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Friend/Roommate Advice

Alright, normally I wouldn’t condone these advice threads, but this matter is important to me and I want to gather info on what people think I should do. If anything, take this as a sign of respect that I want to know what my fellow T-Nation people think.

I rent a room from one of my best friends who bought a house a couple years ago. He and his girlfriend recently decided they were going to get married. The problem is that I don’t really care much for his fiance. It’s not so much that I think she’s a bad person or anything, I’ll explain.

This guy has only been in one other relationship in his life. It was with a real slutty girl who I hooked him up with (thinking he’d hit it and quit it or have a short fling, didn’t think he’d start full-fledged dating her) and they were together for a few months. If it matters, I can explain why it lasted as long as it did, but this is just to give some background into the very little amount of experience he has in relationships.

He met his current fiance about a year and a half ago. They went out and hit it off pretty well. About 3 months later, she had moved into the house and basically turned it into her personal storage facility (she has a LOT of stuff, pretty materialistic, but I won’t act like that’s not fairly common). About 6 months into the relationship, she began pressuring him into marrying her. She openly did it in front of me, just telling him over and over how much she wants to get married, having him watch wedding reality shows, things of that nature.

The problem I have is 1. it seems like he just hopped on the first girl who was willing to fuck him and be with him. He didn’t shop around at all or test the waters in the slightest (which I think is bad considering his lack of experience with women) and 2. it just seems like she pressures him into everything. It’s like their relationship revolves around what SHE wants to do and since he doesn’t know any better and is just happy to be in a relationship finally, he goes along with it.

Another tidbit that may be relevant… we got into an argument once a while back because she wasn’t feeling how “smug” I am and didn’t like how I try to give them/him relationship advice. The funny thing is that my friend is a lot more “smug” and stuck up about himself than I am (part of the reason we get along really well, we have that in common and tend to agree on a lot of things).

During that argument we got onto the topic of who has more experience in relationships between myself and her. This was because she wanted to validate not listening to me when I try to give him or both of them relationship advice.

She went on to say that she’s been in more relationships than I have(she’s my age, not quite a year older, my friend is a few years younger than I am), but she completely ignores the fact that 1. they were all failed relationships (which she said so herself at another point in the argument and makes me VERY curious) and 2. I have a Psych degree, which adds a significant level of validity to what I would have to say (she is a nurse).

She also mentioned that she doesn’t think it’s good to talk about past relationships with a current signficant other. She validated this by saying that that’s what her parents think and they’ve been married for a very long time, so it’s her policy not to go into details about previous relationships with her partners (which I think is stupid because I don’t think her parents had many relationships before they married each other, if any at all).

Personally, I think that’s her way of not letting my friend know that she’s been in a lot of failed relationships because she’s been dumped a lot for being a control freak who is always pressuring people into doing what she wants them to do.

He had basically 0 input during this argument. All he did was make sure that she understood the things I was saying. I didn’t have problems understanding what she said. She, however, is the type who will take things the wrong way if it is convenient for her to do so. Like say, if we’re arguing and she wants to make it look like I don’t know what I’m talking about, thank God he was still understanding what I was saying.

Part of me says just to keep my mouth shut and not say anything. I’m not going to say it’s impossible that I’m making a mountain out of a molehill here, but it doesn’t seem healthy to me and he’s not the type to ask people for advice, even when it comes to something he doesn’t know dick about like relationships.

So 2 questions: 1. do you think I should just sit back and let it play out the way it plays out? Am I overstepping my bounds here? or should I approach him about it? and 2. If I approach him about it, how should I go about doing it? He is currently out of town and I am picking him up from the airport on sunday. I’m thinking that’ll be a perfect time to have a heart to heart with him about this, if at all.

Let me know what you think if you’re still reading, sorry for the long post.

Let him get married

Then divorced

Then watch his life spiral out of control until he becomes Bill from King of the Hill…

He’s clearly just being your friend and trying to entertain you for a while with this relationship

Its like your very own interactive movie with a henpecked theme…saving silverman like

Just sit back and enjoy the show

Its what he wants you to do. Don’t be a selfish prick

You still got that other girls number? She arab? You know any arab chicks?

I think you should just let him find out things on his own. Nothing you say will change his mind about her. He needs to learn these things from his experiences with her.

I do agree, that bringing up past relationships is bad idea. I for one, don’t want to hear about all the other dudes the girl banged. The last thing i want to feel is being in competition with her previous boyfriends.

Get your own place now. Its only a matter of time before you get the boot.
Unless there is something particularly relevant about a past relationship…kids, ex is a psycho ala “So I Married an Axe Murderer”…it likely shouldn’t be talked about extensively with a current flame.

How well do you possibly think a conversation that at its base is I hate your fiancee and think she’s a control freak with a string of failed relationships, while you are a babe in the woods with no experience who she is using will go?

While I do think that just over one year is too short a time together to be getting married but:

  1. It is none of your business. People learn about relationships on there own for the most part and will almost never listen to anyone’s advice.

  2. If you are not married, and since you are living in your friend’s house I assume you are, then all your relationships have failed as well.

  3. Your psych degree doesn’t mean a damned thing when it comes to your knowledge of relationships. These things are learned through being in relationships and learning from experience, not in a classroom. If he was talking about marrying his mother or some shit like that, then your degree may be worth something, but it doesn’t take an advanced degree to know that that is crazy.

  4. If you do bring this up with your friend, start with “I am moving out of your house, but first…”

just because SAMA’s kaput doesn’t mean common courtesy is kaput as well…

How does their marriage affect you? And why are you getting in arguments with his female? If anything, your a guest in his house, you have no right to argue with his lady or even feel like you have a say in the matter. Because he (or she, as fiance now) will kick your ass out.

Stop feeling like you have a moral obligation to be in anyone’s business that’s not your own and find your own place. You’re trying to convince yourself that you’re being a good friend by acting like this, when on the contraire, you’ll be a good friend by supporting him in whatever he does.

[quote]Nikki9591 wrote:
How does their marriage affect you? And why are you getting in arguments with his female? If anything, your a guest in his house, you have no right to argue with his lady or even feel like you have a say in the matter. Because he (or she, as fiance now) will kick your ass out. Stop feeling like you have a moral obligation to be in anyone’s business that’s not your own and find your own place. You’re trying to convince yourself that you’re being a good friend by acting like this, when on the contraire, you’ll be a good friend by supporting him in whatever he does.[/quote]

QFT

This guy needs a roommate. http://tnation.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/music_movies_girls_life/housemate_with_tb

[quote]Ct. Rockula wrote:
Let him get married

Then divorced

Then watch his life spiral out of control until he becomes Bill from King of the Hill…

He’s clearly just being your friend and trying to entertain you for a while with this relationship

Its like your very own interactive movie with a henpecked theme…saving silverman like

Just sit back and enjoy the show

Its what he wants you to do. Don’t be a selfish prick

You still got that other girls number? She arab? You know any arab chicks?[/quote]

It’s funny cuz he does have the same bodytype as Bill.

I wish I was in with a group of Arab chicks…

I have a Psych degree, which adds a significant level of validity to what I would have to say

Don’t be that guy.

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
I think you should just let him find out things on his own. Nothing you say will change his mind about her. He needs to learn these things from his experiences with her.[/quote]

This is what I’ve been inclined to think this whole time.

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
I do agree, that bringing up past relationships is bad idea. I for one, don’t want to hear about all the other dudes the girl banged. The last thing i want to feel is being in competition with her previous boyfriends. [/quote]

Wouldn’t that be your own insecurities making you feel like you’re incompetition with them?

But I’m not saying that you should know every minute detail about previous relationships, especially their sex lives, it’s not about past sex-lives with other people. But at the same time I don’t think you should avoid or try to run from your past.

If someone loves you and wants to be with you, they have to accept all of you, which includes your past mistakes. How else can they truly understand how you got to the point you’re at now? That’s just as much a part of who someone is than anything else. At least that’s my opinion on that topic.

I think it takes special interest in this case, because it seems to me like she is actively hiding it from him because she doesn’t want him to see a trend that has happened in her past relationships, which would be guys getting tired of her being how she is with him now. And instead of fixing herself, she’s just looking for a pushover guy who will let her continue the abusive behavior because he doesn’t know any better.

That is just my take, I could be completely wrong about it and I acknowledge that. I’ll just say it’s what my instincts are telling me based on what I’ve seen from their interactions.

So you want your friend to be with more women before settling down, but at the same time you’re holding his fiance’s “failed” relationships against her by assuming that she’s driven away the men in her past. That seems inconsistent.

If she seems to genuinely like your friend and they get on well and she’s basically affectionate, bugger off.

Otherwise, have you considered writing a fable?

[quote]groo wrote:
Get your own place now. Its only a matter of time before you get the boot.
Unless there is something particularly relevant about a past relationship…kids, ex is a psycho ala “So I Married an Axe Murderer”…it likely shouldn’t be talked about extensively with a current flame.[/quote]

Oh ya, my first initial thought was “well, looks like I’ll be gettin a new place soon”.

I don’t think it should be talked about with a current flame, but if you’re getting ready to spend the rest of your life with this person then things like why the previous relationships didn’t work have a certain level of significance in my opinion. I’m not saying that it should be dwelled on, but if I’m getting ready to marry someone, I would be interested in knowing this stuff.

[quote]groo wrote:
How well do you possibly think a conversation that at its base is I hate your fiancee and think she’s a control freak with a string of failed relationships, while you are a babe in the woods with no experience who she is using will go?
[/quote]

The way he is, it probably wouldn’t get heated. He would hear my points and probably just not heed them. Obviously, I wouldn’t approach it with the words you used, but it would be the core of what I was saying, yes.

I do see what you’re saying, which is one of the reasons why I was skeptical about doing it in the first place. But he said himself when I was talking to him about talking or not talking to someone about something when I know it isn’t going to go anywhere that “hey, at least you can say you talked to them about it and tried”. So in this sense, I’m actually listening to his own advice he gave me. (it was something having to do with a mutual friend that is unrelated to this)

Put your Psych degree to work for yourself and understand that no matter how right you may be, you are going to lose this argument, you are going to lose your friend, and you are kind of acting like a dick.

First of all, you need to move out. It’s already become an uncomfortable environment for everyone, and if they are going to get married at some point, you are out anyway.

Secondly, why do you keep going off about “failed relationships” when EVERY relationship ultimately fails, except for those occasions when you end up in wedded bliss forever. Relationship advice is generally bogus because anyone with lots of relationship experience has a lot of failed relationships, and anyone in one successful/loving/forever/all-timesy relationship isn’t going to be getting any more experience out on the market.

It’s also generally bad form to discuss the details of past relationships with your current significant other (unless she transmitted a disease he needs to know about). You won’t talk about all the girls you’ve fucked with your next girlfriend, either. Unless you’re an asshole.

You may be very, very right about this girl’s control-freakishness and your buddy’s spinelessness, but they will never listen to you. If you want to stay his friend, be supportive of him and accept that his love life is none of your business. If you don’t want to be his friend anymore, have your “heart-to-heart” with him until he finally gets up the nerve to tell you to fuck off (or he simply becomes quietly passive aggressive toward you) and keep dissing the supposed love of his life.

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
While I do think that just over one year is too short a time together to be getting married but:

  1. It is none of your business. People learn about relationships on there own for the most part and will almost never listen to anyone’s advice.[/quote]

Ya, you’re right, I can’t bring myself to say I disagree with any of this.

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
2. If you are not married, and since you are living in your friend’s house I assume you are, then all your relationships have failed as well. [/quote]

Yes they have. However, my last relationship failed because of factors that were not directly related to our relationship itself. My ex was the citizen of another country and her and her mother came into money problems and had to move back. We even kept it going long-distance for another couple years, but eventually the inevitable happened. Had that not happened, we most likely would have been married and living together for quite a while by now.

Also, his fiance has been in several relationships, I’ve been in 3. This means that, yes, she has more experience in one way, but in a comparable time frame she has been through more than twice as many as I have (I don’t know her exact number, nor do I want to, but it is between 7 and 9 from what I understand). I had one that was significantly longer than any she has ever had, by far. Not to say that this is the ultimate indicator of me knowing more than her, but I do think that that adds more weight to my experience as opposed to hers. If I can be with someone for multiple years while she can’t keep a guy longer than a year or so, then that DOES mean something in my opinion.

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
3. Your psych degree doesn’t mean a damned thing when it comes to your knowledge of relationships. These things are learned through being in relationships and learning from experience, not in a classroom. If he was talking about marrying his mother or some shit like that, then your degree may be worth something, but it doesn’t take an advanced degree to know that that is crazy.[/quote]

By no means do I think that it qualifies me as the ultimate authority, or to be a marriage counselor, I will give you that much all day. However, a psych degree does shed light on a lot of topics related with relationships so I disagree that it literally doesn’t mean a damned thing. It certainly gives me more knowledge on the topic than a degree in nursing, that’s for sure. So adding it all up, at the very least we would have a comparable knowledge of the subject to each other, which would make her out of line to tell me that I don’t know what I’m talking about. If YOU or someone who has a considerable amount more experience than I do wanted to tell me that, there’s not shit I could really tell YOU. But not her or anyone else in her or my position. Again, this is all my opinion. I don’t profess to have all the answers, but I will describe the way I see it from what I’ve learned so far in my life.

[quote]Dr.Matt581 wrote:
4. If you do bring this up with your friend, start with “I am moving out of your house, but first…”[/quote]

I probably won’t, but I will let him know about the moving out part sooner or later.

Also, because I forgot to say this already, thank to everyone who is responding and telling me their thoughts. I appreciate all the food for thought.

You are on a loosing streak here. Quit while still you have your shirt on your back.

You’re renting. GTFO.

As you get older you’ll realize it’s completely useless to take on the problems of others as your own.

Do what you gotta do and be ready for a boomerang in 5-10 yrs when you might let him live in YOUR house after everything collapses.

[quote]TDub301 wrote:

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
I think you should just let him find out things on his own. Nothing you say will change his mind about her. He needs to learn these things from his experiences with her.[/quote]

This is what I’ve been inclined to think this whole time.

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
I do agree, that bringing up past relationships is bad idea. I for one, don’t want to hear about all the other dudes the girl banged. The last thing i want to feel is being in competition with her previous boyfriends. [/quote]

Wouldn’t that be your own insecurities making you feel like you’re incompetition with them?
[/quote]

Holy shit! Did you just call RV insecure? You know he is kind of a big deal around here, he has posted pictures of himself and everything.

Don’t give relationship advice. It’s not for you to do. They will do what they want. What makes you think you have answers that they don’t. You’re barely more than a child yourself.

Move out and get your own place.

Your psych degree is meaningless in this context and if you ever hope to get laid again, don’t, for god’s sake say shit like “I have a Psych degree, which adds a significant level of validity to what I would have to say”. Anyone worth being with will smother you in your sleep.

Finally, being smug is not a good thing. See above regarding getting smothered.

[quote]Nikki9591 wrote:
How does their marriage affect you? And why are you getting in arguments with his female? If anything, your a guest in his house, you have no right to argue with his lady or even feel like you have a say in the matter. Because he (or she, as fiance now) will kick your ass out.
[/quote]

It affects me in that I want what’s best for my friend. In that way only. Well, I will have to move out sooner than expected as well, but that really has nothing to do with it. Frankly, I’ve been tired of having a room mate at all and was already making plans to move out as soon as I could either way.

People who live together get into arguments. That is going to happen unless you’re a complete recluse and never come out. Since he is one of my best friends, I come out and hang out with him all the time. And we’re not getting into argumentS, we got into A argument. It was actually an attempt for the 2 of us to work out our differences, which we did to a certain extent.

This was because she was with my friend and I did want to have a good repoire with her. For the most part, we get along fine. I hold my tongue a percentage of the time when she’s around for that to happen. There isn’t really any kind of awkwardness around the house or anything, at least not that I’ve noticed. He’s not the type to let that go on, if there were, he’d talk to me about it.

And I’m not a guest. I pay rent. He arranged for me to move in as he was making arrangements to buy the house. I’ve put a considerable amount of money towards his mortgage since I’ve lived there. This doesn’t qualify me as a guest, I’m a tenant, if you want to look at it in those terms. Not the same thing.

[quote]Nikki9591 wrote:
Stop feeling like you have a moral obligation to be in anyone’s business that’s not your own and find your own place. You’re trying to convince yourself that you’re being a good friend by acting like this, when on the contraire, you’ll be a good friend by supporting him in whatever he does.[/quote]

Acting like what? Asking what I should do? I was already leaning towards just keeping my mouth shut and it was on my mind so I thought I’d see what you guys think. Everyone is pretty much being consistant with what I was expecting to hear, so no surprises there. I’m not trying to convince myself of anything, really, just taking one more step to make sure I’m doing what I should do for my friend.

I may have painted a picture that I’m always at wit’s end with his fiance and we’re always getting into arguments. That’s not how it is. We got into that argument a good 9 or 10 months ago now. I mean, we may get into debates about insignificant stuff here and there, but none of that ever gets serious and if it does start, we both just drop it and move on.

We have all done lots of stuff together since then. Gone out to parties, movies, and for drinks, etc. We’re not at each other’s throat or anything like that, if that’s what you were thinking. Yes, I have opinions of her, yes I don’t think she’s right for him, but I’m not going around the house blurting all that out and making things uncomfortable or anything. I’ve kept these thoughts to myself.