T Nation

Four Washington State Police Officers Gunned Down

[quote]Mufasa wrote:
Ding-dong, the perp is dead…

The cops found him driving a stolen car and smoked his ass…

Mufasa[/quote]

And justice is served.

Hope they got the right guy.

Court adjourned.

Right guy, wrong guy, does it matter? One less criminal on the streets. If it is the wrong guy, we just go out and hunt down the real one again. No big loss really. The only loss were the lives of the Officers.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Hope they got the right guy.[/quote]

It was him, he had a gun from one of the cops he killed on him.

I am for less cops. While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.

Unfortunately, this incident will probably be used to propagandize the need for more cops when in reality what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
“what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.” = “Play with fire and get burned”[/quote]

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
“what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.” = “Play with fire and get burned”

[/quote]
So then what is the optimal level of cops vs. armed citizens?

I would like to see “Wild West” levels of gun owners vs. police. There was a lot less crime committed then.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
“what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.” = “Play with fire and get burned”

So then what is the optimal level of cops vs. armed citizens?

I would like to see “Wild West” levels of gun owners vs. police. There was a lot less crime committed then.[/quote]

It’s not simply a matter of cop-to-armed citizens ratios. We will never have “enough” cops no matter what…BUT having less is not optimal,imo. I think less cops would by default result in more aggressive and invasive tactics…OR it could make them more aware and better trained…OR both. Lots of ways to look at having less law enforcement.

As for the citizens standpoint,JD430 referenced a good point about nature of people and having more of them armed. If our government gave us a free-ride on carrying guns,there most likely would be a longer list of “do’s and dont’s” than what is already attached to CCW/open-carry laws.

You mention the “Wild West” and crime…but overlook what was acceptable back then. There was no “political correctness.” What constitutes as crime today wasn’t the same back then.

Kind of strange line of thought from you with your known opinions of law enforcement/military. Regardless,this a good discussion to have.

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
I am for less cops. While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.

[/quote]

I’ve seen you say this before and shake my head every time. I tried to reconcile it with your philosophical bent but it just doesn’t hold up.

If it is what you truly believe, it betrays you as a sick and twisted person. In that case, you wouldn’t even be capable of beginning to understand why such “logic” is horribly warped, and no one should waste their time trying to explain.

sounds like a quintuple win for society

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
I am for less cops. While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.

Unfortunately, this incident will probably be used to propagandize the need for more cops when in reality what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.[/quote]

Damn I agree with you , should I lobotomize myself?

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
I am for less cops. While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.

Unfortunately, this incident will probably be used to propagandize the need for more cops when in reality what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.

Damn I agree with you , should I lobotomize myself? [/quote]

What part do you agree with? All of it? If so I think I may go lobotomize myself as well.

V

It’s been awhile gents. Law school is keeping me entirely too busy, but this is pretty big news up in my neck of the woods so I figure I’d add my two cents.

Everyone knows I’m not a big fan of cops, but this sure as hell is no way for them to go out. Their death was sad and unneccesary. But I’ve several observations come from it. I’m not going to jump into the hero worship bit, but I find their death sad in a way that anyone’s would be. You go way too far Lifty.

1: Why is the death of a cop worse than that of a citizen in the news? Particularly in an instance such as this, I’d put them at pretty much the same footing.

2: After the murder of these cops I’m watching the video of the area. Why do you need SWAT vans with officers hanging off it and guys in Multicam with sniper rifles? This was one guy with a pistol. I understand cordoning off the area, but this seems like a good bit of overkill.

This situation is particularly alarming to me. Are we desensitizing our populace to the militarization of the police? Are there a bunch of guys sitting around waiting for something to do? What gives? My personal presumption (and that’s all it is) is that as soon as you get something sexy, everyone and their grandma is looking to get to the scene in the hopes they can see some action. I’m sympathetic to the feeling, but duty above all guys.

Then again, if it is necessary, kudos to them. Watching that I’m glad I’m not a SWAT officer. I’d hate to sit around all day knowing damn well that there’s no good reason for it.

3: Can we teach our cops to be a little more professional and safety minded with their weapons? I’m sick of watching guys swinging their AR’s around carrying them by their pistol grips. Hell, if I saw some hillbilly doing that at the range I’d ask him to either unfuck himself or I’d get the hell away from the unsafe bastard.

4: How dangerous is being a cop? I’m not one and I’m not trying to be disrespecful. Yet they mentioned on the news that Spokane, which is a shithole I’d never go into unarmed, last had a cop killed there on duty 33 years ago. We lost a good cop in my area a few years back in the line of duty, but he was the only guy in 110 years here to die that way. I’ve heard many cops on this board talk about doing what they do because of how dangerous the job is and how they just want to make it home at night. Granted this is a generally low crime area and it doesn’t take into account a cop getting a broken jaw or something but still. It seems to me that being a cop is a good deal safer than being a 100-lb girl.

Either way, it’s an unfortunate event. I’d love a smaller police force, but this isn’t the way to do it. I won’t revel in their deaths. Anyshit, back to lawsmithing.

I love (read: hate) how people can have 1 or 2 bad experiences with police officers (where, in all likelihood, they were acting out of line in the first place) and all of the sudden they think all cops are horrible people and are now calling this a “win” for society.

Consider Belligerent - so far we know he was drunk driving doing doughnuts in a parking lot and got pulled over and also got a citation for jerking off in his mother’s car while being high (both true stories, btw). Somehow, in that tiny little brain of his, he has construed the cops actions of giving him a citation or whatever they did to be wrong. Now he hates all cops and considers these police shootings to be a “win” for society.

I’m honestly clueless about how that can happen.

[quote]Mikeyali wrote:

4: How dangerous is being a cop? I’m not one and I’m not trying to be disrespecful. Yet they mentioned on the news that Spokane, which is a shithole I’d never go into unarmed, last had a cop killed there on duty 33 years ago. We lost a good cop in my area a few years back in the line of duty, but he was the only guy in 110 years here to die that way. I’ve heard many cops on this board talk about doing what they do because of how dangerous the job is and how they just want to make it home at night. Granted this is a generally low crime area and it doesn’t take into account a cop getting a broken jaw or something but still. It seems to me that being a cop is a good deal safer than being a 100-lb girl.

Either way, it’s an unfortunate event. I’d love a smaller police force, but this isn’t the way to do it. I won’t revel in their deaths. Anyshit, back to lawsmithing.[/quote]

Here in Philadelphia we’ve had 5 officers die in the line of duty over the past 2 years. That doesn’t count all of the injuries that occur from the fights these guys get in on almost a daily basis.

I assure you, being a police officer is very dangerous relative to other careers, depending where at, of course.

[quote]belligerent wrote:
sounds like a quintuple win for society[/quote]

Really? You think it’s good thing that these men were killed?

[quote]Vegita wrote:
pittbulll wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
I am for less cops. While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.

Unfortunately, this incident will probably be used to propagandize the need for more cops when in reality what is really needed is less cops and more heavily armed people.

Damn I agree with you , should I lobotomize myself?

What part do you agree with? All of it? If so I think I may go lobotomize myself as well.

V[/quote]

All of it, DAMN

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
I love (read: hate) how people can have 1 or 2 bad experiences with police officers (where, in all likelihood, they were acting out of line in the first place) and all of the sudden they think all cops are horrible people and are now calling this a “win” for society.

Consider Belligerent - so far we know he was drunk driving doing doughnuts in a parking lot and got pulled over and also got a citation for jerking off in his mother’s car while being high. Somehow, in that tiny little brain of his, he has construed the cops actions of giving him a citation or whatever they did to be wrong. Now he hates all cops and considers these police shootings to be a “win” for society.

I’m honestly clueless about how that can happen.

[/quote]

How about walking across a parking lot, I know it terrible

[quote]LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:
While I don’t like violence I do not weep their death. Play with fire and get burned.
[/quote]

You’re talking about 4 police officers gunned down in cold blood like all they lost was a game of hot potato. Are you really that much of an ass?