Let me address a few e-mails/PM “issues”:
Even though I’d like to meet them someday…I don’t personally know Chris, TC OR Tim…and they don’t know me…and what’s the point anyway?
I don’t get a DAMN thing free from the guys…and don’t want to. They are running a buisness that I just happen to support…
Any more conspiracies that I may have forgotten?
Unbelivable…
Mufasa
By the way…
My sweet little Grandmother is a greeter at Wal-Mart…so WATCH WHAT YOU SAY, DAMMITT!!!
Here is what I think should be done.
heavier moderation in the actual article sections. If an author pisses you off, start a new thread.
somewhere they need to clearly spell out rules for posting. Give a few examples so that people are clear with what is acceptable. If changes are made they need to be transparent or at least open to debate.
Get a better search engine! A large amount of flames are due to people asking advice about something that has already been covered before. If the search engine was better I think the intelligence level would vastly improve. Honestly there should be alot less posts than there are.
Mufasa: I won’t get into the whole argument of free speech “zones.” But suffice it to say, if there is ANY place that ought to be considered a free speech “zone,” it is someone’s residence. Unless, of course, you mean that it is TC’s residence, and we’re guests, etc. I don’t think anyone is making a Constitutional argument however; very few people believe they have a “right” to free speech on what is, essentially, a privately owned and operated forum. Freedom of the press doesn’t mean that you’re free to use someone else’s press.
I agree that there should be some stricter moderation of actual articles. If you want to attack the theories, etc, then start a separate thread.
That said, I think what many people are upset about (and I have been on occasion) is the moderation of some questions/comments regarding the supplements sold here. That has recently lightened up QUITE a bit, and you do see people (see the recent Spike thread) who can say “eh, it doesn’t work for me.” Which, of course, makes me that much more inclined to buy the product when I see the positive reviews; I know that I’m actually seeing a representative sample of users.
I’m very used to open BBS style forums, I have to admit, and I like the almost chat-room like environment when you make a post and can see it instantly appear. I wonder if T-Nation couldn’t try allowing instant posting on a section of lesser importance (such as the Get A Life forum) and moderate after posting? If it failed, at least we’d all see what the fuss was all about, without making the whole site unbearable.
[quote]Soco wrote:
3) Get a better search engine! A large amount of flames are due to people asking advice about something that has already been covered before. If the search engine was better I think the intelligence level would vastly improve. Honestly there should be alot less posts than there are.
[/quote]
Amen to that… I’ve always felt the search engine sucks here… no booleans, no exact phrases, no “must have ALL or NONE of the following.” I offered five years ago to help code up a new search engine, gratis (I have a resume’ and qualifications), but never received a response. But anyway, the search engine leaves much to be desired, and I think we’d cut quite a few threads out if it were improved.
Btw, the sort by authors feature is nice… you did a good job with that.
nephorm:
WE are the “guest” and/or customers…
An instant posting Forum has been tried…but I’d better let Chris or TC explain what an absolute disaster THAT was. (Woof, woof!!!)
I post on an “Instant Posting” Bodybuilding Site (which is actually one of the most popular on the Bodybuilding scene)…
Guess what happened? The owner has been unable to realize what was perhaps his primary Goal…to have the Pro’s freely interacting with the members…
The flames and criticism became, and are, so bad, that a Pro rarely post there at all…
Mufasa
I have had more than my share of posts withheld. With that said, there has only been one or two times that I have disagreed with the decision of the staff. On both occasions, they were more than willing to explain the problem they had with my posts.
On the subject of a better search engine - I agree. The search capabilities are pretty bad. when I do a search here, I just google the subject and add ‘T-Nation’.
All in all, the mods here do a heck of a job. If you think the flames are bad here, go to some of the other BB sites that are unmoderated, or are moderated after the fact.
I have made T-Nation my homepage - if they would just add e-mail accounts, I would never have to leave. I bet you mods would love that, wouldn’t you? Having me here ALL the time.
By the way Mod-Max - I think you owe me a tub of Grow!, I kept the C.P. secret.
Without being privey to exactly what the Moderation “Rules” are on this site…I would be willing to bet they are pretty simple…
Beyond the obvious (advertising, spam, hardcore porn, trolling, etc.)…I would bet that if you just followed “The Golden Rule” (i.e. “Do unto others…”) you would be just fine…
Or if you asked the question:
“If I had a Website, and this was my livelyhood…would I want this to be posted about me and/or my products?”
(P.S. In my years of posting here, by the way…I have had post that were not allowed…But guess what?
They shouldn’t have been allowed…)
Mufasa
[quote]rainjack wrote:
I have made T-Nation my homepage - if they would just add e-mail accounts, I would never have to leave. I bet you mods would love that, wouldn’t you? Having me here ALL the time.
By the way Mod-Max - I think you owe me a tub of Grow!, I kept the C.P. secret.
[/quote]
rainjack here all the time…oh, please say it ain’t so! That would be cruel and unusual punishment for us moderators.
Nah, just funning with you rainjack. We’d love to have you here all the time.
With all the free speech talk being bantered about, I got to thinking: Isn’t free speech in the Constitution to keep the government from taking away your ability to speak out against them? Since this is Testosterone mag’s and Biotest’s website, they would have the right to not allow anything they want to.
I just want to jump in real quick and add that if you do in fact have a post deleted, don’t fret, it doesn’t mean that you’re in trouble or danger of being banned, name removed from contests, or even given a second thought in most cases.
As Chris pointed out in his recent posts on this subject in the Think Tank Dialogues, it?s hard for us to define a clear cut set of permanent rules. Read over Chris’s posts, and when in doubt Mufasa had a great point with his “Do unto others” comment. After that if you’re still not sure, go ahead and feel free to submit it, without fear, since in the end that?s what we?re here for is to read through and decide on posts. If it does get deleted, don’t be concerned, but don’t get overly angry either.
If it’s deleted you’ll likely receive a PM from one of us as to why, and If not, check at the bottom of the page to see what mods are online and drop us a PM if you want to discuss the post further, but in the end none of us is going to get dragged into dozen+ PM argument with you regarding the decision.
Important note to remember in the end is that the mods don’t make the rules, we’re just doing our job by enforcing them.
Now, on the other hand, if you have a dozen posts a day deleted then that’s another story.
T-Mod
T-Mod
I still think that a better search engine would save you guys alot of reading. There are plenty of times I have looked for information and ended up starting a thread just to get an answer. I would then get flamed for not doing my research when in reality that was the first step I took.
[quote]Mufasa wrote:
nephorm:
2) An instant posting Forum has been tried…but I’d better let Chris or TC explain what an absolute disaster THAT was. (Woof, woof!!!)
[/quote]
I was there, I remember. I was one of the participants… and the problem was LACK of participation, not objectionable content.
I very much agree with Mufasa’s statements. We all here are guests - and it is the Mod’s right to make sure we behave.
Whenever I tell someone I am discussing politics in a BB forum, people give me a look of disbelief; not many can grasp the fact that most of these discussions are more or less civilised, albeit often heated. And that is (I guess) thanks to good moderation.
Thanks for that.
Makkun
[quote]nephorm wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
nephorm:
2) An instant posting Forum has been tried…but I’d better let Chris or TC explain what an absolute disaster THAT was. (Woof, woof!!!)
I was there, I remember. I was one of the participants… and the problem was LACK of participation, not objectionable content.[/quote]
This was largely your own fault. As memory serves, you guys wouldn’t let in any new members. I watched the forum for over a year, and remember you guys letting 2 additional members into the Pound.
I was just wondering if the forum moderators actually moderate each others’ posts? What would happen if one of the mods for some reason decided to post something really stupid? Would another mod delete it?
Years ago when this site just had a “reader mail” section, I wrote several e-mails and almost always had them posted. That made a good impression on me at the time and I have no reason to complain about how the site is run now. I too have had a potential post deleted but I think the mods are as fair as they need to be.
I don’t really have enough information to know for sure…
But I think that the “Dog Pound” created many problems that were unrelated to actual participation…
Moderated Forums have their problems for sure…
But “Instant Posting” Forums are wrought with a whole lot more (in my opinion…)
Mufasa
People are throwing this “Constitution” word around… Is that valid here? What does this mean to a Canadian such as myself?
I was under the impression that this was not the United States of America, nor was it Canada. This is T-Nation.
Gentlepeople, moderate away; without it, all is lost.
-FC
FC:
A lot of people will throw around the Constitution and “Free Speech” in order to justify being a total and absolute jerk…
Mufasa
Nice sentiments guys, I of all people have had my share of posts deleted, but like T-mod said, I always got a PM letting me know that it was a tad (or more) over the line. The mods here are flat out professional, friendly people. I don’t think i’d want to see what this place would turn into without mods, it would probably crash and burn in very little time. Then I wouldn’t get any cheap, really good supps and I’d be one cranky dude. I do have to agree with wideguy on the spooning bit, come on guys, just a little love?
Vegita brings up a point I TOTALLY overlooked…
The Mods here are VERY professional and friendly…and quite frankly, I don’t know how they put up with some of the crap they most likely have to deal with…
Mufasa