T Nation

Frank Mir on Brock Lesner

I’ve got “PIZZA” muscles. wanna see a pic of them?

[quote]heavythrower wrote:
I’ve got “PIZZA” muscles. wanna see a pic of them?[/quote]

haha

great username backday, but your avatar frightens me.

Damn. I don’t check out this forum for a week and the moron factor has gone up like 100%.

[quote]Donut62 wrote:
Grappling muscles, eh? I missed have missed those in my anatomy textbook. [/quote]

Lol, they’re above the kickboxeris majora…

[quote]FightingIrish26 wrote:
Go back to middle school junior. Go develop your brain instead of those grappling muscles.
[/quote]

I didn’t wanna quote its whole length, so I just got the end cap. But the whole post got me laughing.
FightingIrish = 0-60 in 4 seconds flat. Maybe I just haven’t seen the angry posts but you normally seem chilled out. This was hilarious. No mercy.
Sorry, I’m in a laughing mood today. Seriously though, if people think muscles are bad, they’re on the wrong website.

[quote]No-Gi wrote:
Donut62 wrote:
Grappling muscles, eh? I missed have missed those in my anatomy textbook.

Lol, they’re above the kickboxeris majora…

FightingIrish26 wrote:
Go back to middle school junior. Go develop your brain instead of those grappling muscles.

I didn’t wanna quote its whole length, so I just got the end cap. But the whole post got me laughing.
FightingIrish = 0-60 in 4 seconds flat. Maybe I just haven’t seen the angry posts but you normally seem chilled out. This was hilarious. No mercy.
Sorry, I’m in a laughing mood today. Seriously though, if people think muscles are bad, they’re on the wrong website.[/quote]

Haha.

Oh you lads should’ve seen me when I was more into the Politics forum.

You’d already know how I get.

First of all, get off that fucking limey speak “Stone” garbage. Give it in pounds or not at all.

First of all I am English not a limey… and stones is the weight of choice…

[b]GRAPPLING MUSCLES?

Tell me wise one, are those different than striking muscles? Are you born with grappling muscles? Can I buy them? Is it genetic? Can you tell “grappling muscles” apart from “striking muscles” or from “bodybuilding muscles?” [/b]

Is that sarcasm? I’m not sure…

Your entire arguement is that the problems are entirely technqiue based and nothing else…

But then you post

However, a wrestler, a boxer, and a JJ guy all need roughly (note ROUGHLY) the same type of workouts because they are timed combat sports.

So the workouts ARE different - which is the point that I was actually trying to make.

You argument was Muscle is muscle and muscle is good but then acknowledge that

A fighter needs massive anaerobic capacity, explosive strength, and good maximal strength. A marathon runner needs none of these.

So the training goals are different. I know this was an extreme example of differing training goals but we are talking MMA professionals here (not College kids who have only ever trained one thing) where small swings towards one discipline can impact noticeably on the other.

So why is that? Why when someone goes and focus’s on their weaker technique areas does their stronger areas (as percieved) sometimes suffer…?

NB: Why do you feel the need to resort to insults to make your posts better?

[quote]mt006 wrote:
First of all, get off that fucking limey speak “Stone” garbage. Give it in pounds or not at all.

First of all I am English not a limey
[/quote]

Well no one’s perfect. Either way, pounds.

Fuckin spare me. My argument is legitamate. You still have yet to tell me what the fuck a “Grappling muscle” is and how that differs from any other type of muscle.

And if you’re not sure if that’s sarcasm or not, you need to excercise your reading comprehension muscles more.

Different from what? A marathon runner? What are you saying?

What? That has nothing to do with anything. I said what a fighter needs. All kinds of fighters use all kinds of programs, so I still have no idea where you’re going with this.

I think you need to exercise your debating muscles more, they’re not as strong as your grappling muscles.

What are you talking about? How does their stronger area suffer? Is Matt Hughes a weaker wrestler than he was before because he learned how to strike a little?

Would Tyson be a worse boxer because he learned some submission holds?

No. It’s ingrained for three quarters of their lives to fight a certain way, and that’s how they’re predominantly going to fight.

Your argument has no continuity, and is as unsound as one can get.

Because I don’t respect people that bring bullshit old training dogma to this forum and purvey it. And I swear alot. So if you don’t like it, I got a phrase for you, and it sure ain’t “God save the queen.”

I get my grappling muscles from doing combat pyramids but alas they are now too big and my hand speed is no longer incredible. The carnival punching machines are now safe.

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
I get my grappling muscles from doing combat pyramids but alas they are now too big and my hand speed is no longer incredible. The carnival punching machines are now safe.[/quote]

ROFLMAO

[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:
I get my grappling muscles from doing combat pyramids but alas they are now too big and my hand speed is no longer incredible. The carnival punching machines are now safe.[/quote]

YES. i amde a reference to that in the “your fight story” after teh op in there posted his tall tale. Nobody noticed it, and I was afraid I was the only one around here who remembered it anymore.

This post was flagged by the community and is temporarily hidden.

Anyway…I agree with Mir that Lesnar really has a shot to be a top level guy if he just works on a few things. Sometimes I wonder what the deal with some wrestler is. I mean if I was a great wrestler, which I’m not, and I could take anyone down anytime, which Lesnar pretty much can, I’d spend 16 hrs a day working on top game jiu-jitsu (8 sleeping; meals would be on the mat, ha) so I could finish fights with quick submissions.

If Lesnar’s sub defense from top and sub offense from top was technically great, he would be nearly unbeatable. Now, I understand he’s just started so we’ll see. But I’ve always wondered that about guys like Sherk. He’s a hard fella to keep from taking you down. Or even Couture…he can get your ass down too. Yet they rarely finish with a sub from top.

Sure ground-n-pound is great, but why the effort. Couple punches, see opening, finish. Someone with Lesnar’s power, if coupled with good technique, would be a freakin’ moster to stop from tapping you at will.

[quote]Scrotus wrote:
Maybe it is more that they think they can get away with shitty form because they are so strong, or they can still hit hard with shitty technique so they dont really try to work on it and put effort into having high level striking technique. Iron Mike Tyson was, or still is I guess, pretty stout (5’10" 220, and lean) and it didnt seem to negatively affect his striking ability.
[/quote]

This doesnt come off as muscles slow you down does it? I was trying to say it was probably his striking technique, and I provided an example of someone that was fairly muscular, lightning fast(in his prime at least) and could hit really hard.

Im pretty sure Lesnar is half-bull or something.

Bicep mass can effect the natural speed a boxer has IMO.

[quote]Scrotus wrote:
Scrotus wrote:
Maybe it is more that they think they can get away with shitty form because they are so strong, or they can still hit hard with shitty technique so they dont really try to work on it and put effort into having high level striking technique. Iron Mike Tyson was, or still is I guess, pretty stout (5’10" 220, and lean) and it didnt seem to negatively affect his striking ability.

This doesnt come off as muscles slow you down does it? I was trying to say it was probably his striking technique, and I provided an example of someone that was fairly muscular, lightning fast(in his prime at least) and could hit really hard.

Im pretty sure Lesnar is half-bull or something. [/quote]

Still Mike once upon a time had great technique. So I don’t think he is a very good example. Sam Peter is probably a better example,a guy that has never had very good technique for a pro boxer but has alot of power.

If you take up striking late it is hard to become great at it. In general I think this is true. Also if you compare skill relative to someone else who started as a kid the gap looks much bigger.

There have been guys who have started boxing late. Jameel McCline and Michael Grant. Very big, strong athletic guys. Both were 6’7" and over 250 in shape. Even training for a decade in only boxing they has issues.

And you could really see the gap when they fought guys at the higher level who started young and had extensive amateur experience. It would be hard for a wrestler to start his striking training as an adult and have him train for mma and expect him to be become a great striker.

fightin irish are you fuck irish lol
limey speak piss off