eat lot of good fats.

Training
3 full body workouts a week focusing on the big 4 that John gave you. Use progressively heavier weights with good form. Get as strong as you can.

Stu

[quote]John S. wrote: What every new beginner needs to know.
[/quote]

Eat fats too. It’s easier to eat lots of healthy fats than it is to eat healthy carbs. Cheaper too. (olive oil, eggs and such)

Thanks guys.

What foods are high in carbs and protein, especially vegetables?

vegetables have almost nothing when it comes to carbs and protein.

and the only food that i know thats high in both carbs and protein is peanuts and such, but they are also high in fat.

now high in protein are pretty much most any meat, make sure they are clean though(dont get burgers from mc donalds, those are not meat hahaha, you can also find burgers with bread stuffed in them to make them taste better). get CLEAN meat and then add whatever you want and should just to be sure.

and just google ‘chicken breast calories’ for example and you can find how much protein/fat they normally have.

as for carbs, rice, spaghetti, potatoes, oatmeal etc.

what i did personally was to google the foods i liked when i started to see what protein/carbs/fat they have. after that i adjusted and adjusted. dont worry about it too much, in the first month of your training you are gonna be mostly learning anyway

protein:
eggs
chicken
beef
whey
cottage cheese
tuna/fish.

Carbs:
oatmeal
yams
potatoes
fruit
bread
pasta

fat:
olive oil… any oil, really.
Flax/grapeseed oil
avocados
peanuts
bacon

Nutrition labels will give you more accurate information on the ratios of each macronutrient. Not sure what they’re like down under, but they’re pretty reliable here.

[quote]chrisa1002 wrote:
Thanks guys.

What foods are high in carbs and protein, especially vegetables?[/quote]

Look at www.whfoods.com for all the details.

Vegetables are mostly carbs and are high in nutrients. They are usually low in calories so it’s had to gain weight if you eat too many. Try to get a decent amount and eat sweet potatoes (yams), oatmeal and brown rice for your extra calories.

It’s hard to get much protein from vegetables. Some vegetarians feel they can but really it’s meat, fish and eggs.

Thanks guys.

I have another question. Since I’m going for size, is it okay to train each muscle group 3 times a week or should I restrict it to 2?

I’ve done some reading and I can’t make my mind up.

Go for 3 times. Once you are no longer a beginner and recovery starts to slow make them heavy/light/medium.

From what I read you are trying to work out 6 days a week, that’s gonna be too much. Work out three days a week and put a squat or dead lift in every workout. That’ll be plenty to make you grow, that’s what I’m doing now and I’m pretty much always sore.

[quote]chrisa1002 wrote:
Thanks guys.

I have another question. Since I’m going for size, is it okay to train each muscle group 3 times a week or should I restrict it to 2?

I’ve done some reading and I can’t make my mind up.[/quote]

if you have time try and get an allergy test done, sometimes you have mild allergies to foods without knowing it.

I didn’t really notice until I cut it out of my diet, but milk gave me bad acne and upset my stomach slightly.

Oatmeal kept me lethargic and feeling shitty. Also spiked my insulin quite a bit and I noticed that my fat dropped a lot after I stopped eating it.

Good post. I have the same problem. Whenever I have trouble falling asleep, I’m tempted to have a bowl.

[quote]joburnet wrote:
From what I read you are trying to work out 6 days a week, that’s gonna be too much. Work out three days a week and put a squat or dead lift in every workout. That’ll be plenty to make you grow, that’s what I’m doing now and I’m pretty much always sore.[/quote]

My body recovers really quickly though. I work out one day and I barely feel any DOMS. Personally I don’t think it’s too much. Is there any disadvantages from working 6 days a week, 3 times a week on each muscle group?

it depends on how much of a hurry you are in,

at the beginner stage you probably wont see a huge difference in results from 3 - 6 day workouts.

i think 3 is fine, that way when you hit a wall and have to up your game to gain more, you can add workouts in.

also - granted your body may recover well due to your specific biology, but theres also the chance you arent pushing yourself enough.

it may seem like you are, but in my opinion a concentration curl doesnt compare to a chinup, and you have no big movements in your workout - which means less overall muscle recruitment, which means less for the body to repair.

put in those big movements and push yourself and im sure you will notice the pain (for the first few weeks at the very least)

Your routine is terrible. Sorry, but there you have it.
Doms or no Doms doesn’t indicate recovery.
Here’s a suggestion’ try this: Split bodypart into two groups,
A & B. Train each seperately.
e.g.
Training A:
Squat, 5 sets, 12/8/8/6/6 reps
Lunges (with DB or BB) 3 sets
SLDL (for hamstrings) 4 sets 12reps
Calf raise 4 sets 12-15reps
Ab crunch with weight 4 sets of 8-12

Training B:
Bent over row 5 sets, 12/8/8/6/6 reps
Bench press 5 sets, 12/8/8/6/6 reps
DB press, 4 sets 8-12 reps
Rear delt raise 3sets 12reps
DB Shrug 3 set 12-15reps.
Back raise (hypers) 3-4 sets of 8-12reps.
Face pulls 3-4 sets 12-15 reps.

Now you have lots of options;
#1
Mon: train A
Tue: train B
Wed: Rest
Thu: train A
Fri: train B
Sat: Rest
Sun: Rest

#2
Mon: train A
Tue: Rest
Wed: train B
Thu: Rest
Fri: train A
Sat: Rest
Sun: train B
Mon: Rest
Tue: train A
Wed: Rest
Thu: train B
Fri: Rest
Sat: train A
Sun: Rest

#3
Mon: train A
Tue: train B
Wed: Rest
Thu: Rest
Fri: train A
Sat: train B
Sun: Rest
Mon: Rest
Tue: train A
Wed: train B
Thu: Rest
Fri: Rest
Sat: train A
Sun: train B …you get the idea.

Variation on #1
Mon: train A
Tue: train B
Wed: Rest
Thu: train A
Fri: train B
Sat: Rest
Sun: train A
Mon: train B
Tue: Rest
Wed: train A
Thu: train B
Fri: Rest
Sat: train A
Sun: train B

Wich you choose will depend mainly on your recovery ability, days available to train and personality.
I’ve found the above style to be very flexible in times of uncertainty where work / family commitments mean training schedule must change. Just train A, then B when you get into the gym next.

I hope this gives you food for thought, and I’d really recommend you try it.
Best of luck.

[quote]chrisa1002 wrote:
Thanks guys.

What foods are high in carbs and protein, especially vegetables?[/quote]

You sound like a taller and skinnier version of me when I was starting :stuck_out_tongue:

Whole milk is your friend.

Make an effort to drink at least a half gallon, or if you are more of a hardgainer, which I suspect you are, at 60kg and 6 feet, try to drink a gallon per day.

2400 kcals in a gallon of whole milk :smiley:

As for training, I suggest something like this:

Days A

Squat 3x5
Bench Press 3x5
Deadlift 1x5

Days B

Squat 3x5
Press 3x5
Bent over Row 3x5 and Pull up 3x your max reps

If you can do power cleans then swap the rows and pull ups for

power clean 5x3

Keep one day of rest between each session, and add weight to all the lifts workout to workout.

Once you stall out on this then you can move to something more advanced.

[quote]chrisa1002 wrote:
I’d like to bulk up and so I’ve set myself a goal of gaining 10 kilograms. How long should I aim for when trying to gain 10kg? 1,2,3,4 months?

Right now I’m pretty thin. I stand at 181cm/6 feet and weigh a pathetic 60kg/132 pounds.

I’m a big newbie and so far this is my training program:

SUNDAY: REST

MONDAY:
Lateral Deltoids - Upright rows, cruxifix raises.
Posterior Deltoids - Bent over lateral raise
Trapezius - Shrugs
Pecs - Bench press
Biceps - Concentration curl, Curls

TUESDAY:
Triceps - Kickbacks, extensions
Anterior Deltoid - Shoulder press
Abs - Crunches, Vertical leg crunch, Hello Dollies, Oblique crunches

And I alternate those days.

I also have begun using FitDay.com to track my eating patterns.

I’m not sure what I should be eating more to bulk up though. Carbs?

Any advice would be appreciated.[/quote]

Hey man i used to be EXACTLY the way you were 6ft 130lbs and i was rlly fukin skinny. If i knew then what i knew now i would have done everything differently. First off i think you should do Westside for Skinny Bastards program, dont think that its only for skinny people, im about to do the program and im 6ft 185 (still skinny but not that bad) its taken me years to gain almost 60lbs but i think you can do it much faster if you eat correctly and A LOT and do a solid program that focuses on COMPOUND excersises. I have been an idiot for the past two years and i have just realized how compound excersises are the key to success.

[quote]chrisa1002 wrote:
I’m a big newbie and so far this is my training program:
SUNDAY: REST
MONDAY:
Lateral Deltoids - Upright rows, cruxifix raises.
Posterior Deltoids - Bent over lateral raise
Trapezius - Shrugs
Pecs - Bench press
Biceps - Concentration curl, Curls
TUESDAY:
Triceps - Kickbacks, extensions
Anterior Deltoid - Shoulder press
Abs - Crunches, Vertical leg crunch, Hello Dollies, Oblique crunches
And I alternate those days.

[/quote]

This routine is not condusive to increases in size and strength.

The problems with this routine is

  1. You did not mention the set/rep, rest, tempo, and rest variables
  2. There is little or no training to the Quads, hamstrings, lower back, and lats
  3. Most of the exercises listed will hit your shoulders in some way and will lead to significant injury
  4. The compound movements are under utilised.
  5. Tricep kickbacks, although some claims have been made for their worth they are virtually useless.

My advice find a good quality beginners weight lifting regime by a competent strength coach. I would recommend these programs Chad Waterburys (on this site)
1st Anti-Bodybuilding Hypertrophy I
2nd Anti-Bodybuilding Hypertrophy II
3rd Total Body Training

Whilst doing these research injury prevention, mobility, periodisation, corrective weightlifting programs.

BTW, fitday should be a great asset in discovering how much food your eating, also reading the massive eating series by John Beradi to see how much more food you require.

Long Live The Body Science

I agree, your program is atrocious for a beginner. I have done Rippetoe’s Program, which is a variant on Full Body Training. I have had good gains from it, as apposed to doing stuff like you did when I first started.
I have gained 20lb in the last 5 months, but the thing that made me grow the most was nutrition. There are two rules I stuck to: I stick to the ‘no more mister white guy’ rule. It means don’t eat anything white. Eat brown rice, brown bread, dark meat, dark fish, dark nuts, dark everything. Although there are a few exceptions, which you will find out later, it gets you in good habits. My second rule i stuck to was ‘Seefood’… you see the food, you eat the food. Being as light weight as you are, you need to “break the barrier”. You need to increase the amount of food you eat daily, daily, until you start to get a layer of fat on you. After that, you need to start adding 1 set onto 1 of you COMPOUND exercises every work out until you feel you are starting to not recover from your last session. Then find the balance. IF you follow PERFECTLY the ‘7 Habits of Highly Effective Nutritional Programs’ http://www.T-Nation.com/...ic.do?id=459493
AND Massive Eating: I, Caloric Needs
http://www.T-Nation.com/...ic.do?id=460331
Massive Eating: II, Meal Combinations and Individual Differences
http://www.T-Nation.com/...ic.do?id=460327 you can expect to gain about half to a whole pound of muscle per week.
Read articles from this site (especially Are You A Beginner? sticky thread) so you can start to build a base of knowledge on how the body responds to different things.
Good Luck, I know you can do this, it just takes effort and time. :wink:

Edit: you will probably find that what you need to eat daily is 3-4 times what you are eating right now. Yes it is a lot of hard work to train your body to eat that much, just spread it out throught your 8 meals and you will slowly get used to it.